Doom 2 In Name Only - Now (supsiciously) on a load of gaming articles

[scifista42]

Eris, would you allow me to make an alternative MAP07? I got an idea (based on earlier, I think Jayextee's simple idea) that wouldn't take too long to implement, I may be able to do it till Thrusday. Just to have an alternative. In the worst case, mine won't be used.

This time it won't be too long :)

[Tristan]

Of course, don't let me stop you :)

[cannonball]

Eris Falling said:

MAP22 UV -fast in ZDoom would like to disagree with you :) And with me mapping, a 3 minute gameplay could probably still be a large map, not unlike MAP22. That was supposed to be equal in time as MAP19, if not slightly longer. I'll be annoyed when the first sub-10 minute max is made.

511 monsters (excluding lost souls) plus the secret exit building to repopulate. I am trying to make the map a lot more rocket heavy than the previous incantation due to more semi slaughter style ambushes.

[Antroid]

scifista42 said:

Eris, would you allow me to make an alternative MAP07? I got an idea (based on earlier, I think Jayextee's simple idea) that wouldn't take too long to implement, I may be able to do it till Thrusday. Just to have an alternative. In the worst case, mine won't be used.

This time it won't be too long :)

If you don't use the same song, I will find you and totally block your way (wherever you'll happen to be going) and look at you disapprovingly. Which has been reported to be emotionally devastating so you'd better use that same music track!!

[Tristan]

Antroid said:

If you don't use the same song, I will find you and totally block your way (wherever you'll happen to be going) and look at you disapprovingly. Which has been reported to be emotionally devastating so you'd better use that same music track!!

Probably a good thing I stopped working on the map anyway. I think only V4 fitted because it was going to be a similar map, just touched up heavily.


Cannonball: Actually I think the old MAP24 (now 34) had about 550. But in vanilla, where lost souls aren't counted, I think MAP22 is about 320 monsters. Now if it was as massive as I'd always imagined it, then I'm sure 1000 could have been exceeded. It's probably my only problem with MAP22 is that it wasn't as massive as I'd have liked it to be. There was supposed to be a labyrinth in there somewhere. My mapping just wasn't/isn't up to the job of such a task.

[Evolution]

The last thing we want to do is put pressure on anybody to rush their project; we could always host d2ino next week instead?

[Tristan]

Evolution said:

The last thing we want to do is put pressure on anybody to rush their project; we could always host d2ino next week instead?

The 7PM BST does seem to be static, and I have to help out with a shopping trip which is usually around that time, I'd rather not miss any of the session - naturally. I could always try and negotiate timing, depends on how other mappers feel.

[Antroid]

Evolution said:

The last thing we want to do is put pressure on anybody to rush their project; we could always host d2ino next week instead?

I for one would appreciate that because apparently when I come back from work and have like 4 hours until sleep I don't really wanna map and playtest... But this'll be a very good incentive to do that on the weekend like I've been meaning to for like 2/3rds of a month by now.

[scifista42]

Here is the start of my map.
Texturing of the top left part will be changed.
I'll continue tomorrow.
Can't guarantee anything.

[Babel]

Here are my maps with the problems fixed

http://www.speedyshare.com/7UF5t/map23.wad

http://www.speedyshare.com/fHqZk/map27.1.wad

The maps should not have any problems

[mouldy]

Joseph Lord said:

Here are my maps with the problems fixed

http://www.speedyshare.com/7UF5t/map23.wad

http://www.speedyshare.com/fHqZk/map27.1.wad

The maps should not have any problems

Cool, I managed to survive the barrels of fun this time, love the ending.

Map 27 I'm finding a lot more enjoyable now, although I had some problems near the end - the room with the throne and the yellow key, I went in there before I had the blue key and couldn't get out. Is there a way to lower those bars that block you in? Also I couldn't find anything to open with the yellow key.

[cannonball]

right latest version of industrial zone
http://speedy.sh/wbusm/cbindustbeta.wad
Different midi now (sorry but even I get annoyed by Quad machine now :P)
Too many other changes to list with new exit and secret exit areas.
No co-op stuff beyond starts as of yet, want to get the single player stuff sorted first.
Bit nervy on vanilla limits. I played through the map with choco doom and got nothing in the playing area, there are a couple of spots where it gets pretty close.

[Babel]

mouldy said:

I had some problems near the end - the room with the throne and the yellow key, I went in there before I had the blue key and couldn't get out. Is there a way to lower those bars that block you in? Also I couldn't find anything to open with the yellow key.

That idea never passed from my mind, i think because i have the habit to always go with the blue key to the throne. Thanks for that.
And with the yellow key, im thinking in something to give an use. As yet nothing, maybe i must remove that.

[scifista42]

Maybe I missed it on the lot of previous pages, but: Has anyone yet reported that the Antroid's lavafalls don't display in PrBoom and PrBoom-plus? Apparently, ZDoom-based ports (and surprisingly also Choco) accepts it in its TEXTURE2 form, but PrBoom-based ports displays the original DBRAIN instead. It only doesn't tutti-frutti, at least.
Also in EDGE sourceport they seem to be broken...

Second thing: did I actually say yesterday that I'd be able to map something by Thursday? I don't know what I was thinking, I'm no speedmapper and it always takes me enormous time of repeated adding, editing and reediting textures and shapes, before I'm finally satisfied with my work. I'm sorry, please forget the MAP07 would be finished so early.
Still, I'll continue working on it. (Probably also change the initial idea...)

[mouldy]

I had a play around with eris's map 07 and made a new version:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/q4wdwjb7ilpq33i/map07-mouldy.wad

though I'm not sure whether its any better or in fact worse, I'll let people have a go and see what they think...

[Tristan]

Antroid is going to make you his bitch. Though AHGEEZ can always be replaced :P

I really like what you've done with it. It's a bit like what V4 was going to be but contained entirely within the original map. I also like how the Arachnotron fight is also on a walkway. It's much harder, which isn't a bad thing, and is still within the definition of simple. It really is what my map should have been in the first place. Nice job.

[mouldy]

Cool glad you like it. I was a bit slapdash with texturing and haven't checked it in choc doom or added difficulty settings, but I'll wait and see if people get on with it or scifista42 makes a better version.

[Antroid]

Eris Falling said:

Antroid is going to make you his bitch. Though AHGEEZ can always be replaced :P

Did he put some other music track instead of the one yours had? Ooooh I'd hate to be him right now, cuz I'm gonna rain down a world of hurt!

(you should bring your original track back Eris when you compile the wad. This is more important than respecting mouldy's artistic choices)

[Tristan]

Nah, it was just D_SHAWN itself. I'll throw AHGEEZ back in, it'll be more fitting since the level is now more frantic than it was. I was playing on skill 1 and found the gameplay kinda intense :P

[mouldy]

yeah its just the default doom music at the moment, feel free to change that. Also feel free to mess around with the gameplay, it might be a bit harsh at the moment.

[Babel]

A question emerged
What happened with map16?
I make this question because i have an idea of how to change the final part and keep the prision. The gods inspired me.
So if there is no problem. Can i should u guys what i have in mind?

[schwerpunk]

Joseph Lord said:

A question emerged
What happened with map16?
I make this question because i have an idea of how to change the final part and keep the prision. The gods inspired me.
So if there is no problem. Can i should u guys what i have in mind?

please go for it. I've been wrangled into clearing branches at camp, so I'll be w/o internet for all weekend.

[cannonball]

cannonball said:

right latest version of industrial zone
http://speedy.sh/wbusm/cbindustbeta.wad
Different midi now (sorry but even I get annoyed by Quad machine now :P)
Too many other changes to list with new exit and secret exit areas.
No co-op stuff beyond starts as of yet, want to get the single player stuff sorted first.
Bit nervy on vanilla limits. I played through the map with choco doom and got nothing in the playing area, there are a couple of spots where it gets pretty close.

Casual bump, it would be nice to hear some feedback on the changes I've made to this map, cheers :)

[Tristan]

Sorry, meant to get back to you on this.

It's looking really nice, and I do miss Quad Machine :P I guess I should just be glad I know about it thanks to this map.
Two nitpicks though, I'd consider making the front of the sector of the switch on the left impassable, since it's possible to stand in the switch and activate it, so the lift goes without you.

on the south-western building, with the slime, I can see some misaligned bars infront of the sergeant snipers.

That's all I could find in a quick whiz-around, but all the same, great work! :)

[mouldy]

I had a good old play-through of industrial zone, some cool new stuff in there, I like the new moody lighting. The secret invulnerability and teleport to the yellow key barrier, would be cool if somehow you could only do that after lowering the yellow barrier, otherwise you end up wasting the invul and wondering why you are teleported somewhere with no monsters to fight. When I saw the exit sign above that teleport I thought it might be the secret exit (is that a trick?) so that might also confuse people.

Thats the only niggle I had and to be honest its hardly even worth addressing. Great stuff.

[Egregor]

scifista42 said:

Right on this photo (ceiling) is visible somethink which may be an unclosed sector. But otherwise it certainly looks awesome, as your whole map :)

You were right! There was a bug! And now its fixed. Please use this file:

http://www.mediafire.com/?jio1r6w7bf46v8j

[mouldy]

Egregor said:

You were right! There was a bug! And now its fixed. Please use this file:

http://www.mediafire.com/?jio1r6w7bf46v8j

I really like this map. It was a real bastard when I first played it but it has calmed down a bit now. Looks fantastic and is fun to explore. One thing puzzles me though - there's a room where the door is opened by a switch a few doors away, so you have to do a timed run to get in. And the prize for doing it is a cell charge and a revenant ambush. Seems a bit of a harsh reward?

[scifista42]

I just played through Cannonball's Industrial Zone and Egregor's DESTRUCT, gonna give feedback.

To Cannonball's MAP15: To be honest, I think the last version I've had and fully played was the first one you've uploaded last summer. Cannonball, I'd tell you that I practically always like the first version of your (any of your) map the most. I always enjoy the first time exploring your map and being impressed by it in all aspects. However, besides adding difficulty settings, the next versions usually only bring slight changes in design that don't improve the gameplay noticeably enough, and the map for me feels somehow "spoiled" by those changes. Of course, I wouldn't probably feel so if I didn't play it earlier, can be argued, but let me continue with explaining what particularly I mean in this map.

At first, Tarnsman told you already and I agree with him: The map feels more like "Downtown" and if there wasn't the original D2 Industrial Zone map, I wouldn't get the point. Tarnsman, I think, also told you about the map being too bright. Here, let me just say - I really* think you've get him too literally when updating the map ;). But generally, the actual thing is that the new version didn't add "industrial"-like parts and rather came with minor changes affecting everything but that. So you have more monsters, more darkness, different music (again, why?), many buildings changed to be more (slaughery)challenging while adding hellish elements, but no industrial ones. The parts I don't get is why you've darkened everything so much, and why you've changed the last building at all, because I liked those large atmospheric rooms a lot.

So to sum up my points, if it was on me, I'd actually use the former version (that in the beta *ALPHA*). But of course, of course - I really digged MAP15 back then, and this is mostly the same one, so I can't say I dislike it - I like it, just... you see.

(*At this point, I'd like to suggest to bring TNT Evilution's SKY2 to this wad. Yes, the night one with stars. Actually, I noticed my own map 19 looked great with it, and as I'm thinking about it, most of our E2 maps would. Or even better, some version of night sky that tiles vertically? What do you all think about it?)

To Egregor's MAP11: Well... I think I've given you a detailed feedback back then when the first version was released, and was claiming that I really like it, I can stand the low ammo and the only thing I did mind were damaging floors. Now I see that major changes were made with ammo. I no longer felt so limited with it, and could finish the map much faster with that and playing it was more enjoyable, I think you've done a good job. Because the ammo is still limited enough to not being able to defeat the cyberdemon too early. Which is however possible at the cost of ending up with nearly zero ammo. Player can make this choice, and that's another great thing about this map.

I didn't really notice there being any much less damaging floors. With visual changes (like the room on your screenshot), I don't feel they enhanced the map any significantly, but cannot at all say they made it worse. In other words, I liked the rooms like they were and I like them how they're now, the change wasn't necessary but it's all looking nice and that's good.

[Tristan]

hurrr, misread it as TNT2 SKY2.
All the same, it kinda messes with the initial project guidelines - no new skies.
I agree on the last building of MAP15, though I do like what it's become too, but overall I much prefer the version that's been made.
I'll be compiling TNSd2ino.WAD on Wednesday, UNLESS ANYONE HAS ANY OBJECTIONS. This will involve clearing out the one metric fuckton of pollution that resulted from me redirecting all downloads to the D2INO folder.

[Memfis]

Oh, so you guys will be ready for this Thursday? Should I post an announcment then or you aren't sure yet?