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Rambosee

Tough monster placement

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Whenever you are mapping, and decide that you need a cyberdemon somewhere in the map, or a spider mastermind. How far will you put them ahead? Will you let others take a peek at it at the very start? Will you make it an end trap?

Typically, if I was to use one, I would do this. After some progression, at about 1/4 of the map, I'd build a small area with a platform big enough to squeeze in one of the bosses. I'd also add a monster teleport in a square fashion around the platform. When the player walks across a line, a boss teleports inside the platform. Then the boss immideatly teleports back to another area. It will be basically a peek-a-boo scenario. Then I would eventually place him back onto an area 3/4 into the map, probably near a key. This works pretty damn well.

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I don't see that as being necessary because the boss noise would have sounded in order for the teleport to work, so the player would be aware of it from that.

I personally don't really care about trying to be psychological with the player. A tough situation I've created might make the player go "oh shit" but I'm not trying to get that response out of them.

EDIT: @darkreaver: In Boom, yes. I made the assumption of vanilla as that's all I work with. :p

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Khorus said:

I don't see that as being necessary because the boss noise would have sounded in order for the teleport to work, so the player would be aware of it from that.


Conveyor belts

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Why the teleport-in? Have the cybie/spidey already on the platform to begin with. When the player spots them, they walk forward and teleport out.

Cool idea for sure. :)

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Xaser said:

Why the teleport-in? Have the cybie/spidey already on the platform to begin with. When the player spots them, they walk forward and teleport out.

Cool idea for sure. :)

The teleport in gives a much bigger surprise. Would you rather have a cyberdemon teleport in and out right in your face or a cyberdemon that doesn't leave that much of a shock? The point is to simply scare the player, and I find that already on platform thing a bit over used sometimes.

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You can also hide it in a hollow column that insta-lowers to reveal the cyberdemon.

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Since I don't place cybs or masterminds as much as other monsters I am a lot more careful about the surrounding area the player will be fighting the monster in. Whereas you can throw imps, HKs, even to a degree revs into almost any layout without being detrimental to gameplay, I feel the appearance of a mastermind or cyb should be part of a specially created set-piece.

Regarding your peek-a-boo Cyb. I obviously know about the map you mean. The first time it peeked and blasted me to Hell instantly.

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I don't make special exceptions for cyberdemons or masterminds. To me, it's monsters to use, period. Creating very specific rules for yourself can also limit creativity without necessarily bringing that much added value.

That said, I try to make encounters generally fair in the way they're presented to the player. No instaraising floors, especially not in situations where the player is likely to run forward and get scratched before he can see the monster. No monsters suddenly showing up in your back while you're busy fighting something tough. No ambush with enemies from every direction. No player start with monsters already awake and facing the player. Basically, no instadeath traps, and the tougher the fight the more contextual clues (be it texture/light/architectural changes or even ominous powerup and ammo placement).

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Processingcontrol said:

Would it be possible to teleport a cybie without waking it by blowing up a shitload of barrels next to it with a crusher, pushing it across the teleport line?


It might not work, because they're immune to the splash damage, but you can do it with other monsters, though it can be difficult to get some of the monsters pushed even 1 unit without damaging it to the point it needs just 1 bullet to die. I found the best solution is to put the barrels so far that the monster is just at the edge of the explosions, but the amount of explosions will trigger a massive push.. and the monster should only need to move 1 unit to teleport.

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Processingcontrol said:

Would it be possible to teleport a cybie without waking it by blowing up a shitload of barrels next to it with a crusher, pushing it across the teleport line?

Use a scrolling floor or make it where the player shoots and then the Cyberdemon will walk over the teleport line.

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jdagenet said:

Use a scrolling floor or make it where the player shoots and then the Cyberdemon will walk over the teleport line.

I though that if barrels were used instead of getting the cybie to walk over the teleport line it would be alerted when it sees you in its new position. But now I realize that it would be alerted right when it teleports in because of the way monsters are woken up in Doom. Also I was thinking of in vanilla so no scrolling floors. :)

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Processingcontrol said:

I though that if barrels were used instead of getting the cybie to walk over the teleport line it would be alerted when it sees you in its new position. But now I realize that it would be alerted right when it teleports in because of the way monsters are woken up in Doom. Also I was thinking of in vanilla so no scrolling floors. :)

Oh, you want it to silently spawn in the map without the vicious roar it lets out correct? And thats right, no scrolling floors in vanilla ;)

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You could just make a sector (of where you want the monster to teleport), lower it by 200+ (it doesn't matter as long as the monster is out of sight), put the cyberdemon (or other monsters) in it, and tag it with the linedef action 19- Lower to highest floor. When the person triggers the line, the cyberdemon will appear instantly, very much like being teleported using scrolling floors. The only downside is the mechanical noise it makes, but it's nothing, really.

I use it frequently, it's like my favourite linedef action ever.

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