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gggmork

moments when doom cheats against you

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Next time your death is caused by cheap bullshit, almost like the game programmers were evil geniuses that deliberately programmed a million subtle ways for the game to conspire against you, feel free to describe the incident.

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A cyberdemon was facing me and about to shoot, so I dodged to the right, but NOOOOOoooooOOOO. Turns out, even though his animation frame INDICATED he was facing toward me because he's limited to only 8 rotation frames in 45 degree chunks, he was ACTUALLY facing some degrees to the side, probably conveniently EXACTLY the maximum amount to NOT trigger the next 45 degree angle animation frame chunk, infighting someone behind me to the right, resulting in his rocket essentially heat seeking exactly where I dodged. In other words, it was a classic "What? I was only infighting!" attack. Oh yeah... infighting exactly where I was moving, nice plausible deniability buster!

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Lost souls sometimes start to behave like if I was playing with fast monsters on (which I didn't), usually whenever I'm very low on health and hold a weapon with long reload time (SG, SSG) and don't have a good luck at aiming. Despite my attempts to dodge, the lost soul just missed me, bumped to a wall and immediately attacked me again, and it repeated until my death. I've got killed this way several times, last time it was very recently. I feel it's mainly my own fault to not being able to deal with a silly lost soul, but my point is, random numbers sometimes seem to work against us.

That reminds me, I'm under an impression that revenant's missile deals maximum (80) damage way more often than any other damage, my experience says so.

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Two days ago an arch-vile popped from behind my back and screamed. Of course I instantly covered behind a wall, then as soon as I try to hit him, BAM 80 damage. Oops sorry man, I didn't mean to cheat and actually started attacking you 3 seconds ago, I just forgot to cover you in flames this time...

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Mr cybie just did was I wrote previously again, but the rocket went past me and hit the wall. I was like who were you 'infighting' that time? The fucking wall?! But then I realized he shoots 3 rocket in a row and I guess the first 2 rockets killed what he was infighting (again conveniently in a perfect angle to predict where I was going to move to) then the 3rd rocket shot through the now dead corpse to hit me.

Then a vile was flaming me and a stupid little former human got ALL UP in my way. I forgot but was probably loading the gun so couldn't use it. I try to move to the left around him, no good, try going around to the right instead *vile blast*. In other words, a classic 'clutteryness and inability to maneuver varies proportionally with danger levels' attack.

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Getting arch-viled, then having a lost soul finish me off in mid-flight.

Spoiler

fuck you Tarnsman

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Infinitely tall monsters, archvile's lack of warning flames for whatever reason, any projectile or monster doing its MAXIMUM damage just when it will conveniently fuck you up more (no armor, low health), 80 HP Revenant fireballs, revenants surviving infighting with Hell Knights or even Barons, and then still going after you.

To be honest however, I'd say that Doom is a comparatively fair game, and that if you die, your fault 99.99% of the time. The player has already enough of a headstart and trump cards vs the monsters and even the game itself (wallrunning, SR-50 movement etc.) to really be entitled to complain. Once you learn the potential "cheats" of the game, you can just change your tactics to avoid them.

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About half of my deaths are down to pure bullshit. Magically expanding projectile hitboxes are a common one.

Jimmy said:

Getting arch-viled, then having a lost soul finish me off in mid-flight.


Heh, I remember that
Would've made a great addition to the Stream Silliness series

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I have to concur with the Archvile bullcrap. Nothing worse than moving to where you think you've broken the line of sight only to have him blast you anyway. Other than that, the only time I've ever really felt cheated was getting telefragged on MAP30 with invincibility on. Yeah, I know I was cheating, too, but it just seems wrong to get cheated right back.

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The berserk pack outside of advanced ports is ridiculous. What is, in my opinion, one of the most fun weapons in the game is next to impossible to use because I keep sliding off my enemies and punching right next to them with no effect. It doesn't help that the damage output range is so wide.

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Revenant rockets have tendency to get full blow on me. You thought you took only superficial damage? NOPE FUCK YOU *80 HP away*. And RNG hates you and your mom.

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The Mancubus fireball wall passthrough, and the hitscan pass through are the best known ways Doom cheats on you.

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I might be wrong but I remember noticing that projectiles do less damage if they just graze the size of your hitbox as opposed to hitting you dead on. Revenant missiles home in and thus hit dead center more often, maybe that's why they often seem to do high damage? Yeah, viles setting up a covert insta-attack by conveniently not indicating so with any flame animation is even more annoying than having your field of vision blocked by it. Viles would be better if a the flame was in the shape of an arrow pointing toward the vile so you know where it is or something (and always appeared but more transparent).

'if you die, (its) your fault 99.99% of the time'
Yeah... your fault for playing or making a really hard map.

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Monsters having infinite autoaim range and the ability to shoot from crazy angles.

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gggmork said:

I might be wrong but I remember noticing that projectiles do less damage if they just graze the size of your hitbox as opposed to hitting you dead on.

Nowt but coincidence. Doom's simply not that complex.

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Jimmy said:

Getting arch-viled, then having a lost soul finish me off in mid-flight.

This is not cheating, this is a set play. They must have practiced this a lot.

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Manc fireball noclipping and no fire Vileblasts are really the only two things I'd toss into the "proper bullshit" category, since they're a legitimate bug and a programming oversight, respectively. Infiniheight blocking and melee clipping are annoying too but generally those can be blamed on mapping mistakes or my own dumbness. :P

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as i wrote in some other thread, it pisses me off when weak monsters do their maximum damage. everyone knows a cyber can kill one easily, but getting gunned down by zombiemen? bah.

to be fair, i barely remember encountering the blockmap bug and the mancubus passthrough bug, but do these exist in (g)zdoom or were they fixed there? because that`s what i use mostly.

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BaronOfStuff said:

When a Zombieman scores a hit from further than 512 map units away. Fuck you, Doom. Fuck you.


when a sergeant scores with all three pellets from a similar distance. trust me it does happen.

also, 1. Fire rocket in hopes of hitting distant monster. 2. Split second when I pull trigger a monster teleports directly in front of my face close range. 3. Splat.

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When Shooting a rocket and a lost soul pops up from the middle of no were causing me to commit suicide on my player.

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Maes said:revenants surviving infighting with Hell Knights or even Barons, and then still going after you.


Ever notice that the offended monster has a slight advantage in the resulting infight?

Obhack map, little teeny narrow slit window you could barely peer through, so I'm peering through it, and took a rocket in the eye from a cybe clear at the other end of the world. Stood back shaking my head in wonder and got another rocket up my nose through the same microscopic window. Began to consider whether that cybe was using an aiming cheat.

Oh, and monsters with eyes in the back of their heads. What's with that??

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Rez said:

Oh, and monsters with eyes in the back of their heads. What's with that??


When did that happen? Monsters only use something that behaves like normal sight when they are dormant. Once they are awakened however, they know exactly the current XYZ coordinates of the player, and simply home onto them as if by "instinct", using a simple pathfinding algorithm to navigate around obstacles

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When the Cassali brothers 'Plutonia'd' me on my first playthrough of their incredible megawad called 'Plutonia', yeah.

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Maes said:
When did that happen? Monsters only use something that behaves like normal sight when they are dormant. Once they are awakened however, they know exactly the current XYZ coordinates of the player, and simply home onto them as if by "instinct", using a simple pathfinding algorithm to navigate around obstacles


There have always been a few who will wake up as if they see you even tho they're asleep and looking the other way -- you think you're gonna sneak up squarely behind 'em, but they wake up anyway the moment you pass a certain point (maybe a sector boundary?), usually the visual equivalent of about 10-15 feet away.

Might be some bug in enemy line of sight vs sectors vs reject (maybe one of 'em wraps around?), and applies only for monsters placed in certain relationships to whatever is buggy, since if a given monster is affected he will ALWAYS do it, but those not affected NEVER do it. -- Maybe it causes them to be "tapped on the shoulder" rather than see you, I dunno. Rather more common in older maps.

I'd never thought to look at enemy placement in an editor and check if there's a common factor, but I'm sufficiently useless with an editor that I might not see what's going on, either.

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