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dobu gabu maru

NOVA II - Ver. 1.2 on /idgames (now with no missing keycards!)

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Map26 – Surreptitious Ichor by dobu gabu maru and cannonball – Kills – 100, Items – 93, Secret – 60. End Health – 184, Armor 186. Death Count – 7. Shells – 31, Bullets – 76, Rockets – 59, Cells – 180. Monsters Killed - 402

I've decided to begin playtesting Nova II with a collaboration by 2 of its alumni, who also happen to be among my favorite mappers. Dobu and cannonball can be relied upon to produce fantastic-looking maps -- in many cases designing genuine Doom Art -- that are loaded with action. Thus, a collab between the 2 produces high expectations, and those expectations were met, in spades, though I still have a few complaints.

Being something less than a great player, I tested this map on HNTR, and it killed me 7 times. It's a slaughtery type of map, and I generally want HNTR on a slaughtery map to equal a hard UV in a normal map. Given that my definition of “hard” is to die at least 10 times, this map fell a bit short of that, mainly due to surpassingly easy open-field arena fights which were trivialized by simple ring-around-the-rosie techniques. But let's begin at the beginning.

The start is by far the toughest part of the map. I died 4 times in a row just probing for the weapons. This was somewhat like a lot of maps in BTSX E2 except that in this map it's much more dangerous because of the tight spaces, a zillion right angles to get stuck on, and heavy monsters without a hitscanner in sight. I was praying for a Sergeant or Chaingunner to waddle out so I could kill it and grab its weapon, but no such luck. Pinkies were also roaming about and doing their moving-meat-walls thing, so it was an effort to avoid getting stuck between them and the Cacos who were on a search-and-destroy mission. The area also had a lot of darkness, so when a Sergeant started blasting me from an upper alcove, I couldn't see the teency stairs that led up there, and instead of killing the jagoff and grabbing his weapon, I had to flee in terror because, on top of everything else, a Baron was heading my way throwing knuckleballs of slime.

I managed to kill that Sergeant a couple minutes later, grab the single shotty and chaingun in rapid succession, and started picking-off the bad guys, fading most of them before I stumbled upon the SSG just in time to puree a Hell Knight and Caco. At last, I had a chance to breath and look around at my environment. I already knew the area was gorgeous, but damn, this is some seriously awesome architecture! A mixture of Metal5 cubism with organic, curvy rock that works better than it has any right to. Exceptional use of midtextures and glowy lights as well. Such a feast for the eyes! There's also a lot of height variation giving the monsters excellent firing angles, including those distant Imps targeting you from somewhere out beyond The Kuiper Belt. Never one of my favorite tactics, that, as I dislike being fired upon by monsters I can't target with autoaim. Of course, it's mostly just harassing fire to keep you from hanging around somewhere with your thumb up your ass, but even if they miss you 800 times, 1 hit in a pitched battle is all it can take to shift the odds in the monsters' favor.

After clearing out the opening, there came the red key battle. I died my first time through, really pissing myself off because I had the battle well in hand until one of those Kuiper Belt Imps nailed me, causing me to become disoriented long enough to have a Caco sneak up from behind while 2 Lost Souls charged and bit me to death. Second time through was easy, but the sniping HKs and Imps made killing the Manc a bit of a grind. Then it was on to the high platform where I gleefully exterminated all the Kuiper Belt Imps with relish. Damn, I hated those fucking things! ;D Then grab the Soulsphere “secret,” the PG – killing a useless Baron in the process – and on to the dark caves.

I'll confess, I didn't like the dark caves. They were, for one thing, really dark, and with strange, non-standard brightness levels like 105 and 140. I remember essel saying that the Doom engine handles brightness levels in 16-unit increments, so these probably default to 112 and 144, thus, what's up with the odd numbers? Or does the target port handle brightness in 1-unit increments? At the end of the day, what matters is that all enemies were essentially invisible until they were in your face. I was playing in GZDoom at 5 AM in a room with no lights on, and I still couldn't see those Imps until they closed in. OTOH, the opposition here is so weak that I only took 1 hit from a zombieboy. Perhaps the idea was to have a breather area for exploration, but given that this is a looooong map which took me more than an hour to complete, I wouldn't mind seeing this entire section disappear.

I went in and out of here a few times because it was so dark and confusing that I went up the stairs and back outside about 4 times when I was trying to get deeper into the maze. A benefit here is that I managed to parkour my way to the secret computer map and also the Green Armor, which ought to be labeled secret since it's hard to find, at least for a stumblebum like me. ;D

I fought the yellow key battle several times because I was trying to leave the room without taking a hit, but I ultimately settled for a grazing strike by an HK which only dropped me by 6 points. Then I teleported to the yellow “exit” door and became determined to get the secret Blue Armor, and damn, but that was a hard jump to make for a keyboarder. Like 10 tries, man! That's cruel. ;D

And funnily enough, as soon as I open the yellow door, what – aside from an Archie with a “Victim” sign around his neck – do I see? A Soulsphere and a Blue Armor. “Holy odd placement, Batman!”

At this point, Surreptitious Ichor becomes Fake Exit, The Map. I expected a trap at the end of that hallway where a SW1Com beckoned me, but damn, I was shocked out of my shoes by the awesome reveal that awaited me. What a cinematic moment! I could only sit there stunned and say, “Whoa!”

But not for long, because roaring monsters began targeting me, so it was off to the races in a beautiful, ginormous arena. I gotta say that the gameplay here is very weak on HNTR, almost a Slaughter Kindergarten where all it took was 2 circuits of the course and every Arachnotron on my plane was firing into the upper galleries, while Pinkies mindlessly chewed at a wooden wall supporting sniper Imps. Indeed, it seemed that Imps and Barons were the only things firing at me until a Revvie here or a Pain Elemental there decided to come at me. I prioritized the PEs with my Plasma Gun because the Revvies were easily thwarted by all the structures you can dodge behind. So it was kill PE, find Revvie, kill Revvie, until the Arachnotrons had blitzed enough critters above to remember that I existed, and then it was kill Arachnotron time before picking off all the high monsters.

Even before this, the combat was so relaxing that I had plenty of opportunity to admire the scenery. Elements of both author's work was on display, with maybe a touch of Insane Gazebo and/or Death-Destiny inspiration. Real epic grandeur with fantastic detail. I don't mean to give you guys a swelled head, but if Nova II can maintain a visual quality even 50% as good as this, it will be legendary.

Once all the riff-raff was dead, it was time to go upstairs and trigger a huge and remarkably toothless teleport trap. All you have to do is jump off the platform, go out in the water and do a little shimmy, and then a little shake so that the clot of monsters begins smacking themselves, and wait until only the Barons are left, then use your generous store of rockets to peel their caps. Then you go up, kill a helpless Archie that gets revealed, and teleport to the other side where yet another toothless teleport trap includes a Cyb. Well, a little ring-around-the-rosie on the platform turns this into a battle of Mike Tyson vs A Bunch of Middle School Kids, and don't underestimate those middle school kids. My nephews threw good punches at that age! ;D Once the battle starts, you can jump into the water again and go back up to KO Tyson with your PG. He'll be battered after punching it out with the 6th graders, so it won't take long to bury him.

The obvious solution to all this easyness is to teleport some monsters into the water so you have to, you know, actually fight. ;)

We're now ready for the final battles, which are some hectic but fairly easy skirmishes in a smallish arena dominated by a Spider Mastermind. The monsters are quiet when you enter the room, but an Archie with a “BFG Slap Me!” sign on his neck waddles out to serve as a combat trigger, and then it's “Katy bar the door!” time as you run like crazy trying not to die. I died, somewhat shamefully, from trying too hard to depend on infighting, saving my plasma for the Cyb I was expecting to see, but who never appeared. Instead, I suffered my second Caco/Lost Soul sandwich of the map and died from bites and Caco spit. After that, I learned my lesson and fought more aggressively, only to die one last time at the real exit because I waited too long to start bombarding the Archie and Revvies inside that end cage.

My final thoughts are that this is a visually spectacular map with slightly weak gameplay on HNTR. It's also maybe a bit too big since it took me over an hour to finish. I could see it being split into 2 maps. I wouldn't want the entire map to be as hard as the start, but some fine-tuning might be necessary to liven-up HNTR. Easy answer is more hitscanners, especially Sergeants and Chaingunners, to introduce real danger to otherwise innocuous combats. I'd say that Mancs were ill-used throughout, as they presented almost no danger whatever. Caco and Lost Soul use was probably the best because they were either dangerous or at least irritating, and they kept pushing me around. Archies were spectacularly irrelevant, since there was always a place to hide, and plenty of rockets for taking them out quickly. Hell Nobles are always hard to employ effectively, but I'd say that a few of the HKs made a real impact here and there.

I might try HMP in a week or so for comparison. I'm holding back less because of fear than because damn this is a long map! ;)

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Thanks a lot for the extensive thoughts Steve, they're really useful. Wacky brightness in the cavern section is my doing, as I just tend to just do stuff in increments of five and ten. Shame that you didn't like it either--did anyone actually like that section? If it's so reviled I guess the only solution is to remove it :/ I just wanted some light adventuring to break up the pace, especially before the extensive finale.

Speaking of, I guess I'll have to tinker with that a little bit. One of the problems is that because the arena is so massive, the player has a lot of room to move around, so all of the fights past the first one aren't that aggressive if you run away. I tried to counterbalance this by placing ammo up there, and it does get pretty tight on UV, but the other difficulties... not so much. Placing enemies down in the water would just extend the map by 5-10 minutes, split the fighting, and not be that difficult unless I use a lot of them. Hitscanners could be useful, but I feel it'd push the player to camp more than hop around the battlefield.

Thanks again!

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I wouldn't worry too much, Dobu, because very few people are going to play on HNTR. I look forward to the HMP test, because after poking around in DB2, I can see that it'll be much harder. I was amused that in many cases you guys used an approach similar to my Power of Threes in that you had 3 monsters of a kind on UV, 2 on HMP and 1 on HNTR, although not always, because you had lines of 3 Revvies at the start but all were at HMP and above, while HNTR only had an Imp.

The caves look to have much more serious opposition on higher difficulties, too, with Sergeants and Hell Knights down there. It would be good to get DotW's perspective on that section, since he's more into exploration and Doom Parkour than I am. I could also be made happier by a bit more light.

I might even break my "Never play a Dobu map on UV" rule if HMP doesn't kill me over 30 times. ;D

As for your habit of using increments of 5 for the lighting, I guess there's no reason to stop since your maps always look great.

BTW, the 00Shitty texture seemed to be missing. Maybe I forgot to load up a texture wad?

For the big arena, I still say some hitscanners down in the water would work, and camping could be made less viable by using, say, 50 more Cacos, but I still haven't seen HMP.

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Hey guys it's been a long time since I posted on Doomworld but I recently got back into Doom mapping. The only map I've publicly released is in the 1994 Community Tune-up wad so I wanted to try and get more of my maps out there and this seemed like as good a place as any to start.

I hammered out a map for slot 22 this week which I'll post in a little while.

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Sorry to double post but I was eager to get feedback.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/bsivmb

I would describe this as a modest map. No stunning architecture, no 1000 revenants, no 1 hour play time. Just Doom II in the spirit of the original. It hasn't been hugely refined so there may be inconsistent lighting or misaligned textures.

Things I've been practicing:
-Using more than one type of texture for an entire map
-Utilizing sound blocking lines
-Making layouts more asymmetrical and less boxy

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Map01 – Panic Station by cannonball – Kills – 100, Items – 70, Secret – 100. End Health – 100, Armor 179. Death Count – 1. Shells – 50, Bullets – 53, Rockets – 4

Played this on UV. Sweet, sweet map. Looks fantastic, nice size for a Map01, and the gameplay is quite ferocious. No wimpy welcome wagon here! The only odd thing was the flashing pillar textures in Sectors 50 and 67. And this time I actually loaded-up the texture pack. ;D

Map gets off to a nice start and I took a lot of damage from that outside Sergeant in the dark, which set me up for my only death when I ran up the stairs looking for health and another Sergeant said, “Lights out, jagoff!”

Second try was more fruitful but still hectic thanks to a nice, flowy layout which kept feeding roamers into the combat, so this savescummer had to survive long enough to find a quiet spot to save. I decided to do it before getting the Zerk, but that proved troublesome because right as I grabbed that Zerk a Chaingunner, Sergeant and Zombieboy waddled out and opened fire from above. Well, I don't call cannonball “Action Jackson” for nothing! ;D Jeez, relentless pressure, just the way I like it.

I spent a lot of time figuring out the secrets in the computery room, including strafejumping onto the consoles to see if I could leap through the midtextures. After getting the Blue Armor, the lift-wall hiding the switch made me groan, I must admit. The classic “run your ass off to get there in time” trick. I made it after several tries. BTW, this area looked excellent. I especially liked the ceiling work in the computery room.

The map ends with a nice jump-scare fight giving us Revvies on Map01. Maybe the Plutonia brick was a giveaway. I fought this with just the single-shotty and chaingun, and it was quite manageable, with plenty of obstructions to block the Revvie rockets, and some fast running provoked infights among the monsters, which included Pinkies and Lost Souls. After emerging triumphant, I decided to find the secret rocket launcher, but had to consult DB2 to figure it out. I had a good laugh at myself, wondering why I didn't figure it out sooner, but it's because cb threw in a little misdirection. Nicely done!

I fought the ending again with the RL, and it wasn't any easier, given that I had to avoid a “Good at Doom!” suicide, but it was a little faster since I managed some nice oblique shots against the skeketors.

I honestly wish I had some suggestions for improving this map, but I think, aside from the flashing pillar textures, it's basically perfect, a really nice, great-looking, flowy, tough Map01. Really, one of the best opening maps I've played.

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Just as an aside, if you guys can't come up with a map name or can't find a good midi, I'd be happy to help out.

U.O.D. said:

Sorry to double post but I was eager to get feedback.

Played your map. At first I wasn't feeling it, but by the end I had a really good time! It definitely stays "classic" gameplay wise, which I think our mapset is sorely lacking. The only thing I thought needed tweaking was lighting around the map—otherwise health, ammo and difficulty were all really well balanced. Oh, and you should remove that switch you place past that tiny metal pillar (the one that opens the door to the red key door), as it does nothing but force the player to backtrack (and switch out one of the PEs from the red key door trap for a caco as the player can easily take them down in their cubby). This'll be a great early E3 map.

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U.O.D. said:

Sorry to double post but I was eager to get feedback.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/bsivmb

I would describe this as a modest map. No stunning architecture, no 1000 revenants, no 1 hour play time. Just Doom II in the spirit of the original. It hasn't been hugely refined so there may be inconsistent lighting or misaligned textures.

Things I've been practicing:
-Using more than one type of texture for an entire map
-Utilizing sound blocking lines
-Making layouts more asymmetrical and less boxy


I liked it. A couple different routes early on, some mild puzzling, pretty classic Doom 2 gameplay.

The caco swarm when you flick the switch past the room with the 2 arachnatrons is kind of odd use of that monster. They're easily avoided and don't really threaten the player through the windows. Might be better to either use hitscanners (an immediate threat to deal with) or something like Barons (something you'll still ignore but which could threaten through the windows).

The little maze area at the end was fun. I was wondering what all the plasma was for, and wasn't disappointed.

It did feel like rooms bled into one another a bit more than I like; going up the water lift to what was previously an empty room inevitably led me to imps and pinkies from other rooms.

You could probably also do more with the ground floor near the exit. Even just a couple deaf zombies or something waiting for you in the corners.

Anyway I streamed it here: http://www.twitch.tv/7doom/c/6008485

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Thanks so much for the feedback you guys. I had intended to do something with the courtyard but couldn't think of anything when I made it. Hopefully it's more interesting now. Also the Monster clogging should be less now.

Here's version 2: https://www.sendspace.com/file/tl7jf0

The only thing left to add is a name. Unfortunately I've never been so good at map names. I'll come up with one before the deadline. Probably.

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U.O.D. said:


Nice map. Has a nostalgic old-school flavour to it. Most lethal part for me was the red key chaingunner trap, although the archvile at the end had me worried. Trap with the imp cages made me laugh, very cheeky. I guess its a little plain by modern standards but feels so solidly built I could throw it down the stairs and it would still work.

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mouldy said:

Nice map. Has a nostalgic old-school flavour to it. Most lethal part for me was the red key chaingunner trap, although the archvile at the end had me worried. Trap with the imp cages made me laugh, very cheeky. I guess its a little plain by modern standards but feels so solidly built I could throw it down the stairs and it would still work.


Thanks so much. It's exactly what I was going for. Some of the maps these days are impressive to be sure, but I've always had a thing for the classic types of maps.

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Howdy, NOVA2_TNq_v2

Both maps combined into one file.
- all custom textures now have prefixes
- skill settings and coop implemented for both
- recent layout and gameplay changes for 'zebetite' included
- some fixes to assure comatibility with older Prboom versions, hopefully the maps work in the next beta

This version requires a few textures from the Nova2 texture pack.

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http://www.mediafire.com/download/lxcyk8xxyn6846u/nova_dav_2.zip

I'm calling it 'Purification Plant'. I think it's pretty much finished. The only thing I haven't done is rename the included CC4 textures, mainly because I'm not sure of the best way to do it, and I thought it would be better to have the map tested by other people before I embark on such a tedious process.

As usual, if there are any problems, let me know and I'll fix them. Thanks.

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Yo Dave, have a FDA

- gorgeous visuals, would be neat to have a bit more blue breaking up the mostly brownish walls but thats just my preference, so good job on that one.

- difficulty wise pretty much ok, Hitscanners placement is a bit tedious at times and a lot of traps contain mostly nobles and-or Rev's which is not a bad thing still i would look forward to a bit more variation here

-had a hard time figuring out what actually was triggered by all those numerous switches. the worst one was the switch that lowers the RK pillar at the start but there were a lot of other situations where i found myself lost and clueless bout what to do next. this was basicly the only thing that really bothered me, otherwise really good map.

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Thanks tourniquet. Your FDA was extremely informative. I now have a pretty good idea on how to make the map a little less cryptic when it comes to switch hunting. I'll also try to add a bit more monster variation.

Any suggestions for music? I haven't even thought about that yet.

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Here's another fda for dave the daring
http://www.mediafire.com/download/skrwi9fgpa6hp5p/nova_dav-mouldy.lmp

I could pretty much exactly echo what tourniquet said. Gorgeous visuals, really creative layout. The action was fairly sedate but would be fitting for an early map certainly, though the large spaces felt a bit empty at times. That might just be because I spent so long wandering around and backtracking trying to figure out what to do next. Still the scenery is nice.

Those switches are way too obscure. In my opinion there should only be a switch for each pillar you have to raise, and perhaps some way of marking them so that its clear they will do something special somewhere else in the map. I'd even be tempted to get rid of all other switches in the map, just because when you press a switch and it activates something nearby, you expect that for all the others too, and waste time looking around wondering what it did. Even the key-switches aren't really needed, and instead of the switch lowering the red key, have a teleporter that takes you to the ledge next to it maybe.

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mouldy said:

Those switches are way too obscure. In my opinion there should only be a switch for each pillar you have to raise, and perhaps some way of marking them so that its clear they will do something special somewhere else in the map. I'd even be tempted to get rid of all other switches in the map, just because when you press a switch and it activates something nearby, you expect that for all the others too, and waste time looking around wondering what it did. Even the key-switches aren't really needed, and instead of the switch lowering the red key, have a teleporter that takes you to the ledge next to it maybe.


I agree totally. I've textured the pillars and corresponding switches with the same blue texture, and I'm about to get rid of any other unnecessary switches. I'll also consider your teleport idea for the red key.

As for the open spaces, I could put a few more enemies here and there to break up the emptiness a bit.

Thanks for your advice mouldy and tourniquet, it's been incredibly helpful and just proves how important it is to get your map play tested by other people.

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Dave The Daring said:

Any suggestions for music? I haven't even thought about that yet.


Take a look at KevinHez's midis in the op othervise check out vgmusic or some of jimmy's stuff.

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played Dave's map twice, once without a midi, the other with a midi that I personally think might suit the map.

as what others before me have stated, the map is quite well done in visuals and design, but I ended up getting lost due to hard to find switches. both times playing I did not finish, as I never found a red key and was unsure of where to go next. I tried to figure out the blue key, which was some sort of switchhunt apparently but I never figured it out either.

the midi I put in on my second playthrough that might suit the map was "Nothing So Cruel" by Mark Klem (from Memento Mori II). I believe it would suit the map well IMO.

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Getsu Fune said:

as what others before me have stated, the map is quite well done in visuals and design, but I ended up getting lost due to hard to find switches. both times playing I did not finish, as I never found a red key and was unsure of where to go next. I tried to figure out the blue key, which was some sort of switchhunt apparently but I never figured it out either.


Thanks for trying it out. I'm currently simplifying the switch huntiness in a major way to make it less frustrating.

Getsu Fune said:

the midi I put in on my second playthrough that might suit the map was "Nothing So Cruel" by Mark Klem (from Memento Mori II). I believe it would suit the map well IMO.


I'll try that out, cheers!

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Alright, it's been a few weeks, but I finally finished the first alpha of my new submission, Into a Blood Red Sky. It's a bit more ambitious than my last map.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1bX8V5Yr798UWNFUXF1bE1WLUU/view?usp=sharing

Give it a spin and send me some feedback on it, particularly on monster placement, since I'm not 100% sure I'm happy with their usage. Difficulty levels are in place, but again, not 100% finalized. There's some misaligned textures still in place; I'm waiting to see if I should change the layout of the map before centering everything.

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NuclearPotato said:

Alright, it's been a few weeks, but I finally finished the first alpha of my new submission, Into a Blood Red Sky. It's a bit more ambitious than my last map.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1bX8V5Yr798UWNFUXF1bE1WLUU/view?usp=sharing

Give it a spin and send me some feedback on it, particularly on monster placement, since I'm not 100% sure I'm happy with their usage. Difficulty levels are in place, but again, not 100% finalized. There's some misaligned textures still in place; I'm waiting to see if I should change the layout of the map before centering everything.


Here's a quick FDA
http://www.mediafire.com/download/el0qszzdvuxrnms/bloodredsky-mouldy.lmp

I'm not sure I got very far, I found myself running through most of it without killing anything while searching for health and ammo. Not sure how you intend it to be played, but it seems like everywhere you go there is more opposition than resources to deal with it. Especially seeing that small army of lost souls I just thought stuff that and legged it. I'm assuming there is enough ammo and health to kill everything as long as you know where to find it, but I didn't find it so had to give up.

Design-wise it has some lighting and architectural flourishes which are nice, although from the little I saw of the map it seemed to be a bit room-corridor-room, but it has some nice non-linearity in the layout. The long steep stairs are a bit annoying, and a lot of the rooms are so tall that it accentuates the fact that all the enemies are on the ground with the player. To make rooms more interesting and fun to play in try adding more architectural variation that the players and enemies can use: balconies, pillars, windows etc.

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http://www.mediafire.com/download/1cxmt0c69r1h86g/nova_dav_3.zip

Purification Plant version 3. It should be a lot easier to figure out now. It also includes Mark Klem's "Nothing So Cruel" as suggested by Getsu Fune, which I think fits the map almost perfectly.

I haven't renamed the CC4 textures yet as I don't know the best way to do so. If somebody could describe the renaming process I'd appreciate it.

Once again, please report any bugs or glaring game play errors and I'll do my best to fix them, but I think it's more or less done. Thanks.

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I'm interested in this if there is still space. Seems like there is. I've release only 2 maps in the past, and have not been making maps for a couple of years...But I've been feeling the itch again :)

Seeing as most of the slots are for later levels, is there a theme I should try to stick with, or just go with whatever I feel like?

Thanks

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Dave The Daring said:


Good good think that'll do. You really simplified the whole switch sequence and the teleporters, that lead to the BK bars, should definitely make things more obvious. Also noticed some more enemy variation like the cacoswarm near RK door and also less tedious distant hitscanners. I like the changes.

As for the texture renaming + prefixes, i hope you're familiar with SLADE. There might be some more uncomplicated ways to do but here's the way i've done it.

-open you PWad and the CC4tex.wad with Slade
-copy all the textures you use in the map from CC4tex into you Pwad
-now rename them respectively add a prefix like "dav" or whatever you prefer
-add the renamed texures to PNames & Texture lumps
-now open your map in DB and replace the textures with the renamed ones in you PWad, the plainest way to replace them is via F4 Find/Replace
-once your done, remove CC4tex.wad from the map resources, if no missing textures show up you've done everything right

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