Ukraine and the current situation

[Mordeth]

myk said:
A free-trade treaty would be more likely, as it does with those outside Europe.

That's more or less what this 'eastern partnership' deal is all about. A very loose affiliation with benefits, as opposed to actual candidacy status. This was rejected by the (previous) Ukrainian government because they need money right now, and not later.

The US government has already offered financial aid. This means that Ukraine does not have to reform significantly and its populace remains stuck in the situation they are in now. The US gets its paws on a country right between the EU and Russia, containing a gas pipeline to the EU and a main Russian military harbor. And since Putin is actually competent, he'll take drastic measures if need be to stop this scenario from happening.

[188DarkRevived]

Mordeth said:

The US gets its paws on a country right between the EU and Russia, containing a gas pipeline to the EU and a main Russian military harbor. And since Putin is actually competent, he'll take drastic measures if need be to stop this scenario from happening.

Indeed! What infuriates my father more than anything else at the moment is the fact that the Pro-EU crowd was somehow being funded and motivated by the US from the very beginning, before any of the actual physical violence and vandalism even began to occur.
We don't think that sneakily planting the seeds for corruption and conflict should be a part of any constitution whatsoever.
Putin is clearly on the defensive and doing the right thing in this particular scenario. However, this does not imply that he has always been a saint in everything that he ever did. I'm only referring to the particular situation at hand as I type this.

[myk]

188DarkRevived said:
What infuriates my father more than anything else at the moment is the fact that the Pro-EU crowd was somehow being funded and motivated by the US from the very beginning, before any of the actual physical violence and vandalism even began to occur.

Not unlikely, although the funding is generally from multinational financial groups, which US intelligence and diplomats give cover and some aid to, linked to financial parties in Ukraine. Especially since 9/11 and Iraq, the US military and intelligence services are half privatized, and anything they do is dependent on and linked to these private and market interests. This is one reason I think that the US aid to Ukraine can only be short-term. Anything else would have what really fuels US interventionism asking for something back from Ukraine, especially with the cost-cutting and debt pressures on Washington.

I noticed that, back when Syria almost got attacked through an air strike, it became evident the US government (or the Democrat Party in power) as such wasn't really interested in doing that, even though some lobbies influencing it were. Aside from a general lack of support worldwide, Obama was lucky enough that the British parliament less-than-expectedly rejected the air strike, which gave him a strong card to play against it. And now, check out this article; most comments from named officials are relatively tame. The harsher ones come from some legislators and unnamed officials (which may or may not be entirely real). That arguably shows the caution from the Federal Government versus the underlying push from lobbies that infest it, which also work through private media, such as the Washington Post. It's funny how the article is in the National Security section. US National Security issues now occur right next to Russia!

[Maes]

myk said:

It's funny how the article is in the National Security section. US National Security issues now occur right next to Russia!

In Soviet Europe, Russia invades US!

I mean, why push "just" for being a EU member? Go all the way and proclaim Ukraine the 51st state. Only problem is, there's a long line of wannabe 51st-staters, and I think Albania and Kosovo come first :-)

[Gez]

Maes said:

In Soviet Europe, Russia invades US!

I mean, why push "just" for being a EU member? Go all the way and proclaim Ukraine the 51st state. Only problem is, there's a long line of wannabe 51st-staters, and I think Albania and Kosovo come first :-)

Isn't the whole of EU the 51st state, by virtue of having the UK in it?

[DooM_RO]

I am from Romania, another former communist country and as I am not very skilled in politics could someone more skilled tell me how this could potentially affect my country?

[machoman127]

Sure looks like Putin has made Obama his bitch.

[Maes]

DooM_RO said:

I am from Romania, another former communist country and as I am not very skilled in politics could someone more skilled tell me how this could potentially affect my country?

[Avoozl]

Why are you using a map from 1992? You're living in the past, man!

[Maes]

Avoozl said:

Why are you using a map from 1992? You're living in the past, man!

In Soviet Moldavia, past lives IN YOU!

[Gez]

machoman127 said:

Sure looks like Putin has made Obama his bitch.

Raised eyebrows and waggled fingers are not going to change Putin's minds, and let's be honest nobody wants to go farther than that against a bellicose Tsar.

[Maes]

Gez said:

nobody wants to go farther than that against a bellicose well meaning, generous and merciful Tsar, who only wants to bring peace to the region and to fill the Ukrainian people's pockets with petro-Rubles rather than their devaluated hryvnias.

FTFY <3

printz said:

joining the EU has been pretty cool for me and others, directly (in a short term kind of way, let's say). Free money :P

Well, that's the appetizing glazing of the so-called "EU cake". Wait until you'll have to take a deeper bite into it. ;-)

http://picsfarms.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Epic-cake.jpg [Kind of NSFW]

You're gonna discover that, unlike the pic above, the filling of that EU cake ain't made of chocolate ;-)

[188DarkRevived]

DooM_RO said:

I am from Romania, another former communist country and as I am not very skilled in politics could someone more skilled tell me how this could potentially affect my country?

From what I understand, if NATO succeeds in taking away our naval base then you won't be able to receive any natural gas as a sign of revenge.
Repercussions are everywhere for every decision on both sides. Only makes things fair game. *sigh*

[dew]

Sigh, that's two shithole images in three posts. Can't you just link that crap, Maes? For greater safety at work... :)

[Maes]

Putin's manly launch of his massive ICBM pumped me up so hard that I pulled out my old Ruki Vverh CDs and all Nazi Pirates exploded.

[Technician]

IT'S HAPPENING!

[Sicamore]

Hide all the NATO flavored Turkey D:

http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKBREA2314820140304?irpc=932

[Jimothy]

Anyone want to bet that the Ukraine and Russia are going to be at war soon? ...No? Alright then.

In all seriousness, it's getting insanely tense, what with the insertion of Russian soldiers, and then the subsequent test-launch of an ICBM. It feels like Red Storm Rising all over again, but that's just me.

[Sicamore]

I think the icbm test was scheduled months before, but the situation is beyond Ukraine now, and is indeed tense on an international level.

[Stygian]

Technician said:
IT'S HAPPENING!

I thought the Cold War ended over two decades ago, but now I'm not so sure.

[Cupboard]

What a show of dickflappery. Not quite as impressive as taking out Saddam within two weeks via an ill-conceived war but Russia's dick stands tall this day, glistening with dew.

[Technician]

TheCupboard said:

What a show of dickflappery. Not quite as impressive as taking out Saddam within two weeks via an ill-conceived war but Russia's dick stands tall this day, glistening with dew.

Yeah, dew is a cocksucker.

[188DarkRevived]

Apparently America is butthurt about accepting that it doesn't own the world and can't always get everything that it wants. Poor poor baby. Awww. Need a tissue and a diaper change? :p

Meanwhile, one of my dad's Jewish friends is probably uncorking a bottle of champagne right now.
And heck, even I'm getting a boner from the glorious news. Hell yeah!

*turns on the song "Smack My Bitch Up" by The Prodigy up to maximum volume!*

[DooM_RO]

188DarkRevived said:

From what I understand, if NATO succeeds in taking away our naval base then you won't be able to receive any natural gas as a sign of revenge.
Repercussions are everywhere for every decision on both sides. Only makes things fair game. *sigh*

But what did WE ever do to them? No one I know has any quarrel with the Russians.

[Cupboard]

I grow weary of all this. When is North Korea going to test their next ICBM technology or satellite probe?

[dew]

TheCupboard said:

I grow weary of all this. When is North Korea going to test their next ICBM technology or satellite probe?

Uhm. I blame filthy imperialist media for keeping this resounding victory over capitalism off the main pages. Then again, short range missiles, meh. Supreme Leader's heart isn't in it, so he might sit this one out.

[Quasar]

John Kerry is the biggest hypocrite in the whole pile of hypocrites in Washington with his shit-eating grin and complete bullcrap about invasions. The US invades whatever it wants with or without provocation. And I firmly believe the US is at least partially behind all of this to begin with, just as they have been in all the Arab countries.

[Technician]

Quasar said:

John Kerry is the biggest hypocrite in the whole pile of hypocrites in Washington with his shit-eating grin and complete bullcrap about invasions. The US invades whatever it wants with or without provocation. And I firmly believe the US is at least partially behind all of this to begin with, just as they have been in all the Arab countries.

Yeah I rolled my eyes, too. As we speak drones are flying around Pakistan and Yemen and they can somehow manage to condemn a competing country of doing the same.

[Quasar]

If you believe Russian media, there hasn't even BEEN an invasion so far, because Russia is legally allowed up to 24000 troops in the Crimea as per its agreement with the Ukraine made after the dissolution of the USSR, ratified by both governments in 1997. Anybody want to comment on the veracity of that?

[188DarkRevived]

Quasar said:

If you believe Russian media, there hasn't even BEEN an invasion so far, because Russia is legally allowed up to 24000 troops in the Crimea as per its agreement with the Ukraine made after the dissolution of the USSR, ratified by both governments in 1997. Anybody want to comment on the veracity of that?

YES! My parents are following the news through several Russian-spoken sources. And this is indeed true.
Never trust what the North American tabloids feed you. Open your mind and reach out for the real truth. Don't be a sheep.