Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
dobu gabu maru

The DWmegawad Club plays: Coffee Break & Fava Beans & Double Impact

Recommended Posts

Magnusblitz said:
I realize that opinions can vary greatly, but giving a 4/5 to a map that's an empty staircase and a few boxes with a shotgun and 2 Barons in it smells like rampant grade inflation to me. :)

You forgot to to adjust for nostalgia. ;-D It's like asking me, and some stranger, to each rate my mother's cooking...

I fully realize people who did not play this when 90% of PWADs were crap look at it now and go "meh".

Share this post


Link to post

For next month I vote contemporary megawad but I'm not so keen on the Club acting as beta testers so I would vote for 3HA or DtWiD: Lost Levels. Maybe do an old classic again July?

Share this post


Link to post

http://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/c/2306429 = my playthrough of Fava Beans.

I sum this wad up as being like a timewarp back to 1995, with a mixture of awkward design, possible good level potential and the WTF-ness of some of its levels!

For the most part, it felt like they copy-pasted a fair amount of map design from the levels they were mapping over; each level seemed to have a similar element from its original map counterpart.
I liked the transition from generic military base textures to marble textures on some of the levels to indicate the demonic presence; kind of felt like E2 had invaded E1.
There were a fair few awkward level design quirks, like having secrets that weren't really secrets, areas leading to doors/deadends that had no purpose until you opened the door/wall later on (for a secret usually!), and odd lift usage for secret areas. (4 lifts for a lone backpack in one level!)
Most of the level design was generically uninspiring E1 stuff, with the odd visual splendour to marvel at. A lot of outdoor spaces and windows I noticed throughout the wad; a 'window fetish' as was described by my channel moderator Drallkan at one point.

E1M5 to E1M7 were the pick of the bunch for me, with some nicely executed traps spread among them. I also really liked E1M5's exit area. It seemed like the wad was building up the difficulty quite nicely, but then....

E1M8. What a disappointment. You just fight two Barons in a small area, which I decided to prolong by attempting a chainsaw double kill (watch the video to see if I was successful or not...), and then like in Phobos Anomaly the walls lower to an outdoor area and an exit. Very very disappointing considering I had enough firepower to level 30-40 Barons at once easily. And also considering that two Barons had confronted me IN THE PREVIOUS LEVEL NO LESS!

The secret map was also a hilarious joke; you could skip most of the level by going through the second door, there was a hidden invulnerability orb for no real reason, useless pillars (of which one rose up when you went to the other side!) and a very bizarre secret area chain. And of course, not to forget the stuck Spectre that I had to shoot to free it from the dirt!

Overall, this wad was alright but nothing special. It was like looking into the past at a curious Doom oddity. I'd definitely have to question even back in 1995 what they were thinking with that disappointing final map, but hey at least it wasn't as bad as Coffee Break's ending (no I haven't forgotten that! Ever!). Wasn't very challenging either, with plentiful ammo and very rarely threatening a death despite largely consisting of hitscanners. But it wasn't terrible to playthrough either, with a nice simple pace to it.

Don't think I'll be joining the CLUB for Double Impact, as I'm pretty damn sure soon that either Monochrome Mapping Project or Switcheroom will come out, which I'll be focusing on!
(unless Double Impact is another brief ride like Fava Beans was, that is....in which case I might attempt another Twitch channel playthrough)

Share this post


Link to post

I'm sticking with my usual votes of Vile Flesh / Scythe 2 for megaWADs not otherwise mentioned, but of course I'll cast a final vote once the actual choices have been picked, like usual. Pretty much agree with Memfis and Cannonball on the D2TWiD thing; be happy to play it when it's done, but I don't think it's really hurting for testers/feedback/general community input in the way that some other projects like HYMN or Monochrome or the like arguably are/might be. D2TWiD project leads/contributors can and should correct me if I'm talking foolish nonsense, of course.

Re: Fava Beans, I certainly understand the concept that the WAD's technical/structural workmanship is truly noteworthy given both the general standard of such things at the time and the relative crudity of WADmaking tools back then, but I think its gameplay failings cannot really be brushed aside with an appeal to history in the same way. For all of Birkel's boasting in the text file about his maps being essentially on par with id's own, he utterly failed (or simply neglected) to treat with combat in the way that Romero did in E1, or indeed, that other WADsters in 1994/1995 did in their own maps (many of which are less aesthetically advanced than Birkel's, granted). It's not so much the impression that he tried and failed to make fun battles that bothers me, as it is the impression that he didn't even try. Contrast this with something like Alberto Barsella's "Wasteland" series from the same time period; most of it is quite easy, as well, but here we see a lot more attention to the way monsters and other things are placed/deployed (e.g. it makes sense that the base in the first map is mostly empty, and that you've entered the scene armed to the teeth), such that the way the fights go seems deliberate. In most of Fava's maps, it just seems like monsters were dotted around without much thought given to the matter. E1M8, which in most traditionally-styled E1 replacements (which Fava self-avowedly is) uses a simplistic layout and focuses on a big battle of one sort or another, really brings out this weakness--in keeping with tradition, Birkel eschews his considerable layout-building skills and focuses on giving us a fight instead, and we see just how poor he is at doing so, either because of lack of understanding of what makes a decent fight on his part, or just lack of give-a-shititude.

Of course, there is no accounting for nostalgia. I reckon it's quite likely I'm too easy on the Wasteland series, and a number of other old WADs, because they have a lot of nostalgia value for me, in a way that Fava admittedly doesn't.

Share this post


Link to post

Since dobugabumaru said it was OK to start.

Double Impact
HMP, continuous, frequent save/reload, no music.

e1m1
A good but not great beginning from DI. I liked the exploration-based shotgun secret, which was one of the first things I discovered, so it got things off to a nice start. I wasn't a fan of the slow-building staircase, however, which appeared to be a gimmick for gimmick's sake, nor the need to backtrack through the level to get the yellow key once you'd reached the exit. This was particularly annoying since I'd done the yellow key wing first. The small number of additional bad guys released for this second visit didn't justify the run across the level to fight them.

Most of the actual fights were pretty well-staged, making troopers and imps are exciting as possible. I'd have liked a few more monsters capable of wandering long distances across the level and surprising you, but there was at least a little bit of variation allowed within the various subsections of the map.

Share this post


Link to post

UV, pistol start, no saves, -complevel 11, I tried 12 but prboom-plus didn't recognize it so I guess dew meant 11 (MBF)?

e1m1 - demo. Yeah, I think I see that the monsters are indeed more aggressive with this comppatibility level. I'm not sure yet but I think they come to the player faster and don't walk around so much? Kind of cool. Anyway, this is a decent starter map, the realistic buildings at the start are a bit out of place since the rest of the level is just purposeless techbases but I don't mind, I like details like that. Agreed with Capellan about the staircase and backtracking. Also I think that lifts leading to the northern area could be replaced with simple stairs. Lifts are boring, who likes to wait?

Share this post


Link to post

E1M1 - Maintenance Area
Here we go, pistol starting every map I think.
Quite a long starter map to be honest. The monsters are used well and the secrets are not too hard to find. The backtracking can be annoying as the majority of the map is free to roam which means you could cover a large area of the map before you are supposed to. But it's not too much of an issue to be honest. Music is good and the gameplay is pretty easy for now.

Share this post


Link to post

Double Impact

Pistol start, no saves, HNTR.

E1M1: Maintenance Area

Not gonna lie, I've not really been looking forward to playing this wad again. Played it for Newstuff a while back and I can't fully remember what my issues were but I'm sure they'll come flooding back on later levels.

This first level is pretty good though, but I hate the backtracking and the fact that the switch that gets you access to the yellow key has the yellow key texture around it, which makes me think I'm supposed to have the key in order to press the switch. I now remember the time I wondered around this level for ages trying to figure out how to get the key. Is this switch being so far away really necessary? Why can't you just pick up the yellow key straight away? You still need to go get the red key too so it's not like you'll clear the level without exploring it all. Bah humbug.

Share this post


Link to post

I was going to do a day-by-day update on this, but then stuff happened and it turns out that everything's so short here that I'd be better off just stuffing all thoughts into one post. With that being said...

FAVA BEANS
Usual nonsense -- UV, consecutive, strict compatibility without bugs and shittiness.

E1M1:
Okay, here we-.. wait, what the fuck, what's happened to my STBAR?


Christ, what's doing this... time to open the WAD. Oh, great, a custom STBAR graphic with the most trivial of edits that only shows up in Deathmatch.

Well that's stupid. *delete*

Alright, let's try this again.

The usual stuff I guess, a short but sweet E1M1 techbase with (understandably) miserable resistance. I was managing to find secrets while searching for a key like a dumbass (Yellow Keycard atop a pillar, for some reason I didn't think to check the big silver block immediately), and I can already tell that this episode's not one that's going to be at all challenging; a Rocket Launcher, a Backpack, and a Soulsphere up for grabs already? Never mind the Chaingun that is also in an optional area!



E1M2:
Oh, great. I guess I'll just have to tolerate this dumb damagesector shit again. Wouldn't be surprised if it was actually the biggest source of damage in this map.


So much like the first map, it's not entirely linear; if anything, this is much more open, although there are a couple of really dumb moments. What's the point in a stairway that leads to a fucking wall? You can tell that these really are modified DM maps, with little attention paid to having the layout 'make sense' for SP/Co-op. Oh well. And then it happens. The second map, and this greets me:

You cannot be serious. This isn't even a real secret.


Oh my god, what the fuck is this?

Tooled up to the eyeballs less that 10 minutes into the WAD, and the biggest thing I've seen so far isn't much bigger than the BFG itself.


E1M3:
I somehow managed to just stumble through all of this and find everything. The secret exit is pretty neat, if weirdly easy to find; none of that switch-hunting shit as such, just find the Blue Keycard and you can access it while performing the standard requirements to exit the level normally. I guess the author really wanted us to visit the entire episode the first time through. Also; Plasma Rifle. This is just getting stupid.


E1M9:
Yep, this exists.

Sadly, so does this.


E1M4:
By now I'd realised that despite having every weapon available with bags and bags of ammo for them all, I had been using the trusty Shotgun nearly all the way, save for a couple of quick crowd-control moments. Exclusively Chaingunning my way through this one actually made it feel faster and better-paced, although did the difficulty no favours at all. I did have to spend some time running around here looking for all the secrets, only to eventually lose my temper while wracking my brain trying to locate the last one... and actually resorted to checking Doom Builder.

Guess what? It's bugged. While you can take the secret path and grab all the goodies (not that you need them), the marked sector is one of those stupidly allocated ones which can't accomodate the player's hitbox.

Oh well.


E1M5:
Really obvious secrets on this map, with the possible exception of one that apparently just opened in the middle of a fight. Was it marked in any way? No idea.

I really can't think of much to say about this one, other than... a Baron of Hell? What? He's not even introduced in any way, I just turned a corner and there he was, meandering around and probably looking for the way to E1M8. Well it ain't happening, and I break out the Rocket Launcher to make some use of my ludicrous bag o' supplies.


E1M6:
I actually had to look at my map several times here. This is one of those cases where I appreciate the 'go everywhere' design, but it seemed pretty incoherent in places. Those moving platforms didn't really help matters much either. What was the point in these? They just make you think something important might be moving, but no. Just some fucking torches.

Also, bullshit nukage run. Fuck you.


E1M7:
At last, there's a map that's reasonably complex for something so old, with a generous (sort of) enemy count to stop me from falling asleep. Weirdly, there's a Baron duo here that almost present a real danger... except they can't even get close before I blast them into soggy chunks and vapour with a BFG charge.

Shame.

Spent a while trying to locate the secrets here, and really... well they're not worth it because of how unnecessarily overloaded I've been with supplies since E1M1. A bit more rushing around looking for one last secret, and I'm out of here.


E1M8:
Disappointing. I'd even go so far as to actually call this one shit.



Overall:
I guess it's a nice little nostalgia trip back to simple times that visually manages to hold up really well for its age, almost looking 'official' in many areas. On the downside, every map does begin looking so similar to those either side of it that if I played through this in one quick go without making notes, I wouldn't have a fucking clue about what moment belonged to which map.

It's also ridiculously, pitifully easy, so you won't find all that much fun if you're looking for anything like a challenge. The fights are (in general at least) mildly entertaining with enemies often enough approaching from various angles, in a sort of KDITD-esque way, but the overall construction here is lacking that certain something which KDITD possesses. The fact that some of the maps are quickly-rehashed DM efforts doesn't really do the project any favours either, with nonsensical bits and pieces scattered around and maps that are over before they even begin. It's okay for a quick look, but don't get any grand ideas of having a great adventure here. It's 'okay' at best, all things considered.

Share this post


Link to post

Demon of the Well said:
Re: Fava Beans, I certainly understand the concept that the WAD's technical/structural workmanship is truly noteworthy given both the general standard of such things at the time and the relative crudity of WADmaking tools back then, but I think its gameplay failings cannot really be brushed aside with an appeal to history in the same way. For all of Birkel's boasting in the text file about his maps being essentially on par with id's own, he utterly failed (or simply neglected) to treat with combat in the way that Romero did in E1, or indeed, that other WADsters in 1994/1995 did in their own maps (many of which are less aesthetically advanced than Birkel's, granted). It's not so much the impression that he tried and failed to make fun battles that bothers me, as it is the impression that he didn't even try.

I honestly think he *did* try, given the number of monster closets, the odd teleporter trap, the intentional monster block lines and deaf monsters (to keep monsters in certain rooms and positions) etc. The lone fact that he used these concepts at all, back when a vast number of map makers did not, is compelling evidence for me. I'd say it's much more about the fact that his focus was on map aesthetics and, for many of the maps, deathmatch flow. The player base has come to expect much more refined setups, traps, and challenges. After all, Laurel & Hardy did try to entertain you in their old pies-to-the-face-slapstick silent films even if you think they stink. :-)

If you play his map in MM2 (it's map 24) you will see that he improved a bit in the gameplay department, even though there are some oddities not completely ironed out (e.g. the Mancubus guarding the yellow key, there's a gratuitous BFG, etc.), and the things that were good in his Fava Beans maps are still good or even better. If you haven't yet, do play through this map, it'll only take 10 minutes. That goes for all of the club members actually (except for Suitepee who will not like what Doom 2 monster Sean decided to sprinkle throughout the corridors... ;-D).

EDIT:

Okay, "Double Impact" time! I play with PrBoom-plus and the proper compatibility level, the usual way: every map from scratch, on UV, no saves, no cheats. If I reach the exit I check the HUD for missing monsters and/or secrets and go hunt them down, if I can't find them I check what I missed in a map editor and replay the map.

E1M1 - Maintenance Area

A pretty large map, a bit too large for a starter IMHO, looks beautiful but the rooms are so spacious that it feels a little empty, even with the very high (for E1M1) monster count. Gameplay is pretty cool: plenty of monster closets, and lots of barrels which can be used to kill off packs of lightweights. The fights are a bit predictable though. I'll echo Adam's sentiment about the YK section and running back through the map to the exit, not very fun. Had the key been immediately grabbable then I could have blamed myself for having to trek back and forth. This is mostly nitpicking, I still had a good time!

I did like the SG secret and above all the CG secret, very cool. There was one switch which looked "secret" which didn't seem to do anything but release a bunch of demons on me, have no idea what was up there. All in all, pretty darn good, a promising start. --4/5

BTW what's up with the intermission screen? The .txt leaves no clues to any backstory here... so, does anyone know?

Share this post


Link to post
Kristian Ronge said:

BTW what's up with the intermission screen? The .txt leaves no clues to any backstory here... so, does anyone know?

"You're a mechanic working in a garage on [Planet]'s [Moon]. Then, all of a sudden some zombies appear and start shooting at you. Fortunately, you have a gun so you start killing them and you try and reach the rockets and escape the planet! Good Luck mechanic."

I guess we forgot to include it in the text, whoops

Share this post


Link to post

Ah, the old "Revenge of the Mechanic". Classic. I usually don't bother with the background stories/themes but I thought this intermission screen looked nice.

EDIT: Am I getting my hopes up in vain when I'm counting on the BFG being replaced by a wrench?

Share this post


Link to post
Kristian Ronge said:

There was one switch which looked "secret" which didn't seem to do anything but release a bunch of demons on me, have no idea what was up there.

Now that you mentioned it, I think this room is very similar to the green armor room from the original E1M1. Maybe that's why there is that switch. :)

Share this post


Link to post

Whee, time for new WAD. Zdoom, mouselook, UV, continuous play, save/reload when needed, etc.

E1M1: Maintainence Area

I really liked this map. Gameplay is good for an E1M1 - the monster count seems high but it's pretty much all zombies/imps with a few demons/spectres thrown in, but all quickly dispatched. What really stuck out to me was the design work, though. There's some good use of lighting (I really love turning around and looking back at the start building to see the cosmos casting shadows on the base, really cool) in the aesthetic sense, but mostly very good use of textures. Some of the shortened doors seem weirdly out of place, but most of the time this is done in order to fit the wall textures properly - i.e., cutting them off at a natural cut-off point instead of in the middle of the texture. It looks nice. A good example is the use of BROWNGRN offset so that the top of the texture curls around onto the bottom and makes a nice border (and also allows for a subtle different-textured-wall secret). There are a few parts where this looks weird - such as the squashed exit door which appears to be shorter than normal only so it can line up with the lowered ceiling next to it (which is itself pointless-looking), but overall it's a very crisp-looking level. Secrets-wise, I only found a few, but they're the type I like - subtle wall differences or offsets, nothing obvious but also easily seen by a player who takes a few seconds to look around. My only complaint would probably be that I took awhile to figure out how the staircase to the yellow key rose because I was too dumb to just try walking towards it. :)

I agree though that having a switch outside the exit room to make the yellow key grabable was a bit silly; just having the exit door be the yellow door would be enough.

Share this post


Link to post

BaronOfStuff said:
(Yellow Keycard atop a pillar, for some reason I didn't think to check the big silver block immediately)


You are definitely not the only person to have that issue :)





Watching Suitepee's video (though I've only got through to the start of e1m4 so far) is interesting. He's a player only, not a level designer as well, and also seems to have come to Doom pretty recently, based on his not knowing what DEU is, or how flats work, so he has very different perspectives on stuff.

Share this post


Link to post

Memfis said:
Now that you mentioned it, I think this room is very similar to the green armor room from the original E1M1. Maybe that's why there is that switch. :)

You're right! It's like a mix of two areas from E1M1 and E1M3.

E1M2 -- Central Computing
Another large E1 techbase, with a veritable shitload of monsters and secrets. The secrets aren't particularly imaginative, out of a whopping 12 only three aren't of the "push on oddly textured wall" type. However, finding some of the secrets allows you to find other secrets, which is a nice feature (though people who suck at finding secrets may feel doubly disadvantaged and disagree) ;-). The plasma rifle, especially, requires not only finding the blue key in one of the secrets (which, in turn, gives access to several other secret areas), but finding a switch in another secret area as well.

Gameplay is pretty fun; again, most of it is built on a grand scale, especially the area behind the YK door, and progression is not particularly linear, but I found it easy enough to navigate around anyway (in part thanks to visual clues, e.g. the switch to lower the yellow key, although now that I think about it that would have been no help had I not visited the room with the YK before) and the pacing was good -- there was rarely a dull moment as monsters are spread out everywhere, but also very few moments where I had to completely stop just to mow down the critters. The main course here is the titular central computing area, separated from the rest of the map via a descending floor at one end and a lift at the other, in a sort of set piece. This section is designed like something not completely unlike the original E1M2 maze but with fiercer resistance. Its appearance is beautiful, and although I loathe mazes this one was so small it managed to stay unconfusing (it's almost not even a maze). It could have been very creepy and atmospheric, too, with the attention paid to lighting here, but for me any suspense was lost because of all the monsters hurled at me throughout.

Difficulty is mostly easyish, partly because you get lots of ammo and enough health, but also because the traps -- apart from the excellent trap in the central computing area -- are kind of predictable. The trap at the first switch I pushed, I managed to inadvertently negate because I fired at monsters behind the opened door, and as I fired at those monsters I woke up the monsters in the newly opened closet and could hear their growling.

I'll play it through again without using any of the secrets and see how I do, I'm guessing it will be quite a bit more challenging without all those powerups. Oh and before I forget: even though you get the RL kind of late and the plasma rifle at the very end, I think it was really cool to serve up a few more monsters at the end to let people who don't play continuous waste some monsters with the big guns. :-) --4/5

Share this post


Link to post

Prepare for trouble!! Playing UV, pistol start, happily saving when I please.

E1M1: An alright start that offers up a lot of aggression for a starter map. The design does feel odd, as the rooms don't quite feel cohesive or flow as naturally as Fava, but the gameplay, texture use, and pacing all work well. Some tough battles here for those that don't expect it since you have to pace everything to the metronome of the shotgun, which can get pretty hairy when you're surrounded; best to play it safe and slowly. Not much more to comment on here other than I wish there was more health for some of the ambushes (especially since the armor is throw at you so late in the level), but it's only an uphill battle from here.

EDIT: And I really liked the look of the squashed exit door Magnusblitz mentions, as it made it extremely memorable for me due to the asymmetrical design.

Share this post


Link to post

Double Impact

I've been intrigued about this one. For some reason it never interested me when it was released but since then my interest in collaborative mapping has been piqued.

I'm playing in ZDoom HMP and continuous play. I'll see how long I manage without mid-level saves.

E1M1

Before we start proper I will say I like the simple but effective TITLEPIC and now I know the story the spanner replacing the skull to select from the menu is cute. The intermission is a little weird though. I would prefer something closer to the original map and the animation feels unnecessary.

Back to the levels themselves and we start outdoors in an other worldy tech station. I don't like that sky. Big pixely stars just don't look nice.

This is a bigger than normal MAP01, which is forgivable but the backtracking less so. The layout made progression feel a little chore-like, as if you're being set on errands with every switch. Speaking of which the switches with yellow door markers are just wrong. Find a different way to show what your switch does as this could confuse a player into thinking the key is needed to activate the switch.

Monster placement was quite good but I get the impression Ralphis and Rottking are keen to throw something tougher at me. I enjoyed using barrels to waste nearby zombies and imps.

E1M2

While I thought E1M1 music was just OK I liked this seemingly reworked E1M3 tune quite a lot. The level itself was a step up in general. I still didn't find the mapflow very compelling but it wasn't so chore like this time - even if I didn't often get a sense of accomplishment from progressing due to the switches not being placed near to the action they triggered.

One thing that did provided a sense of accomplishment was the secrets. There are 12 in total and, even though I only found just over half of them and several of them held low value items, cramming a load of secrets in are a good way of giving the player a little morale boost. They are like Doom's equivalent of modern games achievements.

The flashing computer area had a nice atmosphere about it. They blinking lights and multiple paths gave the monsters good opportunity to creep up on you, which keeps things a little tense. Opposition is still reserved so far. I dropped near to 50% health once or twice when I overlooked a sergeant in close proximity but still no deaths yet.

Share this post


Link to post

purist said:
Speaking of which the switches with yellow door markers are just wrong.


This "switch with key markers on it" thing seems pretty common. I don't much like it either. I get that the idea is to provide a visual clue as to what the switch does, but it also provides a visual cue that is 100% counter to the intention.

In one of my Demonfear maps, I had all the keys up on platforms that you needed to lower, and when you flicked the corresponding switch, it lowered a nearby section of wall to show the matching switch texture.

i.e. you flick a switch in a room, and a bit of wall lowers, showing the yellow key texture behind it, which is a clue that the yellow key is now accessible elsewhere.

I thought that was a pretty clever idea at the time. More people should use it :)

Share this post


Link to post

It's a matter of convention.

yellow/blue/red straps around a switch can mean:

- a key is required to press it (standard convention)
- access to a key (pcorf convention)

There was DWmegawad Club playing 2002ADO and no-one raised this issue... take ADO E3M7 as an example.

I'll start posting death count etc. stats for Double Impact from E1M4, since I know the first 3 maps pretty well. E1M1 is all right, I like the "lift textures" under doors and I'd say ammo/health is well balanced - you CAN die if you're not careful.

Share this post


Link to post
vdgg said:

There was DWmegawad Club playing 2002ADO and no-one raised this issue... take ADO E3M7 as an example.


I thought I commented on this in the 2002ADO walkthrough, but it's possible I forgot... but yeah, I found it pretty annoying there too. Just too used to the "yellow border means you need the yellow key to activate the switch" even though Doom originally didn't have keycard switches...

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, that stuff is just a matter of convention, and as long as it is consistent within the wad I see no problems.

e1m2 - demo. Cool, I finally found the blue key on this map. And still missed like half of the secrets heh. Playing this level, I remembered my main problem with Double Impact. It is super annoying dark areas with super annoying blinking lights. So far they are tolerable but on the next maps there will be some crazy epilepsy trips (I don't even want to think about that area on e1m6, ughhhh). Great iwad midi mash-up btw.

Share this post


Link to post
Memfis said:

that area on e1m6

blinky room of death!!! save up plasma!
i wanted to join the club this month, but alas, i just knew the maps too well. especially dbimpact, heh.

Share this post


Link to post

Well, actually it would be interesting to see this wad from playtester's perspective, if you have anything to say. :)

Share this post


Link to post

well, alright, i guess.

e1m1:
my least favourite map, i have to say. aside from the backtracking issue you guys already brought up i don't like the way RK is set up, particularly the lift up from the ground floor and the ledge above. if you play casual/for the first time, you're going to approach it with caution, slowly sniping away any threats. if you rush it maxdemo-style, you'll also want to grab the zerk and ride the lift for the second time, but then the ledge gets super-busy with hitscanners and frustration follows. both scenarios aren't particularly good for gameplay flow and monster migration, two things this wad otherwise excels at. also the chaingun secret is really gimmicky and silly, heh.

on the other way i love the e1m3 homage, i don't mind the waiting. the other secrets are great - they're appropriately rewarding and they don't damage map balance (this happens in too many wads out there), they complement it. the start areas are lovely and introduce the game well, the pre-exit room with all the closets leaves me lukewarm.


e1m2:
ralph's remix of adrian's pen kicks ass, it compels me to play at insanely fast and risky pace.

the map finally starts showing off the nonlinearity and interconnectivity that's going to set the tone. there are still separate functional map blocks - the northern comp maze and the southern locked section, but that's not a negative. the central part gives you tons of space to maneuver and outrun baddies, but also lets monsters walk around, chase you, take pot shots at you... this is what makes dbimpact great. and what produces stragglers in maxdemos, heh. :/

the comp maze is atmospheric and devious for the first time player, but it's not too hard to cheese it with putting your back against a wall and mowing down everything that comes into sight. i love that part where you finally get to the elevator to get you out of there, but monsters come out from little alcoves... and you can do this wallrun to get out of the trap. i live for this type of neat little tricks, heh. the highlight is still the RK room, because the way i play, i'll be worn down and vulnerable while shooting rockets and getting shot at by sergeants from multiple directions.

i have to mention how the RL and especially the secret plasma and BA at the end of the map greatly change m3, but they don't make it trivial. ammo for power weapons is always rare and the BA just lets you be more aggressive until the hitscanners wear it down, so both ways of playing (continuous, pistol starts) work well. the "continuers" will surely waste all of their edge by more reckless playing throughout m3 anyways, heh heh.

Share this post


Link to post

Alright, Double Impact. I've played this once before, and I liked it quite a bit--very bloody once it hits its stride, and I remember there being some pretty expansive maps, always a treat for me. I'll be playing as usual, using Eternity, restrained mouselook, fixed thing heights, etc. Again, it's going to be UV pistol-starts all the way. One thing: I think to be on the safe side I'll switch to ZDooM for E1M8, as that map broke in Eternity and whatever comp settings I had applied to PrBooM+ at the time when I first played it--the wall that initially blocks off the final area simply wouldn't open. This could very well have been my custom compat settings at fault, however.

E1M1 -- Maintenance Area - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
Pretty memorable opening map, if mainly for the very first area--starting out in a glorified toolshed and immediately seeing the natural terrain and the night sky (which I personally think looks pretty good, but I've a general weakness for night skies) creates a suitably atmospheric first impression. DI also wastes no time in getting the combat going, although it is admittedly a very humble beginning--as soon as the game loads, a zombieman has seen you and attacks. It'll be mostly troopers and sergeants in this one, with imps as backup and a few fairly well-utilized demons to charge you from over short distances, but most of the traditional E1 weapons--shotgun, chaingun, chainsaw--can be had before the map is half over, providing you find some of the secrets. There are also a number of skillfully placed barrels; hitting them in time to make full use of their lethal potential often requires very quick reflexes, but managing to pull off shots like that is very satisfying on a visceral level, and thankfully, if memory serves, we'll have a lot more opportunity to enjoy that warm fuzzy feeling as DI progresses.

Aesthetically it's quite Phobosian, excepting the choice of rock in the outdoor area; I have no complaints about the way it looks (including my usual pickyness about lighting), and I like that there are a few largely gameplay-superfluous but visually interesting features, like the building staircase up to the yellow key, or the aforementioned toolsheds. Except for the essentially extraneous (but nonetheless welcome) shotgun in the second shed, secrets are generally of the pushwall type, but most are telegraphed subtly, as opposed to screaming out to you to find them. Regarding the issue of backtracking to the yellow card, I've got no complaints, since you get to fight an additional battle on the way there, and another on the way back. For my part, I'm also generally not bothered by the convention of using keystripes on a switch to indicate that the switch makes the matching key accessible; in most reasonably well-arranged maps (which this is) it's pretty easy to intuit which convention is being used, and in cases where it's not clear, a mere press of the spacebar quickly settles the matter.

Pretty good start to a very good mapset.

Share this post


Link to post

e1m2
Solid tech base with nods to the IWAD e1m1 (zig zag walkway through nukage) and e1m2 (computer maze). Lots of secrets, too. I found 3, but that was only 25%. Still, I have the rocket launcher now, so it's not all bad :)

Visually the level looks good, on the whole. Quite a wide range of textures used, and SteveD will probably lament the breaches of the Romero floor rule, but I don't have any real complaints. Given the variety of textures in use, it hangs together well.

Gameplay is solid, and definitely a step up in challenge from the first level. More use of monster closets from multiple angles, and a fair few cases of enemies on multiple elevations at the same time. Bad luck with hitscanners could ruin your day here, though there is a fair amount of health around to help you out.

A good level; looking forward to more of the episode.

Share this post


Link to post

E1M2 - Central Computing
Well this steps up the difficulty, had most problems acquiring the yellow key due to a lot of shots clipping through monsters especially spectres chomping me down into single digits. Note 2 deaths came from trying to get the first blue key door secret in the nukage which has 35 health as a reward. There is a real mix of texturing here but it stays within tech base so all is fine. Found 10 of the 12 secrets in this map of course a lot of them depend on finding the secret blue key which is also a nice touch by the way. You can feel the levels connectivity and large space already and it's only E1M2. Good stuff.
Also the music kicks ass. Good job Ralphis.

Share this post


Link to post

E1M2: Central Computing

Ah yes, it all comes flooding back now. Now I remember this wad. First up the good news, it seems that on HNTR this mapset is a lot of fun, at least for me. Back when I did the newstuff review for this, because there are so many wads out there that are atrocious on the lower difficulties what I tended to do was play wads on UV or HMP with saves so that I'd actually be reviewing what most people would experience and I found this wad to be insufferable on the higher difficulties. I found it to be a frustrating wall of hitscan around every corner where I would be shredded in seconds unless I carefully peeked around every corner, and that's just boring boring boring. I remember explicitly that everyone's comments of "enough health" to just be the complete opposite of how I felt, that the pickups could easily have been tripled and I'd probably still struggle. That's why I don't play most other shooters as I just can't deal with that sort of gameplay. I've also remembered that I never actually finished the wad because I found E1M8 hard as shit even on ITYTD but I'm sure we'll get to that when it comes.

See, while I may have moaned that Fava Beans was lacking in gameplay I'd much rather have wads that are too easy rather than too hard because at least then all of the other areas of design in the wad can still be experienced and enjoyed. It's why I play on HNTR now (I find the double ammo of ITYTD tends to make the experience worse). Everyone loves to say how good stuff like Alien Vendetta and Hell Revealed are but those are straight up impossible so I don't get the opportunity to play them (I don't think I've ever made it past level... 04 in AV I think? This is on HNTR. The Scythe series later maps can go jump off a bridge too, such poorly balanced wads good grief.) Of course, while I can enjoy trivially easy maps nothing makes a wad better than making sure the lower difficulties are fun. Double Impact seems to, at least for now, and if it keeps it up I'll have to revise my opinion of the wad to be one that's much more positive. Hooray!

I'm doing too much ranting on these forums lately.

Share this post


Link to post

E1M2: Central Computing

Another fun romp, though I admit by the time I got to the yellow door I was feeling a bit ready for the level to end - 265 monsters is a lot, even if they're mostly zombies and imps. (The next has 400+, so...) It's a nice techbase though, with the KDITD nods that Cappellan mentioned but also good variance in texture usage to set areas apart - the computer maze, the tan-colored area you can view the yellow key from, the green/grey area after the yellow door, etc. I really like how the author throws in some zig-zagged lines in some areas - I'm thinking the tan area you can view the yellow key from; the ceiling is all zig-zagged and it gave me a somewhat subtle feeling of "this isn't right" (as opposed to the usually orthogonal design of most techbases). Lots of monster closets (in a good sense), though I did feel a bit cheesed when I died on the demon/spectre hallway one in the computer maze. And yeah, nice music choice with the remix.

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×