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Maximumfish

Doom II maps, looking for opinions/advice

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I've got 2 maps so far, Doom II replacements for MAP07 and MAP10 (I liked the music, and I haven't quite got the hang of Slade yet, so you'll have to idclev to them, sorry in advance!), and was hoping to get some feedback from some of you experienced mappers, see how i can improve and if it's worth it to try to turn this into a maybe 5 map deal and try to get it on the idgames database.

So far there are no skill levels implemented (it's basically UV as is), and the second, MAP10, has no secrets yet.

The first is a more hell-themed deal which i had envisioned going first in a longer set. Here are some screenshots:








The second is more techy looking, and i had thought it would run after the first. Screenshots:










You can download the file here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_bXj73TkAGVSFFCRXlWSkUxdGs/edit?usp=sharing


It's been probably 15 years since the last time i made Doom levels, so i'm thinking i'll need some help getting good at this. Thanks in advance!

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Oh, and i forgot to say they were designed for gzdoom / zdoom, and are almost certainly not vanilla compatible, and i haven't tested with prboom/chocolate doom or anything else.

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meh, something's not working with the image provider (or my browser settings). i only see the thumbnails. but these look very nice. i especially like what you did with these red window type things in the first shot.

i also like the brown floor texture and the tree things on the ground. the colors fit pretty nice. the brown and the green and the red also give a nice contrast.

going to download the map and take a look at it.

btw. if you don't already, i recommend you use gzdoombuilder. you will get much better results for the circular structures with this editor than in doombuilder where you have build everything by hand. both editors are basically the same but gzdoombuilder offers some more tools for sector building.

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zzzornbringer said:

meh, something's not working with the image provider (or my browser settings). i only see the thumbnails. but these look very nice. i especially like what you did with these red window type things in the first shot.

i also like the brown floor texture and the tree things on the ground. the colors fit pretty nice. the brown and the green and the red also give a nice contrast.

going to download the map and take a look at it.

btw. if you don't already, i recommend you use gzdoombuilder. you will get much better results for the circular structures with this editor than in doombuilder where you have build everything by hand. both editors are basically the same but gzdoombuilder offers some more tools for sector building.



Thanks for taking a look, and for the heads up about gzdoombuilder! I'm using doombuilder 2 right now, so ill give that a shot. I don't know what's up with imageshack, it was acting funny when I uploaded the pictures too...

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hihi, here's some fdas (recorded in zdoom2.7.1): http://www.mediafire.com/download/i8a3531r1htxqq4/2levtest_fda_rbk_zd271.zip

Overall the maps weren't too shabby, it was pretty easy to just run past many of the traps/monsters, but I suppose that may have been intended. I think my favorite part was the teleporting skull arena thing in map07, pretty interesting idea. Some misc thoughts:

- map07 seems to transition from absurdly tight spaces (that are somewhat awkward to maneuver in) and overly large spaces (where non-hitscan enemies basically become harmless). perhaps widening some corridors and shrinking some of the big areas might balance things out a bit.
- there was a chaingunner stuck on a pillar by the start of map10
- some people find the overly bumpy floors (e.g. starting area of map10) to be cumbersome to move around in

In general you seem to have a decent idea of the types of layouts that can be made (i.e. linear, map07 or nonlinear "get three keys in any order then exit" map10), so my only advice would be to continue experimenting with letting the player progress through a level in multiple ways, maybe add some additional interconnectivity between areas, visual or otherwise. And perhaps fool around with bulkier structural detailing (e.g. overhangs, balconies, etc). Also don't be afraid to ratchet the difficulty up a notch or two, people are pretty good at this game nowadays :D

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For me personally, I thought the difficulty level was perfect. If you do ramp it, make sure to preserve it as-is in HMP :)

I thought Map07 was an interesting beast - I think the huge open cave area is perfect (and quite frankly, nice to be in) but I do agree that some of the cramped hallways could be expanded ever so slightly. I really liked coming down off the big cross, defeating the big wave of baddies, then riding the other cross up after killing the archie, these are the nice touches that make Doom maps feel whole.

It's quite odd to see a tech map come after a hellish map, but that's not to say you shouldn't do it, I'm just not used to it. I noticed a big hall of mirrors in the outdoor sky area, I think this could be fixed by having the "sky border" sector 1 px tall rather than 0 (which I'm assuming it is right now). I also agree that the bumy floor is a bit odd, but it's not a big deal by any means. Other than that, you've got a cool map here!

As far as getting custom music into your maps, it will be as simple as copying the D_SHAWN and D_DEAD lumps from doom2.wad, pasting them into your wad, and renaming them D_RUNNIN and D_STALKS, that way you can reassign your maps as 01 and 02 and players won't have to worry about idclev-ing. Here's a full list of what lump names correspond to map slots: http://doom.wikia.com/wiki/Doom_II_music

Looking forward to more!

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Ribbiks said:

hihi, here's some fdas (recorded in zdoom2.7.1): http://www.mediafire.com/download/i8a3531r1htxqq4/2levtest_fda_rbk_zd271.zip

Overall the maps weren't too shabby, it was pretty easy to just run past many of the traps/monsters, but I suppose that may have been intended. I think my favorite part was the teleporting skull arena thing in map07, pretty interesting idea. Some misc thoughts:

- map07 seems to transition from absurdly tight spaces (that are somewhat awkward to maneuver in) and overly large spaces (where non-hitscan enemies basically become harmless). perhaps widening some corridors and shrinking some of the big areas might balance things out a bit.
- there was a chaingunner stuck on a pillar by the start of map10
- some people find the overly bumpy floors (e.g. starting area of map10) to be cumbersome to move around in

In general you seem to have a decent idea of the types of layouts that can be made (i.e. linear, map07 or nonlinear "get three keys in any order then exit" map10), so my only advice would be to continue experimenting with letting the player progress through a level in multiple ways, maybe add some additional interconnectivity between areas, visual or otherwise. And perhaps fool around with bulkier structural detailing (e.g. overhangs, balconies, etc). Also don't be afraid to ratchet the difficulty up a notch or two, people are pretty good at this game nowadays :D



Cool, thank you. I was worried about the cramped bits at the beginning of map7, I guess ill nees to expand that out some. On the traps, I'll just need to figure out away to make them less escapable without trapping the player in the room. I'll check out the FDA's when I get home (out of curiosity, what does fda stand for anyway?). Thanks again!

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Pretty good for a 15-year comeback, specially map 10 when you get to the "top" area. I ran out of ammo on this map, had to punch two chaingunners and that obviously went bad. But I liked it, anyway. Keep it up.

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Maximumfish said:

(out of curiosity, what does fda stand for anyway?)


"first demo attempt", basically a recording of playing the level for the first time. They can be useful for seeing how someone unfamiliar with your map approaches each situation, can give you ideas about balancing health/ammo, making certain things harder/easier, etc. I apologize in advance for my shitty playing in those demos, I'm not used to freelook so I waste a lot of ammo firing above/below enemies :p

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Doomkid: thanks for the suggestion on the music, and for that link, that's exactly what i was looking for. I'll give the sky border thing a shot, i was worried about HOM stuff with those un-textured areas on the horizon.

Darch: I'll probably add some more ammo to map10. I like the resource-constrained feel of some wads/levels and was definitely going for that, but having to try and punch out chaingunners isn't very much fun.

Ribbiks: I watched the fdas (after some technical difficulties - it's pretty funny watching them without loading my wad file first...), and first off holy hell you are good at this game. I see what you meant about the traps being easily avoidable. I moved some of the triggers and made some of the doors open quicker, and added demons behind the player in the revenant ambush at the blue key area in map7, to pin the player down. Still got some learning to do on the traps...

On the whole, watching someone else play through the level is extremely helpful (which probably should have been obvious), so thanks again.

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So it's been like 3 years or something, but i went back to work on this some more and figured at the rate i'm going i may as well stop at three maps and call it a thing.  Here is the near final version, with pretty much everything in place except for difficulty level implementation (shooting for the current difficulty to be UV).  I tried to incorporate a lot of the feedback from the above posts into the first two levels.  I think the third map turned out really well, there's a gimmick in this one i'm particularly proud of, but i haven't gotten anyone to play this one outside of my wife so could be some stuff that needs work there.

 

Here's some screenshots:

uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVbXN0d

uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVS2xDc

uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVRXN0T
uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVcndyW

uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVd1JUb
uc?export=download&id=0B_bXj73TkAGVdHQ5M

 

Here's the download link if interested:

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_bXj73TkAGVc1RMX1lMWll1eGM/view?usp=sharing

 

Thanks!

 

 

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i am no pro mapper or something, just a DooM veteran, and i really liked it. The architectural design was really impressive for me. A few small notes:

 

- I picked up the blue Key, and dont really know if i used it, no biggie, but something like this is somehow hard to notice on your map.

- Maybe put a small section of blood (i assume) on the floor near or at the start the player absolutely has to walk over to demonstrate that it doesnt damage him.

- If there is a chaingun somewhere, i missed it. (those two guys at the end dont really count)

- I felt a bit weak against the revenants, and very overpowered at the end. Both are no big deal, but maybe put a chaingunner at the graveyard. I dont really know if the dropped chaingun would make the revenants eat dust in a less dangerous way, but i assume the SSG i see in the screenshots but didnt find myself would solve that problem. On the other hand the graveyard is really cool like that without enemies in it and the revenants are also a cool "oh crap!" moment.

 

Those arent really critical points you know. Just a few personal pointers. I had real fun to play your map. It is very clear from the start how much work, thought and love went into this map. Great work!

 

 

 

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Thanks Karacho for taking a look!  On the first map the blue key opened the door across the bridge leading to the yellow key area (the blue torches were supposed to indicate that this was a blue door, but maybe i should add the actual blue door stripes or something?).

 

For the damaging "blood" floor that's something i hadn't thought of.  I've got two areas with blood floor textures, one damages the other does not.  There's not really any necessity for the first to damage the player, so maybe i'll just remove that (maybe put some enemies down there also).

 

There is a chaingun in a secret area down in the big open underground cavern area. There isn't an SSG on the first map, that was just me IDKFA'ing to take screenshots :) .  I could put some chaingunners down in the "blood" area maybe so players are better equipped to handle the revenants.

 

Thanks again!

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