Doom 3: Phobos

[Caffeine Freak]

Where... the hell did you get that arachnotron gif, and who created that model? It's fucking amazing.

[snapshot]

It was planned to be added for OpenCoop mod before the project died for some reason.

[Caffeine Freak]

I'd never seen it. Do you know who modeled and animated it?

[snapshot]

It says

Quote

Model and textutes by RtH, rig and animation by klonsemann.

 

[printz]

@Caffeine FreakDon't you also have a spiderdemon of your own?

[Caffeine Freak]

We have an arachnotron, yes. We showed it briefly once in a vid several years back. Ours (and it looks like this one as well) were both modeled after some concept art of the arachnotron for Doom 3 that never made it into the game. Ours only has four legs, though, and isn't as generally hi poly as this one seems to be.

[snapshot]

 

:o

[Koko Ricky]

Once again guys, keep it up. These sorts of projects are so difficult to see to the end, but clearly you guys are dedicated.

[Deleted_Account]

Phobos 2018? Awesome possum!!!1

[MFG38]

8 hours ago, Piper Maru said:

Phobos 2018? Awesome possum!!!1

Let's hope so. I just want to lay my hands on this sexiness, goddammit!

[geX]

 

 

[DooM_RO]

Awesome!

 

I do have to ask how you plan to expand the gameplay. Believe it or not, I think the term "Classic Doom" is a bit vague. I mean, levels like E1M5, E1M7 and E2M7 are vastly different from more action-packed levels like Mt. Erebus or any of the Doom 2 levels. Is it going to be more like Metroid, System Shock? I read that SOMA was one of your main inspirations but one thing that put me off in that game was that it had pretty poor gameplay. 

 

Since this is a lot more story oriented, I want to ask if you guys are going to explore the nature of Hell/Demons or even the devil (if there is one), especially since it seems you want to make the universe a bit more sophisticated. It would be cool if there was Christian priest who offered his take on the whole matter, since the universe was obviously influenced by Christianity. What about atheists? Would their views be changed by the events or would they still try to rationalize it?

 

Since you are splitting the mod into episodes, I want to ask how the overall structure of the mod has changed, since it was originally supposed to be three, and then just one. Is the content going to be just the finished E1 stuff after all or will you guys also inject stuff from E2 and E3? I would really like to see more of Doom 3's Hell. It was a killer concept that was sadly underdeveloped.

Edited January 20, 2018 by DooM_RO

[Shaviro]

Phobos is a lot more actiony than Doom3 and a whole lot less "scary". The tempo has increased vastly and overall it's a faster paced, more challenging Doom3. It does slow down at times where you'll be solving puzzles or exploring the world and narrative. These will serve as breathers. SOMA is only an inspiration in atmosphere and narrative. We don't have any sneaky parts or horror moments. Phobos is not a horror game.

 

We do have a few plans for exploring the nature of Hell/Demons, but it's not going to be biblical in nature. We subscribe to the idea that it's more about involuntarily opening a gate to another dimension rather than an actual demonic invasion. That said, we were probably never going to outright say in the game that it's NOT this or that. However if that ever makes it into the game is hard to say at this point. Being atheists ourselves (at least two of us), it's not really something we care a whole lot about. Not that it's wrong to care about this aspect, but it's just not our focus :)

 

The structure hasn't really changed much since we cut the last two episodes. What was Episode 1 before has now become what you would popularly refer to as Season 1, containing n episodes. To be perfectly honest, the Phobos and Hell episodes were never really all that fleshed out - which is why the decision to cut them was surprisingly easy. The difference between Mars and Phobos levels would have been negligible - perhaps even boiling down to a different skybox. The biggest difference would have been the events taking place in the story, but one of the things we have learned throughout this process is that the story that matters is not really the obvious locations and events, but rather the internal strugge of the character. Also, story iterations would have changed things anyway. As for the hell episode, we had some rather interesting concepts developed by Kristus and others, but nothing I believe would amount to anything concrete. At least not without extensive effort.

 

I realize this doesn't sound all that Doomish - and it isn't. This is a pet project that has evolved for many years, taking up half of our lifespans. We could go straight Doom or we could do something that suits our present selves and interests. We still like Doom and it makes up the majority of the game, but there will also be parts that probably won't sit well with regular Doomers. We do think our stuff blends well with Doom3 though. We have been working in this environment for many years and "almost" feel ownership of this part of the franchise. I personally feel it is a natural extension of Doom3 for the modern era :)

[DooM_RO]

 

@Shaviro

 

I'm an atheist too (although not always sure about it) but it's fun asking "what if" questions and seeing those questions answered in interesting ways in a video game universe. I mean, how would an atheist who was suddenly in a world full of entities that look like demons that draw pentagrams and put inverted crosses on walls react to all this? I mean if they are aliens from another dimension why do they use all those pentagrams and inverted crosses? Why are there souls screaming in a level called Hell? If there is Hell in the Doom universe then wouldn't it be logical that there would be a God too? Why is He strangely absent from all of this? It would be cool if you offered some kind of explanation to this.

 

You keep mentioning that the game might not be "Doomish" enough for some people but what does Doom mean for you, especially after having spent so many years on the franchise? I am actually glad that you are expanding the Doom 3 universe. It has grown on me quite a lot over the last years and I love the fact that you guys are expanding it. You guys are actually doing something original and not just Megawad #3252.

 

Kristus linked to his personal site a while back where I saw a few WIP (and probably very old) hellish environments. I really liked them and it would be a shame to let all that work go to waste. Do you think you could at least include the unused textures in the editor? Phobos might spark a Doom 3 renaissance and people might start making stuff for it again and those extra textures could come in really handy. There is also an awesome Doom 3 textures for Doom WAD that includes both hi-res and the versions in Doom format. I am making a map for it right now and will probably make more in the future using the 256 color version. Would you let us do something similar to the Phobos textures when it comes out? I'd love to sink my teeth in them!

 

 

 

[Doommarine_maxi]

Happy to see some news about this project, I can feel that it would be one of the greatest mods for doom 3 in history (if not the best for single player)

[DooM_RO]

It's right up there with The Dark Mod.

[geX]

@DooM_RO

 

It could be interesting to explore if that was the actual focus of the game. It never was for us, and you just can't include all ideas in the same game.

It was also something they already explored in the original Doom 3, and we never felt we had anything else to add to that. So it was cut.

 

At this point we don't think that much about Doom or what it is. We think about what we want to tell. It's a platform, a game and an engine for us. We try not to let Doom dictate what we want or can't do.

 

What kristus made is mostly made with original Doom 3 textures. Very few new was made, but they will be included in the release, because why not :)

 

You are free to use anything from our mod as long as you credit us or the original creator of that content :)

[DooM_RO]

1 minute ago, geX said:

@DooM_RO

 

It could be interesting to explore if that was the actual focus of the game. It never was for us, and you just can't include all ideas in the same game.

It was also something they already explored in the original Doom 3, and we never felt we had anything else to add to that. So it was cut.

 

At this point we don't think that much about Doom or what it is. We think about what we want to tell. It's a platform, a game and an engine for us.

 

What kristus made is mostly made with original Doom 3 textures. Very few new was made, but they will be included in the release, because why not :)

 

You are free to use anything from our mod as long as you credit us or the original creator of that content :)

 

Oh I didn't mean anything drastic. Just a few PDA e-mails or voice recordings and maybe even find the mutilated body of a priest somewhere. Basically a minor character that adds a bit more flavor and speculation to the universe. The reason I suggested this was because it seems you want to go a bit beyond the usual sci-fi tropes. It would be interesting to hear in a PDA his final confrontation with a demon, begging God for help, only to hear his agonized screams. Did God not help because he abandoned humanity? Did the priest not have enough faith? Or maybe God doesn't exist at all. It sounds very bleak but then again, the game is called Doom after all.

 

 

[Shaviro]

We actually don't have a PDA anymore. We used to. We used to write PDAs for it. We have an old dusty document filled to the brim with Doom3 style PDAs. The thing is....It's boring as fuck. It's not that the PDAs were written poorly or anything, it's just pointless. Yes, you get a little world-building, but it's so mundane and doesn't really add in anything interesting. Also, it comes at the expense of pacing. Phobos is for the most part an action game where forward momentum and progression is what you desire. We slow down the game once in a while for a breather with some narrative or a puzzle, but we don't want to take the player out of the experience. Rifling through dozens of PDA entries looking for a locker- or doorcode just doesn't seem very imaginative. It's kinda lazy. Having to look through PDAs for clues to puzzles is usually a sign that the puzzle is poorly designed.

 

So many games have plenty of filler stuff to read and while there are examples of this adding something to the game, I personally think it's more often than not a huge detriment. It's a catch 22 for me. The filler crap is boring. If I read it I'm bored, if I don't read it I feel like I may be missing something. I'd like anything told in the game to help progress the plot or reinforce its themes. We try to tell any relevant stories through in-game scenery or a few narrative techniques.

 

And holy fuck are such PDAs boring to write - and if it's boring to write it's probably boring to read ;)

[DooM_RO]

 

5 minutes ago, Shaviro said:

We actually don't have a PDA anymore. We used to. We used to write PDAs for it. We have an old dusty document filled to the brim with Doom3 style PDAs. The thing is....It's boring as fuck. It's not that the PDAs were written poorly or anything, it's just pointless. Yes, you get a little world-building, but it's so mundane and doesn't really add in anything interesting. Also, it comes at the expense of pacing. Phobos is for the most part an action game where forward momentum and progression is what you desire. We slow down the game once in a while for a breather with some narrative or a puzzle, but we don't want to take the player out of the experience. Rifling through dozens of PDA entries looking for a locker- or doorcode just doesn't seem very imaginative. It's kinda lazy. Having to look through PDAs for clues to puzzles is usually a sign that the puzzle is poorly designed.

 

So many games have plenty of filler stuff to read and while there are examples of this adding something to the game, I personally think it's more often than not a huge detriment. It's a catch 22 for me. The filler crap is boring. If I read it I'm bored, if I don't read it I feel like I may be missing something. I'd like anything told in the game to help progress the plot or reinforce its themes. We try to tell any relevant stories through in-game scenery or a few narrative techniques.

 

And holy fuck are such PDAs boring to write - and if it's boring to write it's probably boring to read ;)

 

Doom 3 without PDAs? That's quite the shocker really! Yes, they are really quite boring. It's very strange really, I can spend hours reading the wiki about any given section but when I'm playing it's almost always a chore reading them but I feel guilty for not reading them.

 

Also, everything you said represents the spirit of Doom quite nicely. Doom 2016 did what you said very well I think. For me at least, Doom is a game about quiet exploration, with a few monsters here and there, punctuated by big, surprise fights. 

 

 

[MFG38]

Can't wait for the first episode!

 

And of course the other episodes as well, whenever they happen to be released.

[Tetzlaff]

I always liked browsing through PDA mails in a silent moment. It added some interesting background info about the people living on the Mars base. Why remove something that is completely optional? When you don't like reading PDAs, you can simply ignore them. If you don't hide door codes or the like in them, of course (but you don't have to do that).

[DooM_RO]

Yeah, I still think they could work if used more sparingly. Like maybe one or two per level.

[Shaviro]

Well.

I used to subscribe to the idea of the more optional stuff the better - more or less. That's why we have an old document with a bunch of PDAs.

I do still think this kind of stuff may have a place somewhere, but it would be in a different kind of game. With Phobos we're aiming for a directed story that unfolds over a few episodes. Considering that it's mainly done by 3 people it's a long-ass mod, but it's not like we're going to be able to have 60 hours to flesh out a universe with lots and lots of texts, logs, sidequests, whatever like you see in an open-world game.

 

While we are not going to have PDAs, we do intend to have a few other "devices" that will help fill in the blanks here and there. Phobos has a system where select  items will be inspectable and you'll get a reaction. This allows for pretty much anything ranging from a simple poster on a wall to flicking a switch or a playable audio log. We believe that anything and everything we tell through the world and the story should help progress the plot and its main themes (minus some needed comic relief etc). All that stuff said, we are always going to favor showing you things or the evidence of things rather than have someone write or talk about them - and sometimes it's much more powerful to ask a question than answering it.

 

We are not going to go into depth about the hell invasion, Betruger or how it is living on Mars. I personally feel that part of the Doom3 universe has been told over the existing 3 entries. All this stuff still takes place, but this time it's more the backdrop for our story, a catalyst for certain events and a driver of the action. It's not a focal point in our story. It's not about closing the portal, saving earth or anything like that. It's about the player character's personal journey in trying to connect his current self to his past. All this told through the lens of someone trying to survive the events of Doom3.

A theme that I must say is extremely relevant for myself after having worked so long on this project.

[Avoozl]

I'm sad to hear that you are leaving out the PDA element but I understand your reasons behind why.

 

However as for the episodic format I am a little disappointed because well I don't like the idea of having to run the episodes separately from each other, unless you have a way to make them all work together once they are all done.

[geX]

Each episode will have its own story arc, and these will connect the dots for the bigger story that spans the episodes. You will be able to play it in its entirety with no pause, once everything is released.

[DooM_RO]

Is there any Hell in it or is it just UAC bases?

[geX]

At this point no levels takes place in Hell. Again. This was never the focus (after we ditched the old ep 2 and ep 3), and our story has moved more and more away from that aspect. So we haven't been down that route for quite some time. We have some old stuff laying around, but it needs a lot of work to actually be on the same level of quality that we want and expect of our levels by now.

[DooM_RO]

Oh sorry. I forgot I had already asked that question.

[Doommarine_maxi]

The SDK (.dll) would be vital for play or the mod can be played without it?.

Ex: ELDoom (a doom 3 mod) uses SDK but only to emulate ROE portal sky (or something like that) and you can play the mod without any SDK at all.
Ex 2: Tested V7.1 uses SDK but only for visual effects and other stuff, and you can play the mod without it