PSX Doom/Final Doom TC (Legacy TC, See first post for details)

[unknownna]

lafoxxx said:

Sndtest sounds pretty similar for now.

Do you think that we should include the new sound behavior in the main TC?

lafoxxx said:

it's probably hardcoded difference.

I think you're right. Do they appear too frequently when you attack monsters with the chaingun in the TC compared to the PSX version? If not, I think we should just let it be.

lafoxxx said:

Crusher speed is now too slow - on map WORMHOLE, "present world"'s crusher now sounds like "future world"'s one. Twice slower, for short.

Alright, try PSXDOOM_SNDTEST3.PK3. Here, the crusher speed is lowered by 1 instead of 2.

[fenderc01]

lafoxxx said:

Didn't found latest GZ on the off.site, sorry

http://www.osnanet.de/c.oelckers/gzdoom/download/

[lafoxxx]

Checked out SNDTEST3. Still sounds like 2x slower

[unknownna]

lafoxxx said:

Checked out SNDTEST3. Still sounds like 2x slower

I checked out Elbryan42's YouTube video and can tell you that the PSX TC is too slow to begin with, so we shouldn't lower the crusher speed, but raise it instead.

You can hear the first crusher speed at 4:08.
The second one kicks in at 4:31.

In PSXDOOM_SNDTEST4.PK3, I raised the crusher speed by 6 and raised one of the ceilings by 4. If this isn't right, I'll let somebody else take care of this issue.

And you still didn't answer my question: Do you think that we should include the new sound behavior in the main TC? It's important to know.

[lafoxxx]

Sounds correct now. Can it be done without editing the map but just by tweaking crusher speed instead? (just to keep the maps untouched) IMO, editing the map should be the last thing, only if tweaking wouldn't help.

I think that the sound behaviour patch should be included in the main pk3, of course. Just like any improvement that gets the TC closer to the console version

Sorry, I'll not be able to test the TC until 24th of August, but I'll try to follow the topic.

[ScottGray]

nice work Unknownna, To me the Wormhole bang noises sound identical to the PSX.
I like the new sound behaviour, it defintly feels diffrent, I recon it should go into the TC.

[unknownna]

PSXDOOM_UPDATE_12.PK3 (also includes the fixes from PSXDOOM_UPDATE_11.PK3)

• Fixed: I accidentally set a wrong damage formula for the PSXShotgunGuy actor when I created the PSX sound behavior.
  
• Fixed: The PSXArachnotron could play its see sound twice if it entered its pain state after defeating a monster.
  
• Fixed: The crusher sounds in MAP76 were too slow.
  
• Emulated the PSX/Doom64 sound behavior by allowing multiple sounds to be played for monsters/players/weapons.
  
• Removed all the limits of most sounds (SNDINFO).
  
• Lowered the volume of the following sounds: PSXPistol, PSXChaingun, PSXPlasmaBall, PSXZombieMan, PSXChaingunGuy, all monster pain sounds
  
• PSXHellKnight and PSXBaronOfHell now use the damage formula of the Jaguar version since a trace of the formula could be seen in Doom64 (minimum damage: 11).

lafoxxx said:

IMO, editing the map should be the last thing, only if tweaking wouldn't help.

I set the speed values through ACS in PSXDOOM_UPDATE_12.PK3. I had to re-tag one of the sectors in order to use 2 separate speed values. I agree that we shouldn't edit the map geometry.

lafoxxx said:

I think that the sound behaviour patch should be included in the main pk3, of course. Just like any improvement that gets the TC closer to the console version.

OK, good.

lafoxxx said:

Sorry, I'll not be able to test the TC until 24th of August, but I'll try to follow the topic.

No problem. Take care.

ScottGray said:

I like the new sound behaviour, it defintly feels diffrent, I recon it should go into the TC.

Since Lafoxxx and you both wish to use the new sound behavior, we should use it in the main TC.

[unknownna]

PSXDOOM_UPDATE_13.PK3 (also includes the fixes from PSXDOOM_UPDATE_12.PK3)

• Fixed: The PSXTeleportFog wasn't translucent. It now uses additive translucency with an alpha value of 0.99.
  
• Fixed: One of the PSXChaingun flash frames didn't use A_Light2.
  
• Fixed: The translucent windows in MAP09 were too translucent.

I wonder whether or not the PSXBulletPuff actor is supposed to use additive translucency.

[byblo]

unknownna said:
I wonder whether or not the PSXBulletPuff actor is supposed to use additive translucency. [/B]

Yes it does. But i need to reinstall my old psx on my tv if you need the proper alpha value. (on TC, I tried with alpha 0.5, seemed fine)

BTW, following the lafoxxx post, I removed the 'Bright' attributes to keep the muzzleflash like the original psx version (instead of this... http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/192/screenshotdoom201208111.png), but the rocket launcher seems to behave differently?

Are you guys planning to remove or to keep those 'bright' attribute for the weapons ?

[lafoxxx]

Looks better w/o "BRIGHT". Check the video out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81MmywK6daY

I don't remember any actors other than the spectres having any translucency

[unknownna]

PSXDOOM_UPDATE_14.PK3 (also includes the fixes from PSXDOOM_UPDATE_13.PK3)

• Fixed: The PSXBulletPuff wasn't translucent. It now uses additive translucency with an alpha value of 0.5.
  
• Fixed: The PSXSpectre didn't use additive translucency. It now uses additive translucency with an alpha value of 0.25.
  
• Fixed: The PSXSpiderMastermind used a wrong frame in its missile state.
  
• Fixed: The PSXSpiderMastermind played duplicate attack sounds.
  
• The PSXNightmareSpectre now inherits its properties from PSXDemon.
  
• Improved the CHGGB0/CHGFB0 sprite offsets.
  
• Edited the MISGA0 sprite and offset due to precision errors in the OpenGL renderer.
  
• Removed the limit of gib sounds (SNDINFO). The barrel and crush sounds are still limited since we don't have an output gain control like Doom64Ex has.

byblo said:

Yes it does. But i need to reinstall my old psx on my tv if you need the proper alpha value. (on TC, I tried with alpha 0.5, seemed fine)

Alright, I'm going to trust you on this one. Speaking of which, I think the invisibility (BlurSphere) effect is supposed to use additive translucency as well, but it seems that GZDoom 1.6.0 doesn't support additive translucency for Powerup.Mode.

byblo said:

Are you guys planning to remove or to keep those 'bright' attribute for the weapons ?

You can see in this YouTube video at 0:04 that the weapons used bright frames, so I'd say that we should keep them.

lafoxxx said:

I don't remember any actors other than the spectres having any translucency

You can see in this YouTube video at 0:21 that the teleport fog was translucent.

BTW: Did monsters forget about the player after infighting if the player woke them up before infighting?

[Mattfrie1]

unknownna said:

BTW: Did monsters forget about the player after infighting if the player woke them up before infighting?

It depends. If you just walked into their line of sight without firing off your weapon then they usually returned to their idle state. However, if you fired off a weapon, then they always come back to attack you once they kill the monster they were infighting with.

[byblo]

Hi :)

While comparing Doom's PSX (& PSX Final Doom) and TC version, I noticed some differences that id like to report here:


PSX: When player dies, he should restart from the level's beginning, no weapons (only pistol), no keys, no ammo, no armor.
TC: Last saved game is loaded after player died (with all his weapons, armor and ammos)


PSX (see video at end of post): Chainsaw and fists always shows '0' ammo in status bar.
TC: Ammo field is empty. The '0' is missing.


PSX (see video): Bullets puff are non bright and always colored by sector, except for 'PUFF A'.
Alpha is something around 0.9
TC: Alpha is 0.5, PUFF B and PUFF CD using bright attribute.
After messing with it for an hour, this should match the PSX version: In EXPLOSIVES.TXT->

Actor PSXBulletPuff : BulletPuff Replaces BulletPuff
{
	Scale 0.92
	RenderStyle Add
	Alpha 0.9
	VSpeed 0.4
	States
	{
	Spawn:
		PUFF A 4 Bright
		PUFF B 4
	Melee:
		PUFF CD 5
		Stop
	}
}

(psx version)
(tc new attributes)


PSX (see video):
- Muzzleflash is always colored by sector.
- Muzzleflash is NOT bright if sector contain a color value but no progressive lightning. (fading light)
- Muzzleflash is bright on other cases (sector without color value, sector with fading light and color value)
TC: Muzzleflash is always bright, and not colored in all cases.
(I hope it is possible to reproduce this muzzleflash's behavior in PSX TC. Without being colored, muzzleflash doesnt fell like playing the PSX version of doom)
(Muzzleflash is colored but NOT bright if sector contain a color value but no progressive lightning)
(Muzzleflash is bright and colored by a sector with fading light and color value)


TC: fading light is sometimes not matching PSX version (see first exit room on Doom II, fade speed it much faster in TC than PSX version.
Also, on PSX version, rocket launcher's secret room should fade from total darkness to full bright, which is not the case on TC version.


PSX:brightness around player
TC: nothing. It seems it can be activated using DOOM in 'Sector light mode' (gl_lightmode 2, see http://zdoom.org/wiki/OpenGL_preferences) But it seems buggy :(
(brightness around player using DOOM in 'Sector light mode'. It seems buggy: too dark... also, restart round or game and the effect is gone... edit: setting is reseted due of lightmode variable into the file ZMAPINFO.TXT. Nervermind)


PSX (see video): Player still can select weapon with empty ammos, then once trying to fire, the weapon is automatically switched to another one.
TC: weapons with no ammo can't be selected anymore.


TC: Clipping in fading light on exit room of map 1 (Ultimate Doom) Can be fixed setting variable gl_light_ambient to 1


PSX (see video): While firing, the dynamic lighting around the player is clearly visible
TC: The lighning is barely noticeable


Video: ePSXe_2012_08_31_04_55_33_199b.XviD.mp3_[CE36A5DA].avi: http://www10.zippyshare.com/v/14406609/file.html

[scalliano]

Most of what you've posted are due to limitations in (G)ZDoom rather than outright inaccuracies. For example, (G)ZDoom's autosave is on by default. This can be disabled in the options, but forcing it off is only going to piss off players in the long run.

Whichever way the muzzleflash is set up in the TC, it's going to be wrong. There's no practical way of dynamically toggling the fullbright.

If you're using nextweapon/prevweapon controls, (G)ZDoom will skip any weapons that are empty. PSX Doom doesn't have any weapon hotkeys, so ...

Also, setting gl_light_ambient to 1 will make the game almost completely pitch-dark and unplayable. PSX Doom has its own renderer which has been optimized for TV's, which is also why the TC doesn't feature the "overbright" effect that the original game has.

The only thing you've posted that can be changed is the bulletpuff. And for the record, PSX Doom has no "dynamic lighting".

[byblo]

scalliano said:
Most of what you've posted are due to limitations in (G)ZDoom rather than outright inaccuracies. For example, (G)ZDoom's autosave is on by default. This can be disabled in the options, but forcing it off is only going to piss off players in the long run.

Yes, my first step was simply to notify some of the differences between original and TC version, regardless the way to fix them, if possible or not :)

About the autosave feature, I suggest we disable it by default (player still can save his game when he wants to), until someone request to the (g)zdoom author (http://forum.drdteam.org/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=5848) the ability to disable the autoload feature when a player die. I'm a bit astonished that it was not possible already.

Knowing you will lose all your items and weapons when dying was part of the PSX gameplay (the game is already easier since we can play it in the PC)

scalliano said:
Whichever way the muzzleflash is set up in the TC, it's going to be wrong. There's no practical way of dynamically toggling the fullbright.

Unfortunately. But again, maybe we can request such feature to the gzdoom author. Currently, even if its more a matter of taste than anything else, I vote to remove those bright attributes to weapons. Playing with colored muzzleflashes really recreate the psx doom ambiance. (the loss of muzzleflash's bright is barely noticeable, except in some very dark places like for instance in Club Doom's first room)

scalliano said:
Also, setting gl_light_ambient to 1 will make the game almost completely pitch-dark and unplayable. PSX Doom has its own renderer which has been optimized for TV's, which is also why the TC doesn't feature the "overbright" effect that the original game has.

Im not sure to understand. By default, gl_light_ambient is set to 20. Lowering to 1 shows few difference. It just fixes the problem i reported on my previous post.

scalliano said:And for the record, PSX Doom has no "dynamic lighting".

By "dynamic lighting" (I don't have technical vocabulary, sry), I meant the increase of brightness around the player when he shoot. It is present in psx and tc, but in tc, it is barely noticeable. Maybe this can be fixed too.

edit:The saddest thing is that bright attribute for weapons works properly in zdoom. Even the brightness around player is there:

Something got lost in gzdoom :s

[Doom_user]

byblo said:

PSX (see video): Player still can select weapon with empty ammos, then once trying to fire, the weapon is automatically switched to another one.
TC: weapons with no ammo can't be selected anymore.

Add

+dmflags2 16777216

to the command line to restore the ability to select weapons that are out of ammo.

[byblo]

Doom_user said:

Add

+dmflags2 16777216

to the command line to restore the ability to select weapons that are out of ammo.

Thank you :)
(can also use the variable: sv_dontcheckammo true)

Curiously, the empty weapons still not switching when rotating weapons.

[unknownna]

PSXDOOM_UPDATE_15.PK3 (also includes the fixes from PSXDOOM_UPDATE_14.PK3)

• Included Byblo's PSXBulletPuff fix. Furthermore, the PSXBulletPuff_SargAttack doesn't use bright frames anymore.
  
• An ammo value is now displayed on the HUD when using the fist or chainsaw.

[scalliano]

byblo said:

Knowing you will lose all your items and weapons when dying was part of the PSX gameplay (the game is already easier since we can play it in the PC)

Not quite. Pressing Start then Select upon death allowed you to load up the password, so this is a moot point.

As for the brightness around the player, it's much less defined in GL mode, but if you look closely, it IS there. This is a limitation with hardware rendering which is why it's more accurate in ZDoom.

And as for engine feature requests, good luck with that :P

[fenderc01]

Just a few things...
PSXDOOM.CFG can be eliminated from the install or the creation of PSXDOOM.CFG through PSXDOOM.BAT. There's no need to include both.
The Williams video cuts off a little early.
The font for Options>Advanced>"Player Setup" is colored incorrectly.

[Dragonsbrethren]

unknownna said:

PSXDOOM_UPDATE_15.PK3 (also includes the fixes from PSXDOOM_UPDATE_14.PK3)

• Included Byblo's PSXBulletPuff fix. Furthermore, the PSXBulletPuff_SargAttack doesn't use bright frames anymore.
  
• An ammo value is now displayed on the HUD when using the fist or chainsaw.

Getting an error in GZDoom 1.6.0:

Script error, "psxdoom.pk3:lockdefs.txt" line 47:
Unknown item 'GLRedCard'

Edit: Nevermind, looks like I just had an outdated version of the TC. It's been a while since I downloaded it last.

[byblo]

scalliano said:Not quite. Pressing Start then Select upon death allowed you to load up the password, so this is a moot point.

Damn 90' magazines ! None of them told me about it.

[fenderc01]

It's been a while since there's been an update. Do you guys think it's time to move out of beta?

[Dragonsbrethren]

Funnily enough, I was thinking about bumping this and making the exact same post. I think it's ready to go myself, and I'd like a finalized filename (it is still going to be psxdoom.pk3?) since I've been getting the urge to do a PSX-style map add-on.

[fenderc01]

Dragonsbrethren said:

I'd like a finalized filename (it is still going to be psxdoom.pk3?)

PSXDOOM.PK3 and PSXDOOMMUS.PK3 sound good to me.

[BlueFireZ88]

Are both the original PS1 levels going to be combined with the FD levels? It would make sense since they use the same base resources and menu.

[ScottGray]

Am with you guys PSXDOOM.PK3 and PSXDOOMMUS.PK3.

Anyone else find the multiplayer unstable?

[Mattfrie1]

I'll change the thread title once the finalized version is released.

EDIT: I gave the first post a much needed updating. It now includes the download links (from ScottGray's post), and looks more professional IMO. I figured it would be better looking for anybody who happens to come across this thread via a Google search or whatever. I also updated the credits to include myself as Project Coordinator.

[ScottGray]

Williams video mod to try and fix the early cutoff.
http://www.mediafire.com/?ci7xiagkr7zvjhw
fenderc, do you think the timings any better on this one?

[fenderc01]

ScottGray said:

Williams video mod to try and fix the early cutoff.
http://www.mediafire.com/?ci7xiagkr7zvjhw
fenderc, do you think the timings any better on this one?

Excellent!

Here is something else that should be of interest to the project:
http://doom64ex.sourceforge.net/forum/index.php?topic=356.0