Plutonia: really well done

[Dime]

Snakes said:

Plutonia rocks my socks. There's a lot of really clever layout concepts they snuck in there, and some of the maps hold up well even today (Map04, Map12, Map27 etc.). For the period they were made in, they were truly at the top of the mapping community. I'd easily call it the IWAD that most influenced the modern mapping community (you can't argue against Map32's influence, and the PL knockaround style of play is standard at this point).

I actually kind of disagree with map 12. I feel like map 12 has some amazing things going on with the map but the ending is really dickish and it is extremely common to see players take forever to finish this one from getting lost. The blue key teleporter to the arch-vile location is a bad culprit.

[Lycaon]

Cacowad said:

the most influential maybe not (doom1 episode 1 anybody?), but i agree plutonia is actually a really good wad.

e1m1 should have been the most influential map, but sadly it wasn't. It containes all of Doom's cliches in a nutshell, and is very stylish in my opinion.

Plutonia was pretty fun, but doesn't have much eye candy. TNT is perhaps better looking.

[Guest Unregistered account]

Lycaon said:

Plutonia was pretty fun, but doesn't have much eye candy. TNT is perhaps better looking.

Really?

[Doomkid]

I think what he means is that TNT had more obvious custom graphics. The custom stuff in Plutonia is just green jungle textures, which are nice, but TNT had all the animated screens and spinning tapes and shit. Makes it a bit more immersive, I can understand that.

The texturing in some TNT maps is pure ass though, and it's never ass in Plutonia. Some TNT maps on the other hand look just fine. Map01 is a perfect example, everything looks like it was placed thoughtfully.

[Clonehunter]

I think it's better than Doom II.

[Lycaon]

Clonehunter said:

I think it's better than Doom II.

Doom 2 is the weakest IWAD in my opinion. TNT and Plutonia are way better. I also like DOOM better than DOOM 2, but that's a different topic.

[scifista42]

In addition to what I said before: If there was a custom wad that was designed like Plutonia and played like Plutonia, but used different than Plutonia-like texturing (including BSTONE, WOOD9 etc.) and no curves and similar Plutonia-implying structures; I'd enjoy it. But not Plutonia. I already have conditioned bad reaction to it, I believe. I also feel a need to rush in the maps to be away from there ASAP, then I keep dying and it frustrates me. I normally accept challenging gameplay, but my relation to Plutonia is somewhat specially negative. :(

[Krivanka]

I liked it alot, although I don't remember too much of it as I've only played through it once.

Levels like Abattoir and the Twilight were a particularly tough challenge. Probably my favorite iWad, but behind Alien Vendetta in terms of overall quality gameplay and difficulty.

[RocknRoll420]

Plutonia is amazing it has levels that can still pose some challenge even when compared to the hardest stuff made today. All the other iwads are very easy. The levels all look very clean. I personally like the brown, stone, and jungle looks. It has a long lasting influence on hard doom gameplay. It really set the precedent for the revenant fuckery we live in.

[june gloom]

I personally would not mind Plutonia-style gameplay and design with an E1 or E2-style theme.

(Though NME did come close by being more or less a remake of E2M1...)

[Varis Alpha]

Plutonia-style gameplay isn't too bad. certainly a lot more enjoyable than slaughtermap gameplay for me, while not being so tame it's generally a breeze like Doom 2.

[june gloom]

Agreed. It's a nice middle ground.

There there's something to be said for a more sedate, atmospheric monster hunt like Episode 1 was. I rather like easy gameplay if the atmosphere is right, which is why Doom 64 is still a favourite of mine.

[PerfectHatred14]

I agree 100%. The plutonia Experiment was damn impressive. I mean yeah as far as technology and what we can do with video game maps now or days, it doesn't compare, but for the type of game and the type of unique abstract level design Doom is unique for in general, it's damn good. The levels were so stylish and pretty compared to the original doom, they almost flow and play differently than the levels in the original doom episodes. I describe doom maps even for as old as they are today, to be a design all of their own, and a bit abstract. They don't feel like locations or architecture and buildings you see here in our realm of earth or even this universe. They have a surreal feel, that may be only because of the limitations of technology back then, but still i consider that it's own style. I loved the new ideas in Final doom that i hadn't seen before, in comparison to doom and doom2. Some of the map layouts, puzzles, and traps were something new too me on those two episodes or IWADS.

[Yuki Senmatsu]

It was the first Final DOOM game I've completed with Simpsons DOOM and the 99 weapons mod.

Oh so fun ^^

[Holering]

I didn't think it was too bad, but by the time it came out Doom was tired. In later maps it felt like it was trying to be advanced with mouse aim, duck-cover strategy, and other techniques that couldn't be done, but it also shows how limited the Doom engine is.

A sweet map that stands out is "Hunted". The ending screen when it shows the baddies has the coolest and best background art compared to Doom, Doom 2 and TNT IMO.

[jazzmaster9]

Clonehunter said:

I think it's better than Doom II.

Plutonia is definitely better than DooM II, but DooM II is way better than TNT.

[Enjay]

Plutonia is my least favourite Doom IWAD. I was very unimpressed when I first played it. I almost felt as if I'd wasted money on it and it was only "getting the complete set" that made me feel better about the purchase. I may have softened to it a little over the years but I still don't really like it that much.

[Stupid Bunny]

I definitely have a lot of respect for Plutonia, inasmuch as the architecture and gameplay are both remarkably consistent. That said, I just thought TNT had a lot more personality, a certain odd charm that gave it a lot more variety and memorability than Plutonia, including all the strange TNT motifs, weird easter eggs, surprisingly atmospheric levels and, yes, indescribable textures. TNT made a good first impression on me and left a soft spot that Plutonia never has. I guess I just wish Plutonia hadn't been all the same brown and green textures and stupid revenants over and over on every level...a little more variety and unique character in how the levels looked and it would've been near perfect to me.

[slowtorturepukechamber]

It took me almost a month to complete Go 2 It on Ultra Violence.

That map is quite a handful.

[BaronOfStuff]

At times it feels like less of a coherent planned-from-the-beginning mapset and more like a collection of standalone levels which were quickly slapped together, what with all the samey designs and encounters along the way.

[Captain Ventris]

RocknRoll420 said:

It really set the precedent for the revenant fuckery we live in.

"Thiiis is the wooorld we liiive in!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pkVLqSaahk

Also, I'm starting a Doom cover band called "Revenant Fuckery". Who's with me!?

[sincity2100]

StupidBunny said:

I definitely have a lot of respect for Plutonia, inasmuch as the architecture and gameplay are both remarkably consistent. That said, I just thought TNT had a lot more personality, a certain odd charm that gave it a lot more variety and memorability than Plutonia, including all the strange TNT motifs, weird easter eggs, surprisingly atmospheric levels and, yes, indescribable textures. TNT made a good first impression on me and left a soft spot that Plutonia never has. I guess I just wish Plutonia hadn't been all the same brown and green textures and stupid revenants over and over on every level...a little more variety and unique character in how the levels looked and it would've been near perfect to me.

Agreed,Plutonia Lacks a lot of personality and didn't leave enough good impression on me,the start of the game felt weak,yes it was hard and it has some Revenents and two Archviles,that is not enough to leave an impactful impression on me,then the maps started to get better,then map 32 Go to it was really awesome,but this map was the highest peek that the Casalis will ever reach until it went downhill for me,the last few maps felt unoriginal and felt more like a Giant Doom2 Ripoff instead of being original when they ripped of some of the Doom2 Maps like the living end and Monster Condo and Map29 they ripped off Downtown+1/4 of the Industial Zone,by the time I reached map 23 I became exhausted and I wanted to finish the game very quickly because Plutonia Bored me to death.

[june gloom]

I can't parse that.

[scifista42]

I can.

Agreed. Plutonia Lacks a lot of personality and didn't leave enough good impression on me. The start of the game felt weak. Yes, it was hard, and it has some Revenents and two Archviles. That is not enough to leave an impactful impression on me. Then the maps started to get better. Then map 32 Go to it was really awesome,but this map was the highest peek that the Casalis will ever reach until it went downhill for me. The last few maps felt unoriginal and felt more like a Giant Doom2 Ripoff, instead of being original, when they ripped of some of the Doom2 Maps, like the living end and Monster Condo and Map29 they ripped off Downtown+1/4 of the Industial Zone. By the time I reached map 23, I became exhausted and I wanted to finish the game very quickly, because Plutonia Bored me to death.

I'm not sure if I can use interpunction properly, though.

[AD_79]

sincity2100 said:

...the last few maps felt unoriginal and felt more like a Giant Doom2 Ripoff instead of being original when they ripped of some of the Doom2 Maps like the living end and Monster Condo and Map29 they ripped off Downtown+1/4 of the Industial Zone.

Last I checked, a lot of the Plutonia maps rip off something, not just the last few maps.

[june gloom]

And anyway why does that matter? The quality of those maps IMO are better.

[Dave The Daring]

Plutonia is an amazing wad from a technical viewpoint, especially when you consider the time it was made and the tools that were available. It was also the first map set to really up the difficulty, although I feel they could have included a bit more variation from one difficulty setting to the next.

Having said all that, I don't really enjoy playing it that much. I'm not keen on the atmosphere it conjures up, and I think the game play can be a little unrelenting at times. The truth is though, if I was able to make a megawad like Plutonia, I'd be pretty damned proud of myself.

[Salt-Man Z]

A lot of the layouts/architecture from Plutonia are highly memorable to me, inasmuch as I recently replayed both DOOM2 and TNT and was left wondering, "Wait, what about the level with _____?" for a number of maps; obviously, they're in Plutonia. Certainly I've played through it a number of times, but definitely on HNTR the first couple times, maybe HMP only later on. I'm in the middle of my first UV attempt ever, and every map brings a sense of both "Oh yeah, this map!" and "OMG this is brutal." I mean, it was clearly the hardest IWAD before, but on UV the difficulty becomes plain.

[june gloom]

I've only ever played it on UV and yeah, it's an asswhooping from the word go.

Dario's maps tend to be tough but fair, but Milo loves his asshole tricks and his fucking chaingunners.

[T-Rex]

This is Final Doom in a nutshell:

TNT - 32 levels of fun.
Plutonia - 32 levels of madness.