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dobu gabu maru

The DWmegawad Club Plays: CC4 (Starting JENESIS Oct. 1st!)

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Map 29 - Spiritual Holocaust
Hard, relentless, brooding atmosphere. Horrible traps and set pieces galore. The final fight killed me lots of times, monsters come at you from everywhere and put you in situations where it's hard for you to win, despite the often lack of number of monsters.
This map had me raging, but frankly the difficulty wasn't too unfair and frankly this is a great map and a worthy map29.
Nuff said really. Map30 made by joshy, oh crap I guess this is going to bring a lot of pain :P

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@cannonball - Yeah, I know CC4's Map30's nowhere near certain other Map30 finales, but it's still quite a bit harder than the Map30 final levels of the other three CC megawads. (Of which, my least favorite was CC2's Map30, particularly with the three IOS spawners at once.)

Edit: Now that it's 2:01 AM over here, I'll finally get that last map outta the way.

Map30: I admit I knew that it wasn't gonna be a straight run to the boss. However, this map was nowhere near as tough as Map29, this map certainly beats out the other three CC Map30 finales as mentioned earlier. Also, the Icon of Sin having two different sides at least changed up the weak spot to damage the boss. Also, the cybos in the boss area was also quite problematic. All in all, this map might not have had the epic final levels the two Scythe megawads had (or Speed of Doom's incredibly difficult IOS finale for that matter), but this final map was a great way to end CC4.

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I am to finish up CC4 no later than this weekend. Just 3 maps to go (5 if you count the secret levels, but I don't)

Any thoughts on what to do next? I think maybe something a bit smaller / less intense might make it easier for people to keep up (and give them time to catch up on CC4, if they're behind)

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How about one of the IWADs from time to time to break it up a bit? I understand there's quite a few who have never finished the original games. Maybe we could do a Doom 1 episode say 3 levels at a time over 3 days as a kind of intermission.

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Having played the IWADs, if the club plays those, I'd pretty much just speedrun through them.

Edit: By played them, I meant I played even the original Doom to death before, so I know how the levels work. (TNT Evilution may still take a while with a certain few levels, though.)

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I personally don't mind what we play, I shall leave the decision to the people in charge, it was discussed a few pages back.

dobugabumaru said:

It depends what most people want to play next. We could try and aim for playing through a new release, play an older megawad, or even play something small. Personally I’ve wanted to give Cannonball’s Sparta a try, and since it’s only a few maps, it shouldn’t be too bad. The big releases in the following months that I know about are TNT2, Interception, Prog fic, and Panophobia, and I think it’d be cool if we gave each of them a go. But it's up to everyone else. I figure we'll be open to suggestions once we're officially done with CC4, which is the 16th IIRC.


Of course if a certain wad out of these is chosen then of course I can't exactly give my thoughts haha. Though I would be up for playing a wad which is a little different, like BF_THUDish but could be from any year. Something which hasn't been played to death.
On cc4 note I shall take on map30 tomorrow

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I brought it up because we are no "officially" up to the end date of CC4, even if almost no-one has actually finished it, yet :)

Given that this is the megawad club, I'm inclined to say it should only be for WADs that comprise at least an episode (9 levels in Doom, either 6 or 11 in Doom 2, depending on whether you consider episode 1 to end before Dead Simple, or after Circle of Death), and that it should be PWADs only.

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Map 30
Ah this was quite slaughter like in places, but a lot of fun. Only found one secret which probably made things harder than it should have been. A worthy level to end the wad.
Also if megawad/episode is the way to go, we could do Mr T's Coffee break, it's 11 really good levels.

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Did some skipping around and playing through at my own pace. Also posting to encourage others to share thoughts no matter where their progress is at.

Map 31
pistol start on HMP, died to revenant rocket

I think this map could be vanilla compatible being as compact as it is. I find it neat how passages open up as the player progresses and that the revenant swarm also takes advantage of the opened passageways.

There's very little unique I have to comment on this map so I'll leave a single hint. Although it is possible to use an AV jump to reach the ledge by the plasma rifle, it isn't needed. Search thoroughly.

Map 22
pistol start on HMP, 5-7 deaths, quit mid map on last run

Describing this map in a single word, the one I'd choose is derivative. I'm in the minority in that I don't like this map and playing it felt more like a chore than fun. There's no problems in the construction: interesting monster placement, tight but manageable health and ammo, layout is simple to navigate, the times I did die didn't feel cheap or unfair. So I'll chalk it up to personal preference that the map felt like less than the sum of its parts.

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Map28
I really liked this level. It looks great, has a varied assortment of environments, and flows from stage to stage very smoothly.

Difficulty was a bit odd. Mostly quite easy. More than once I'd trigger a trap (which were always pretty well sign-posted), and be surprised by how few the ambushing monsters were ... a single hell knight, in once case. Then things ramped up at the end, with the Pain Elementals in big open areas, and then the fight inside the grey metal diamond.

Very good stuff all round, though: definitely in my top 10 for the wad.

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I played map 30 by accident a couple of weeks ago, so let me see what I can recall of the experience...

I remember hardships, and many deaths. Nasty monsters appearing in your face, bastard arch viles bringing everything back to life, lots of fun. Oh and an icon of sin ending which I never find fun, but managed to pull off after many tries.

This wad was overall a real treat, and I will definitely be putting it on my list of wads to return to. I think I will have to check out the other CCs now, but I will follow the megawad club with whatever it chooses next (unless I played it recently). Something shorter perhaps would make a nice change.

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Capellan said:

Map28[/b]
Difficulty was a bit odd. Mostly quite easy.

Yep, sorry about that. The map was made with an earlier map slot in mind, and I never really took time to beef the difficulty up after it was moved to slot 28. The beginning part is indeed easy, most notably if you carry your weapons on from previous levels.

____________
Maybe you guys could try Jenesis next ? Its maps are fun and not too long.

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darkreaver said:

Please tell why =)


I found the gameplay very dull and repetitive.

"Oh look. I've released a swarm of revenants and an archvile. Well, it hadn't happened for at least 60 seconds, so I guess we were due."

It got old a long, long time before the level ended.


Map30
The double-switch metal barriers thing? Hate it. The very antithesis of fun.

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I'm glad to see people finishing up, although I lament the loss of glenzinho. I'll tally up what megawads have been suggested shortly, after I kick out the rest of CC4. For those that finished, what were your favorite & least favorite maps out of the megawad? I always like to see if there's some kind of consensus amongst us, and if not, it's at least fun to see how wildly different our opinions are.

walter confalonieri said:

just a question, you accept even doom or heretic megawad or just only doom 2? just wondering...


We're starting off with Doom megawads, although I'm not opposed to a Heretic one... I'm just not as well versed in heretic as I am in Doom. We are definitely open to Ultimate Doom megawads, and I have been eyeing the re-release of 2002ADO for quite some time, since I never played the original. It just depends on what people want most.

Anyway, onto two of my reviews.

------

MAP26: Both Aro and Corfiatis provide a neat return to Whispers of Satan, featuring maps that feel eerily like outtakes from the megawad (although Vulcana II is actually directly inspired by its forebearer). MAP26 starts things off with a blazing firefight in the depths of some demented temple, forcing you deeper within its forsaken walls as you scour for a way out. The difficulty here is surprisingly moderate, with only a few battles (like the cacos in the courtyard) wearing me down... most everything else was manageable, with plenty of health and munitions provided (I felt like the map had a perfect amount of rockets).

One of the things I absolutely adore about Aro’s style is his eye for small design. Throughout the temple are small grooves in the floors, low hanging archways, a host of sectors dedicated merely to lights and a great eye for repetitious design that never actually feels repetitive. Whether it’s the flesh star in the marble tile room held up by iron loops or the eerily lit face of a demon carved into obsidian, I always find myself appreciating his architecture. Perhaps his only flaw is that a most of his rooms are very boxy in shape, but as long as they’re well designed it doesn’t nag me as much.

A fun experience overall.

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MAP27: Vulcana II is less of a big budget sequel to its predecessor and more like an alternate version of it. The four core areas feel reimagined (although interestingly enough, reversed) with a host of different tricks this time around. The archvile fights are quite fun and very devious, with only a few verging on annoying (like the first one in the large chasm, leaving you with little room to avoid him and the minions in the further on). I thought the first fight with the AV was exceptionally well done, as was the cyberdemon reveal. I also enjoyed the projectile hell Corfiatis put into the level, jamming it full of cacodemons and lost souls for some aerial fun. I really applaud authors for finding ways to make relatively harmless enemies (zombiemen, imps, pinkies, lost souls) into pretty serious threats.

The massive chasm is visually the best part, with each molten lavafall cascading down into the abyss, making it feel more like an infinite canyon than the spooky hell cavern in the original Vulcana. Details here are up to par, with a nice amount of cracks and crevices in the floor and walls to make it feel like a volcano. Only gripes were the lack of health in the chasm area (might just be me though, considering I took shelter from the cacos in the caverns with only a mere 18%), and that a couple of the pedestals in the chasm that you had to run on were too difficult to see if you’re not using mouselook, leading to some blind jumps.

Another solid level. Kind of wish it was a tad longer, even though 24 minutes is definitely long enough for most people. Felt refreshing to play maps from familiar authors.

Also, Ribbiks pointed out something I forgot! Before each AV warp (or at least most of them), you can hear the sound of them breathing through the walls, which I think is an exceptionally clever way of warning you about a trap. That was a really neat idea.

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Sorry, real life took over and I'm way out of touch now.

MAP18 - This was the one that was split into red and blue sections. I played this a couple of weeks ago and can't remember much about it, except that fight with the 2 archviles, which would have been a right pain from pistol start. Think I quite liked it.

MAP19 - The Technoprison. This kicked my arse completely, took me forever to get out of the opening area and the big fight near the start. Loved the level though, one of my favourites. Not unfair, just really hard.

MAP20 - First of the space levels - this was OK. Something a little different is always welcome, and I'm sure this was very difficult to put together. I've read about a double SM encounter, I was playing on UV and only remember one? I liked all of that area and the immediate lead up with the revs / arachnotrons in that circley bit. Nicely put together.

MAP21 - Ugh, this is a fucking chore. The music pisses me off (even though it probably fits the theme) and I think I've had fun with one single fight in this map - that area with the lone archvile where the two cybies block the way back.

I've still not finished it actually, I killed the archviles in the last (?) room and pressed the switch and assumed that would be it, but no..just turned the lights off. This might just be the first level I don't bother completing.

It looks nice, I'm sure it was a huge achievement to get everything to work, but I reckon this level will be appreciated far more by mappers than by people who just play.


Favourite map so far - MAP11
Least favourite - MAP21

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I liked both map29 and 30, not much too say really. In map30 i especially loved the beginning, love the slaughterish gameplay in these maps :).
Ill vote for jenesis, seems like a cool wad and didnt play it yet.

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dobugabumaru said:

I have been eyeing the re-release of 2002ADO for quite some time, since I never played the original. It just depends on what people want most.


I'm game for this. Fell way behind with CC4 (I'll beat it on my own someday), but 2002ADO is fine.

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Most favourite map of the wad: This is a toss-up between Map 7 'Hoedown' and map 32 'Mutare'. Both were completely mental and kicked my arse in an enjoyable way, of the 2 I would have to pick 32 as my favourite though. I'd happily list that as one of my favourite maps of any wad.

Least favourite map of the wad: tricky choice, I think I would have to say map 16 'The Forgotten Base' and only for one particular bit where a handful of arch viles were running around outside resurrecting an army of monsters while frying me if i so much as dared poke my nose out the door. That one bit sticks in my mind as the lowest point of the whole wad for me, even though the rest of that map was quite enjoyable.

I've played jenesis before, and although I cant remember it that well i do remember enjoying it, so don't mind if others want to do that one.

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For the next WAD I would suggest some classic levelset from the 90's, like Memento Mori or Requiem. It would be interesting to see how those old-time greats look through modern eyes.

As for CC4:

Favourite: MAP06 or MAP29
Least favourite: MAP13

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dobugabumaru said:
[u]what were your favorite & least favorite maps out of the megawad?


Favorite Maps (other than my own, of course :) )
05, 08, 13, 24, 26, 28

Least Favorite
07, 16, 19, 21, 29, 30

Did not play:
31, 32

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dobugabumaru said:

I'm glad to see people finishing up, although I lament the loss of glenzinho.

Gone but not forgotten: I'll be back, bigger, better and less grammatically correct than before! I had to put my focus into the map I was working on... I get so single minded at the finishing stage of the mapping process.

Favourites were most of Episode 1 (1-11) and 18, 20 & 21. There's nothing I would classify as a least favourite or whatever, they were all of a high standard and good in their own way. I am jealous of the quality that was packed into CC4, and the wait was well worth it. Everyone involved should be very proud of themselves, great work!

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