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40oz

The Doom4Guy Personality

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Having heard the Doom trailer portrays the game as a modernized capitalization on Brutal Doom fame, it has me wondering what character traits our hero is going to have in the next Doom title.

Lately, it would seem that there is an unusual uprise of Doom-related fanart coming out, often portraying Doom guy as the steroid-juiced, blood-soaked killing machine, often in an almost memetic context. I suspect these views were perpetuated by things like the comedic nature of the Doom comic book and the relentless torture-porn that happens in Brutal Doom. Funny, seeing the Doom guy displayed in such a manner, as almost 10 years ago when the Doom comic was scanned and uploaded for the 10th cacowards, I seem to recall most people cringing at the thought our Doom Guy being so "corny" and being visualized as the alpha male equivalent of a maniacal bloodthirsty psychopath complete with comedic monologues and silly catch phrases. I've often pictured the space marine as more of a survivalist than some sort of street-jacket lunatic with an irrational hatred for monsters drenched in the blood of its foes -- except when carrying a berserk pack. (No rational minded person could punch something in a flurry of bloody shreds with such overkill.)

Doom guy can move really fast, kill large quantities of evil demons with ease (often with very gorey violent deaths), grits his teeth in anger when firing at somethings that takes too long to die, and displays a devilish grin when acquiring a new weapon. With that much to go on, I can see how one might think of Doom guy that way, but it seems more like it's a personality that's better fit for someone like Duke Nukem than our Doom Guy. I have reason to believe that Doom 4 will start the Doom Guy with a berserk pack or a chainsaw just for the explosive gore-fetishizing kick in the ass most new-school doom fans want. Almost like the Doom guy is literally designed to please what people remember about Doom. Not so much for the people who are still playing Doom. (granted, by nature, we are tough nuts to crack and will probably never replace Doom 1 and 2 with something else)

I may be alone in this though. Curious to know what other people think about how the social perception of Doom guy is forming a unified personality for him that is likely to be applied in Doom 4.

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40oz said:

Lately, it would seem that there is an unusual uprise of Doom-related fanart coming out, often portraying Doom guy as the steroid-juiced, blood-soaked killing machine, often in an almost memetic context.

I hate that depiction, because I can't relate to such a character. Doomguy is just a person who has to hold his own against the odds, and fortunately he has the physique to make it. And as for the faces he makes - the happy face he does when he picks up a new gun is really a representation of player's joy, and is inherited from Wolf3D where BJ would grin when picking up a handheld Gatling gun, which is ridiculously powerful and looks funny. The clenched face meanwhile is from the adrenaline. If you had to shoot repeatedly at something that just wouldn't die or back down, wouldn't you also make a grimace?

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while i really like brutal doom, i hope the new doom guy is nothing like that, ive never liked that sort of ultra macho dude, not even duke nukem (the character, i liked the game) and i dont think most audiences today like that sort of character as much as they used to

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I hope to god they dont use this depiction. It would seriously ruin the game's atmosphere, just like if they gave the Doomguy a voice.

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Since Doom Guy was meant to be you then I guess an alternative would be an ordinary guy.

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First of all, like Avoozl said, Doomguy, as well as Quakeguy and Rageguy, are shells for players to fill, not established characters with a rich backstory and personalities. It's likely DOOM(4) will be the same case.

Second, I'd like to mention that the world is not black and white and we have more than two polar opposites to choose from. Let's not limit this subject to gritty realism OR total absurd, realistic survivor OR a maniacal psychopath.

I might be wrong here... but I feel like some people who hate Brutal Doom try to clense misconceptions (such as "BD is what DOOM was supposed to be") about the franchise so much that they end up distancing DOOM from what it actually was. In other words, no, BD is not what DOOM was supposed to be. But it's not like gore, brutality and carnage were not part of it. Simply discarding violence as a major component of DOOM is just going too far.

Thirdly, I don't think creative ways of dispatching enemies have to equal a blood-thirsty lunatic. Sure, if it's Booker DeWitt who is supposedly a guilt-ridden fellow with a troubled past but ends up viciously sewing off heads and breaking necks with a skyhook... yep, something's wrong here. But if it's a marine in a 'demons on Mars' scenario that battles against hellspawn? In that case I'm fine with satisfying carnage and maybe a slight exaggeration in killing demonic adversaries. At least as long as it feels appropriate in the context of combat.

Worth mentioning again, most of us HAVEN'T SEEN THE GAME. Jumping into conclusions based on a couple of buzzwords is premature. A single glimpse at how the game actually feels might change the entire perception of its features.

Fourthly, the clash of people who remember playing the game and people who still play it. It is true that the former most likely remember things wrongly and their memories have been altered by time. But the latter... If you're knee-deep in something, it's more than likely you might lose perspective, get tunnel vision and become overprotective of your own self-righteous interpretation, even if it's wrong. I know, because I've been there. Point is: to provide an objective outlook it's not enough to simply stick with the game for 20 years.

Finally, here's a couple of facts. As far as I've heard, melee finishers are possible through some sort of an exoskeleton, so they'll probably be always available. Bits of dark humour in the violence have been mentioned (such as ripping off a hand for a bioscan). And lastly:

"We're creating Doom to make you feel like a fast, improvisational, brutal killing machine." - Marty Stratton

However, in my humble opinion, if after reading that all you can think of is Brutal Doom level of absurd then you probably hate BD more than you remember what DOOM is. Last time I checked, I was standing amongst a sea of mutilated corpses of my enemies.

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Don't get me wrong here, this isn't a "fuck brutal doom" thread, but there's no denying that brutal doom is a pretty strong factor that rekindled a lot of people's interest in Doom who have been off playing other games (And I have read comments on youtube and facebook that said verbatim "BD is what Doom was supposed to be"). Also it is certainly worth mentioning that I haven't actually seen the gameplay footage, but there have been posts on this forum with people describing it that haven't been dismissed, if that's anything to go on. And I haven't played Quake 4 or Rage, and it's good to hear that the blank canvass personality of the protagonist is being employed there.

My criticism lies in that if my speculative conjecture becomes reality, that Doom Guy is depicted as more of a naturally born killing machine than simply a marine that happened to be most successful in surviving the invasion, then I feel it might debase all there is to interpret about his personality, much like the characters in a TV Series. In most TV Shows, usually by the third or fourth season, most characters personalities are so established that there's almost no room left for character development, and the fun part of watching the show (for me) -- learning secrets and quirks about the characters in the show, seems to dissipate. They tend to behave almost exactly how you would expect in any circumstance. The most obvious and relatable example I can think of would be Quagmire from Family Guy, who literally doesn't have any lines in the show anymore that aren't about questionable sexual deviance or the objectification of women.

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Well, my general take on this is very simple: as long as it feels right, I'm fine with it. And this goes to everything about the game. I mean, it's nice to speculate but we won't know until we actually see it in action. It's not just about the fact that there are violent executions. It's about how appropriate they are in the context and tone of the rest of the game, how they affect the combat, how it all works together.

I doubt they'd go for a badass personality with one-liners and such. My guess is that they want YOU to feel badass on a GAMEPLAY level rather than try to replicate a comedic reinterpretation of Doomguys personality from the Comic or BD. I might be wrong but it seems to me they just want to get away from the popular 'slow movement, hide behind the cover' gameplay and encourage more oldschool in-your-face combat. You're not unstoppable but you're not a wuss either so you are, to some degree, fit to murder demons in direct combat rather than pick them off from a distance.

In the light of this I don't think we can expect a more 'realistic' depiction of this, such as an underpowered marine that fights for his life at every turn. Then again, the original Doomguy also isn't exactly incapable of slaughtering enemies even when outnumbered. So I guess it can absolutely work. Again, it's all about the right execution of all aspects associated with it. Considering the QC demo did not leave a Duke Nukem / campy feel on the audience, I think we'll be fine.

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40oz said:

Having heard the Doom trailer portrays the game as a modernized capitalization on Brutal Doom fame, it has me wondering what character traits our hero is going to have in the next Doom title.


The only trailer that exists is the one we've all seen, which only shows the Cyberdemon and a glimpse of a techbase environment. The reveal, which was a demo and not a trailer, shares Brutal Doom's finishing moves, and nothing else. Please don't jump to conclusions like this.

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At least BJ seems to change with the events as opposed to remaining a static never changing character. He was basically a shell too until RtCW, where he decided to spend his RnR time by gunning down Nazis for shits and giggles. And then Wolf2k9 actually gives him lines (And inexplicably change his hair color; Also note BJ had lines in the Xbox version of RtCW) and a bit more of a personality (He just kills shit and seem routinely unphased by everything except killing, which he seems to relish). In New Order he starts out about the same he did in the last game, but hey after being pretty much Catatonic for 20 or so years (And a second change in hair color) maybe you'd go soft too when you wake up... Only to brutalize anyone within feet of you that has a weapon in hand.

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I liked the way "Marine" looked and acted in Doom 3. Serious, badass, cold and powerful (but NOT over the top corny.) I feel like he's similarly depicted in the classic Doom games so I hope that trend continues.

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I've often pictured the space marine as more of a survivalist than some sort of street-jacket lunatic with an irrational hatred for monsters drenched in the blood of its foes

Same here. I always pictured him as a guy who would keep his cool even in intense moments, and also as someone who cares about 'right vs wrong', since the whole reason he assaulted his commanding officer was that he didn't want to kill civilians.

The "Brutal/Comic Doomguy" seems like a nutjob who would kill anything that moves. I really hope they don't depict him like that, or as anything but a silent hero who is meant to be 'you'.

doom_is_great said:

I think Doomguy should be gay and talk with a lisp.

Fuck everything I just said, this is the best idea ever

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I like the idea of DoomGuy being a survivalist as well. The HUD face always seemed to me like a level-headed guy trying to keep his cool. Less Arnold and more...not Arnold.

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I'd say keep him mostly quiet, like Isaac Clarke was in Dead Space 2.

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GoatLord said:

I like the idea of DoomGuy being a survivalist as well.


Me too. Always pictured Doomguy as the guy that somehow, up against seemingly impossible odds, barely makes it out alive in every situation. After each and every battle, he always makes it out with a few injuries, with his face, armor, and clothing covered in the blood and gore of his enemies. He is not some 80s action hero that never gets wounded or never gets any blood on him.

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Here's something new. Why not make him a very unpleasant, crude and villanous person who just happens to have the right skills to drive hell back to whence it came?

He doesn't need to talk either, actions speak louder than words.

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Seeing how I have no idea what Doom will turn out like or what id has planned beyond the Quakecon kinda-reveal all i can do is bring forward a few cases.

A few people mention the silent protagonist and the empty canvas. This type of player works the best when there is nobody to talk to or interact with. It was a perfect match for Doom/2, but as time has gone on and games have changed/evolved, the silent protagonist is becoming more and more absurd. Even back with Half-Life I think this type was becoming a stretch. Quite a few people are talking with...or...AT you and there is no way to respond. By Half-Life 2 this solution was hilariously bad and jarring. Hey Gordon, let me talk at you with butchered dialogue for 2 minutes while you stand there and nod. (And HL2 is probably one of the better examples of the template). The thing is, the more the story (via characters and actions) demands the involvement of the player character, the more the environment needs input from the player (or character) and the more the actual player will feel the urge to respond.

It's also pretty damn hard to create an interesting story without a relatable character at the core. Often the external story is a (more or less abstract) externalization of the internal conflict in the main character. Luke wasn't just fighting the Empire and Darth Vader. He was growing up, realizing his potential and breaking free of his family. Sam Neill wasn't just running from dinosaurs. He was learning how to be a father. Jack & Rose weren't just trying to survive on a doomed ship. They were trying to live a doomed relationship.

You can create amazing structural frameworks for your story until you're blue in the face, but you'll never connect with the world emotionally if there isn't a character you can relate to. One thing you could do of course is to defer all this to another character that is not the player, but there is still the problem of how the player and the character are connected. It needs to be relevant. This isn't a problem that is easy to solve, but it won't be going away in the near future. The more advanced the games become and the more consistent they become with reality and/or their own context, the bigger the disconnect will be.

I think Wolfenstein handled this very well. The main character managed to be non-silent without being a complete moron. Another approach would be to let the player customize his character. Who is he? What is his background? Etc. Perhaps even let him decide responses to other characters. This is of course what they do in games like Mass Effect and it is probably the most natural course for this type of game storytelling in the future.

If they're making a strict run-gun, no other characters to talk to or interact with - then the silent protagonist will fit like a glove. However don't invest time and effort into making detailed, living secondary characters and then leave out a main character. It's absurd. I'm not saying you can't have a silent protagonist in a modern game, just that if you do, don't build the game like an RPG or with supporting characters that you *should* be able to interact with.

All that out of the way, I agree with the OP.

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From what the reveal demonstrated, I think it's going to be pretty run-and-gun with little or no NPC interaction.

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GoatLord said:

From what the reveal demonstrated, I think it's going to be pretty run-and-gun with little or no NPC interaction.


Actually, how long was the level? Also, how were the weapons distributed? Were they always in obvious places? Did picking one up do something interesting like spring a trap? What about ammo? Was it plentiful or hard to find? Was it put in those retarded ammo boxes games use nowadays? In general did the player dispose of infinite resources or not?

Oh and did you get a look at the marine and his armor?

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The two maps shown seriously felt like they were for the testing phase. They looked inviting, but the player didn't complete either map and major weapons like the rocket launcher and super shotty were just lying around conveniently. Along with upper-tier monsters being encountered almost immediately, it's clear that these maps will either be heavily modified or won't be in the final game.

The "retarded ammo boxes" were a feature of Doom, I don't see his that's a modern design choice. Pretty sure ammo was finite. The player model was never shown. I don't remember seeing an air pickup.

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GoatLord said:

The two maps shown seriously felt like they were for the testing phase. They looked inviting, but the player didn't complete either map and major weapons like the rocket launcher and super shotty were just lying around conveniently. Along with upper-tier monsters being encountered almost immediately, it's clear that these maps will either be heavily modified or won't be in the final game.

The "retarded ammo boxes" were a feature of Doom, I don't see his that's a modern design choice. Pretty sure ammo was finite. The player model was never shown. I don't remember seeing an air pickup.


When I was talking about the ammo boxes I was talking about the modern "innovation" that has a box full of infinite ammo of all types between each section of the map.

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DooM_RO said:

When I was talking about the ammo boxes I was talking about the modern "innovation" that has a box full of infinite ammo of all types between each section of the map.


It happens in modern shooters because there are moments when enemies don't stop showing up until you trigger a certain action-puzzle-event.

While you don't figure out what to do, new enemies will appear nonstop, in CoD or Halo almost all enemies carry weapons so you can recharge your ammunition by picking up from their corpses.

In Doom, Nightmare mode monsters can ressurrect, as the ammunition - health packs are limited. In this case you must use your main advantage against monsters = running, the fact you are faster than them gives you your chance to complete a level, you can see nightmare speed runs in D1 - D2: you must memorize the level map in order to run through the right-faster direction in order to complete the level as fast as you can, shot some BFGs to clean your way and run having the level memorized.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Q3QDmOMnNc

This approach don't work in modern shooters because you have enemies that are as fast or even faster than you as well as a much better AI than 1993, add the fact weapons are not overpowered as a BFG and you need to aim before shooting in modern 3D games, it hinders you from cleaning you way - running combo Doom strategy.

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I've actually created a series of idea's for what Doomguy could have been in my idea, Doom:Seven Sons in which the main character is Stanley Blazkowicz. I know that ID Software simply won't make a game based on my idea, but I like to imagine what the main character's personality would be like if he had one. Stanley's bio from Seven Sons is right here:

Stanley Blazkowicz aka Mug(voiced by either Troy Baker or Mel Gibson):
"Vanity. Definitely my favorite sin."-Stanley Blazkowicz's catch phase.
The hero. A mass celebrity known for his heroic work at closing the gates of hell during the mars incident(Doom 3) and for saving the earth when hell had invaded by destroying the Icon of Sin(Doom 2), Stanley is also known by his nickname, Mug.
Although once Catholic, he became atheist after the Mars incident believing that god simply doesn't exist for allowing hell to open up onto earth killing billions of people. After saving the Earth he became a celebrity and a world renowned hero as well as a billionaire. He married a women named Rachael, and adopted a girl named Chelsie while hoping to live the rest of his days in retirement knowing that his wealth had set him for life. He seems to put a lot of love into his family as he wears a locket underneath his H.A.R.D. Gear suit that shows a picture of his family.
His favorite hobby is firearms, as he has a massive collection of military grade firearms in his home, open carry's a firearm out him public(as shown in the intro before leaving his home), wears a T-Shirt that shows that only dictators would support gun control, and punches anyone openly criticizing the Second Amendment.


He has been called back into action to stop a conspiracy by the Order of Nine Angles to merge hell with earth.

Stanley has a very arrogant, anti-hero personality and is known to make many one-liners throughout the game, taunting enemies as he kills them. However vanity isn't the only factor of his personality as the best way to define him would to be mixing the personality of Booker Dewitt from Bioshock Infinite with Duke Nukem. He does however have a very soft side towards his family.

Some of the quotes here uses are as followed:
"You said it."(says this after shooting a Samca in the mouth)

"Shut up!"(says this after shooting a Samca in the mouth)

"Shut the fuck up!"(says this after shooting a Samca in the mouth)

"God damn it! Stand still!"(says this while struggling to shoot a Gaki Demon or a Zombie Ninja Sorta)

"Here, let remove that parasite off ya."(says this while a Abasy infected appears)

"Ya got a chip on your shoulder, lemme brush it off."(this while a Abasy infected with a parasite on his shoulder appears)

"Suck my Glock! Not my cock!"(says this after killing a Bal-Bal with a 45 caliber pistol)

"You won't be having sex anytime soon.(after blowing an enemy's crotch off)

"Say good-bye to your sex life.(after blowing an enemy's crotch off)

"Sorry. Already married."(after killing a Succubus)

"Wow! Wish my wife could do yoga like that."(after spotting a Onryō(they float in a contorted position))

"I'm going to go Nanking on your ass!(reference to the Nanking Massacre)"

"Would you like fries with that?"(after shooting a zombie in the mouth)

"Fuck yourself"(after punching an enemy to death)

"Little shit"(after killing an Acheri, zombie child, or O.N.A. witch)

"Who your daddy!"(after killing an Acheri)

"Cheer up. Least your not the one who has to deal with cleaning hell up"(after killing an Acheri)

"Fuck yourself"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Get off scum"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Go fuck yourself"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Shove it up your ass!"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Kiss my ass!"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Fuck you!"(after pressing the flip off key)

"Blow me asshole!(after pressing the flip off key)

"Let the games begin!(after encountering the first enemy)

"Great. Just fucking great. I'm stuck out in the middle of the quarantine zone, spending Christmas cleaning up the crap hell left over while everybody else is home unwrapping gifts and spending time with their families. Merry fucking Christmas!"(says this at the start of the game)

"The Geneva convention doesn't apply to your kind dickface. Don't fucking bother asking the UN to help you win a lawsuit against me."

"Thou shalt kill"(appear shooting an enemy in the throat)

"Hail Satan!"(says this after shooting an O.N.A. member in the head)

"Go with god motherfucker!"(says this after shooting an O.N.A. member in the head)

"Don't get me wrong, i'd crucify a thousand Jesus's after god let the earth get raped by hell. I just can't let your kind live."(after killing a group of O.N.A. members)

"This is why I like abortions. It allowed me to maintain a healthy sex life. Better to adopt orphans than procreate."(says this after killing Cherub).


Of course I really think that ID Software is going to stick to the tradition of having a silent protagonist which in my opinion is a bummer, but I guess some people would prefer it that way. Different strides for different folks I guess.

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IMO, I found those quotes very cringe worthy. Its hard to imagine the actual doomguy saying such juvenile and corny one liners and I cant imagine anyone mentioning sex while killing demons.

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