Cleveland Police kills 12 year old boy after

[GreyGhost]

Gez said:

Here's a parenting protip, folk: explain to your kids that policemen are not their playmates. If a cop tells you to hold your hands up, you don't reach for your airsoft gun and pretend to have an epic gunfight like in a movie.

QFT. The fact that airsoft guns are being made to look more like the real thing doesn't help either.

[dg93]

GreyGhost said:

QFT. The fact that airsoft guns are being made to look more like the real thing doesn't help either.

Airsoft guns are usually supposed to have the orange tip on them to distinguish whether they are airsoft or not.

Nomad said:

You're far less cynical than I, I shall admit. I'm not saying you're wrong that he shouldn't have confronted Zimmerman and should have called the police. But I do not think he was necessarily in the wrong standing up for himself. We'll never know exactly what happened though, and as shitty as the outcome was the due process of law was done, so I guess there's not much that can be said anymore.

Yeah I'm not really trying to be cynical lol I'm also not saying that Zimmerman was a hero or anything. He really should have stayed indoors and let the police handle it so that he would not put himself in a very risky situation. That act of vigilance pretty much ruined his life as well as Trayvon's.

[GreyGhost]

the_miano said:

Airsoft guns are usually supposed to have the orange tip on them to distinguish whether they are airsoft or not.

I know that, but it's a little difficult to see the tip of a gun that's stuffed in your pants.

[Maes]

Obviously, the solution is banning toy guns. And 12 yos. And blacks. And black 12yos with toy guns.

Alternatively, pass an act which only allows black cops to shoot black perps to kill. This way, you make dem poor niggas kill each other and forget 'bout dem honkies, knowhatumsayin'?

[Doomkid]

Maes for governor/king/president 2015

[Clonehunter]

Doomkid said:

Maes for governor/king/president 2015

Seconded

[geekmarine]

Okay, so apparently it wasn't even a case of the police yelling "Freeze!" or anything like that, they just shot the kid before he even had a chance to react. There's basically no way the kid could've avoided getting shot, they had already made up their minds how to handle the situation before even getting there.

I mean, at first I was like, "Okay, it sucks, but I can kind of understand if the kid wasn't cooperating," but now the story seems to be that the kid wasn't given a chance to cooperate.

[Technician]

geekmarine said:

I mean, at first I was like, "Okay, it sucks, but I can kind of understand if the kid wasn't cooperating," but now the story seems to be that the kid wasn't given a chance to cooperate.

Doesn't surprise me. The only thing I want to come out of all these police shootings is for the general public to look at cops more critically. Authority figures rarely have your best interest in mind.

[geekmarine]

Oh, I suppose I should've mentioned, this is based on the fact that they released video of the shooting - I didn't feel comfortable linking to the video myself, given its nature, but it's out there if you want to find it. Basically, the cop car pulls up to the kid, the cop jumps out of the car and shoots the kid at pretty close range without ever even giving him a chance to surrender or anything.

I just find it interesting that here we were talking about the proper way to deal with the police, and this whole time, it didn't even matter. It's still good to remember how to deal with the police, but let's not forget sometimes they just shoot without asking questions or even making demands.

[Quasar]

Until they get bloodthirsty enough to start slaughtering white children in the streets like animals too, nothing will be done. And by the time they start doing that, they'll have enough political power and absolute immunity to get away with doing whatever they want anyway.

[Technician]

geekmarine said:

Oh, I suppose I should've mentioned, this is based on the fact that they released video of the shooting - I didn't feel comfortable linking to the video myself, given its nature, but it's out there if you want to find it. Basically, the cop car pulls up to the kid, the cop jumps out of the car and shoots the kid at pretty close range without ever even giving him a chance to surrender or anything.

Yeah, I just seen the video. There is not a single doubt here about the cop's poor execution (heh). You don't just shoot someone without taking aim and shouting a warning, especially a kid.

Fuck, the cop drives up on the lawn, right next to the kid and shoots him within an instant. If it weren't for the cop car, I'd assume this was a quick ghetto assassination. I was half expecting the cop to jump back into the car and gun it (I'm on fire).

[Reisal]

If you read the second large comment on the article, it gives a reason the police were on edge.

[dew]

Glaice said:

If you read the second large comment on the article, it gives a reason the police were on edge.

Beg pardon? Which article and which comment is that? And why would it ever matter that cops were feeling kinda emotional recently?

[fraggle]

the_miano said:

And the Darwin award goes to......

Darwin Awards don't apply to children.

[Maes]

fraggle said:

Darwin Awards don't apply to children.

After much discussion, there also exists a small category regarding deaths below this age limit. Entry into this category requires that the peers of the candidate be of the opinion that the actions of the person in question were above and beyond the limits of reason

Let me see....

• Boy was black. By 12 yo, he should have understood that being born a poor-ass nigga would not exactly give him the benefit of the doubt or sympathy of the authorities by default.
  
• Boy was playing with a toy gun that could be mistaken for real. With all that "ghetto culture" about police harassment etc. he probably knew that playing "tough guy" meant trouble.
  
• The version of the story I first heard was that he didn't comply with the police's requests, didn't raise his arms, but instead went for his "gun". Probably he also tried to sound "tough" by saying ghetto stuff like "Are ya talkin' to me, maddafackah?!" to da police, dawg. That's more than enough to get you iced and the cop icing you getting a medal, in the You Ass of Ay.
  

...so the boy was probably playing with fire all along, and knew it. I won't go as far as calling it "suicide by cop", but I wonder how the "concerned citizen", the "whistleblower" that called the cops is feeling now. He's practically the one morally responsible for that murder. I wouldn't be surprised if one day he will be the target victim of a drive-by shooting, "for no apparent reason".

[dew]

Maes, stop making an idiot out of yourself and go watch the video of the shooting. If he said what you propose he said, he'd have to be the world's best scatman. Also I'm not sure why you're so reluctant to properly write "nigger" when you're all about casual racism of our cruel world otherwise. Passing "moral responsibility" is just icing on the cake. Truly a 10/10 Maes post.

[Maes]

dew said:

Maes, stop making an idiot out of yourself and go watch the video of the shooting.

Maes said:

The version of the story I first heard was

You fail reading comprehension forever. However, if I ever really run for president, I'd like my "Captain Contrarian" propaganda/PR minister to be none else than you ;-)

dew said:

If he said what you propose he said, he'd have to be the world's best scatman.

Maybe he said "Da way yo hold mah dick must really hurt yo knees". I ain't black, and I can say it fast ;-)

dew said:

Also I'm not sure why you're so reluctant to properly write "nigger" when you're all about casual racism of our cruel world otherwise.

Good point, ma nigga, but as you know, only another nigga can call another nigga "nigger". Got it, honky?

dew said:

Passing "moral responsibility" is just icing on the cake. Truly a 10/10 Maes post.

Tu quoque. You need to be a bit more subtle and refined if you want to be propaganda minister of my New Enlighted World Order ;-)

Jokes apart, I think that the whistleblower does have some responsability here. If he didn't make that call, the boy would probably be alive. I think this falls squarely into the same category as swatting, even if the whistleblower probably "meant well".

[Gez]

Quasar said:

Until they get bloodthirsty enough to start slaughtering white children in the streets like animals too, nothing will be done. And by the time they start doing that, they'll have enough political power and absolute immunity to get away with doing whatever they want anyway.

Who is "they"? The policemen?

[dew]

Maes said:

You fail reading comprehension forever. However, if I ever really run for president, I'd like my "Captain Contrarian" propaganda/PR minister to be none else than you ;-)

If you were mocking the police's habit of blatantly distorting facts to create favourable versions of police brutality incidents, I apologize. Your sarcasm was too subtle for me.

Good point, ma nigga, but as you know, only another nigga can call another nigga "nigger". Got it, honky?

Using nigga feels like a laughably hypocritical "loophole" to me. Especially because it only works in written form, but that's apparently enough for white people on the Internet to confuse their internal white guilt into approval. It's context that makes words insulting and you were actually pointing out deeply rooted racism in Murca's law enforcement, so spelling out nigger would have been quite spot on. :P

Jokes apart, I think that the whistleblower does have some responsability here. If he didn't make that call, the boy would probably be alive. I think this falls squarely into the same category as swatting, even if the whistleblower probably "meant well".

Swatting is purely malicious, the caller was a "concerned citizen", so to speak. For sure, he probably feels some guilt now - I know I would, but from a detached (dare I say objective?) perspective, he wasn't morally at fault for what he did. Despite all the Murcan police horror stories we see in media, I don't quite think calling the cops equals to calling in a drone strike. Yet?

[Maes]

Nigga is a word which evolved from the derogative term "nigger". Tupac best defined the distinction between the two.

NIGGER- a black man with a slavery chain around his neck.

NIGGA- a black man with a gold chain on his neck.
Tupac defined the word

Source: nigga.

Who are we honkies to argue with da man?

http://images.musictimes.com/data/images/full/6165/tupac-shakur.jpg?w=600

[VGA]

Why did they park right next to him? That was stupid, otherwise it's an accident, nothing to see here, moving on.

[Seeker_of_Truth]

Reportedly, Rice was given 3 commands to put his hands up. Instead, it appears that he moved to grab the gun in a holster or the waistband of his pants. That was presumably when he was shot.

Further, the officers weren't told that Rice was a child, and that the gun he held was just a toy. They probably didn't realize this until after the fact.

If all this adds up, I don't know how the police could be blamed in this instance.

Here's an article: http://news.yahoo.com/us-police-shot-black-boy-seconds-scene-005527139.html

[geekmarine]

Having watched the video, I have a hard time imagining the officer even had time to give three commands, much less that the kid had time to obey them. The car pulls up right next to the kid, the officer gets out of the car and basically draws his gun as he's getting out, and fires as soon as he's out of the car. Yeah, it's possible the officer was shouting "DROP IT DROP IT DROP IT" as he was getting out, but even then, the officer was in position to shoot the kid before the kid would've even had time to react. And that's best case scenario, ignoring the fact that reaction time would probably be slowed by having a cop car appear out of nowhere and having cops suddenly shouting at you - factor in that, the kid probably hadn't even processed what the cop had said by the time he hit the ground.

[Maes]

geekmarine said:

Having watched the video, I have a hard time imagining the officer even had time to give three commands, much less that the kid had time to obey them.

Trouble is, we (conveniently?) don't get to see (or hear) what happened while the car was out of the frame before the final, fatal approach: it could have still been close enough for the officers to yell orders from afar and be heard, just like they normally would vs an armed suspect.

It's hard to judge from the reactions of the boy whether he actually heard anything, though. To me, it looks like it was in some sort of a trance, oblivious to its surroundings, or even drugged.

Truth is, this footage is just as revealing as the various alleged footage of Bigfoot or Nessie: vague enough to be inconclusive, but clear enough to fuel speculation and analyses for years to come.

[FireFish]

this reminds me of an incident nearly 3 years ago where a child was alive but drowning in a barrel
of water, feet up while the cops where beating up the father who tried to fight his way to the
barrel to get his son out of there... The kid died while his father was fighting the cops to save him.
The cops reasoned that if the kid was dropped in there on purpose they should investigate that first and
block any tampering with crime scene evidence.

My point is : police retardation is a global phenomena !

[joe-ilya]

[Quasar]

Gez said:

Who is "they"? The policemen?

Police and the unions and PACs that constantly excuse all their worst behaviors while lobbying for more weapons and more power, and act as though they belong to some kind of class of nobility. They act like knights in the middle ages. If a nobleman decides to chop off a peasant's head, there's no recourse. The system will support him regardless, because in that society his honor is unquestionable and his rights trump those of anyone lower. It is becoming exactly the same way in America with cops.

[Maes]

Quasar said:

...act as though they belong to some kind of class of nobility. They act like knights in the middle ages. If a nobleman decides to chop off a peasant's head, there's no recourse.

Well, come think of it, the Police represent the class of the Guardian Warriors in Plato's Republic. Maybe they are increasingly aware of their role and make increased demands for power and authority (to be directed, of course, UNDER their level) to their superiors, the Guardian Rulers (roughly, those would be the political elected "elites"), lest they use the power they already have to overthrow the Rulers.

Under many aspects, your average policeman today is far more dangerous than a soldier posted in enemy territory: he can be just as well-armed, well-armored, and has much laxer rules of engagement. Worse still, by definition, his target/prey is the "internal enemy", which potentially includes the entire citizenship.

And AFAIK, most modern states don't have the equivalent of a "Black Guard" or a "Praetorian" or "Imperial" guard which is close and loyal to the Rulers in order to prevent such a rebellion. Sure, there's the Secret Service and Internal Affairs, but their role is mostly one of prevention and investigation, not actually duke it out against corrupt cops and militaries organizing a coup.

[Doomkid]