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Catoptromancy

Wolf SS

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Quite awhile ago darknation posted this on irc and said it could be used in Freedoom. I think it would make excellent wolf ss replacement. Maybe replace other stuff as well? If we can find him, maybe he has more frames or other stuff.




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This looks good, at least much better than the current one (though I appreciate the tremendous amount of work it must have taken to digitize the current hand-drawn sprites).

It's good to see so much love for Freedoom recently!

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I just found that exact sprite sheet on my hard drive (dated June 2010), thought it was really cool, wondered where on earth it came from, and a bit of searching on DW I find this not-too-necro thread.

Anyway, I very much concur that this would make a much better SS sprite than the current "garbage" (as one person very tactfully put it).

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I think that these sprites would be far better suited for Freedoom than the ones which currently are being used by the SS.

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I really like those textures too. It would be most awesome if we had a small set, just large enough to fill in all the wolf textures.

Wolf pwads in Freedoom would feel like an entirely different game with a really cool style.

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With this being a modern game (or recreation of a game), why not replace the super-secret enemies with some kind of internet meme? I know it sounds stupid, but it would be cool to have a level that literally makes people's eyes widen. And I don't think an ordinary reference Easter egg is going to do more than make experienced Doomers say, "Oh, cool."

Besides, all we have so far for a super-secret level is a boring castle. Not a bad level, in any way, but doesn't deserve the Level 32 slot and is hideously misplaced there. And Level 31 was already a castle.


At the very least, I want to see a Club Freedoom.

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Joe667 said:

With this being a modern game (or recreation of a game), why not replace the super-secret enemies with some kind of internet meme?


Oh sure, use an internet meme. It will cause freedoom to become dated in five years or less.....

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My main problem with these is the thick black borders making it really stand out as cartoon-ish. Not that the rest of Freedoom isn't cartoony, but we've avoided simulating the cell-shaded look.

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chungy said:

My main problem with these is the thick black borders making it really stand out as cartoon-ish. Not that the rest of Freedoom isn't cartoony, but we've avoided simulating the cell-shaded look.

Yeah. While I think they're neat sprites, I'm not too keen on them being used in Freedoom due to the clash in art style (as if Freedoom didn't already have enough of that). Speaking of "keen", I did go with an outlined 8-bit style sprite for my Keen replacement only to mimick the style of the original. I think it's fine though because the character is just a generic cat and in no way resembles anything that id Software has done. But I'd prefer to see a more typical clay model sprite occupy the slot for the SS replacements.

In regards to the wall textures, I'm curious on others' thoughts involving the obvious George W. Bush lookalike. I personally think it's kinda funny and think we should at least keep the concept even if it's replaced with a better looking version, but I wonder about the political implications.

id was already being political when they lampooned Hitler, who is widely regarded as a horrible war criminal and rightly so, with only a small minority of neonazis defending him. Bush might be more sensitive since some at least in the US (though the number has been dwindling as the aftermath of his invasions has proven disasterous) might defend him. But internationally, he is widely regarded as a war criminal (because he fucking is one). The race/religious genocide on Bush's side was a bit more subtle and nuanced, while Hitler was pretty up-front about it in his speeches. Being so far removed from contemporary times solidifies his agreed-upon war criminal status, whereas Bush's crimes only took place in the last decade and only now are the signs of ruin and chaos showing themselves more clearly (it was already bad during the invasion, but I think that the presence of ISIS is even worse).

Besides, Freedoom itself is already political. Aside from already lampooning Bush, it clearly takes a stance against proprietary software and endorses free software (the whole point of the project), and it's alleged that AGM stands for Apple, Google and Microsoft which are all companies that are increasingly being considered as privacy invaders with access to too much information and are thus real world 'evil' corporations.

Oh god, what have I done? I'm turning Freedoom into a political debate!

Spoiler

:P

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I hope the Bush lookalike stays, for what it's worth!

And Sodaholic, I agree that the art style clashes, but surely it doesn't clash quite as bad as what's already there :P

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i hope this sprite does get used, sure its a different style, but it helps reinforce the idea that its supposed to be from another game

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I am more hyped than ever about these. I want an entire MAP32 of his work. One wolf ss replacement sprite, replace wolf textures, sounds, and that crystal for a keen.

The crystal would be upside down hanging from the cieling, its death frames would have it shattering.

Instead of replacing the wolf textures though, I would not mind adding his few in addition to the current ones. This allows a darknation style TC of one map, and normal wolf pwads would still use our current wolf style textures.

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I couldn't agree more with the above. Keep the cat, just because it's awesome. But the enemy sprite and walls would be a phenomenal replacement to the existing Map31 + 32 sprites / textures.

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Sodaholic said:

Besides, Freedoom itself is already political. Aside from already lampooning Bush, it clearly takes a stance against proprietary software and endorses free software

Eh, I can't speak for the Freedoom masterminds. But I'd assume it's doing whatever it's supposed to be doing: be legally free for copyleft reuse, and (why not) poke fun at those who aren't.

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Someone pointed me to this thread.

I'm willing to knock up a wolf 3D replacement / textures for special level. But I really need someone to tell me EXACTLY what is required... someone fire a design brief up my ass and we'll work from there.

edit: flick through my blog, see if there is anything that strikes anyone as being useful for this project. Idea, theme, whatever. The blessings of whoever in in charge of this freedoom thing would also be nice.

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WofSS replacement needs to shoot bullets like a wolfss and be about the same size because of the hitbox size. Those are the only real limitations.

I think total control of design should be up to you to make it completely unique. You can do the textures, map, wolf sprite, and sounds the sprite makes.

Some reason people people like the cat for keen.

I am not sure, but there may be wolf-only hanging sprites. Those can likely be replaced as well. Someone can run a script on our sprites to see which ones are not used, and those are likely the wolf ones.

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darknation said:

the wolfSS uses the shotgun sounds for firing, correct?

Yes, it uses same attack as the Chaingunner (A_CPosAttack) which uses the shotgun sound.

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It's actually much less accurate, less rapid and I think it's weaker, butnother than that yeah.

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It's less rapid because it is called less often; but it's otherwise entirely identical to the chaingunner attack. Exactly as precise and as powerful. If you use dehacked to tweak the SS's attack state to give it the same rate of fire as the chaingunner, you'll see it's not weaker or less accurate.

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To go with the Bush paintings, what if the SS guys were modeled after modern (not futuristic) soldiers? Though not exactly accurate, I'd rather have the Vietnam look since that's what most people think of when thinking of US soldiers.

In the meantime, I may attempt a better looking version of the Bush painting.

printz said:

Eh, I can't speak for the Freedoom masterminds. But I'd assume it's doing whatever it's supposed to be doing: be legally free for copyleft reuse, and (why not) poke fun at those who aren't.

Not sure if you can tell, but I was being completely facetious in regards to all of those political things. I mean, they are my opinions (that Bush is a war criminal and deserves to be mocked) but I was basically running my mouth for no practical purpose.

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Sodaholic said:

To go with the Bush paintings, what if the SS guys were modeled after modern (not futuristic) soldiers? Though not exactly accurate, I'd rather have the Vietnam look since that's what most people think of when thinking of US soldiers.

In the meantime, I may attempt a better looking version of the Bush painting.

Not sure if you can tell, but I was being completely facetious in regards to all of those political things. I mean, they are my opinions (that Bush is a war criminal and deserves to be mocked) but I was basically running my mouth for no practical purpose.

I debated this myself. Personally, I'd prefer to go with Tony Blair; that fucking GRIN leering from the paintings on the wall, jaunty Jingo music, Zombie metropolitan police, the occasional corpse of an innocent bystander, the wood and pomp of parliament to inspire the textures...

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