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Tormentor667

[Wolfenstein: Blade of Agony] Achievement Ideas? (p13)

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Just now, Ermin said:

are we going to see another closed thread lol

 

How Torm conducts himself in his response will play a big part in the longevity of the thread, I think. It'll likely stay open for now unless things implode in a particularly amazing fashion.

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I figured things would go down like this, if you go a few pages back in the thread you can see that I questioned some insensitive things in this mod, to which Torm replied that there was nothing to worry about. I don't know what it is lately with people ruining otherwise great mods by including things of shock value. Newsflash for those kinds of content creators: it isn't even shocking, it's just dumb and juvenile and makes you look like you are perpetually an angry teen with a Slipknot hat on. 

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I've seen mods that were made to be edgy just for shits and giggles but this is on another level and the fact that the hidden files are even there should definitely get people to ask a lot of questions. Whoever had the right idea to keep the messed up shit in the files shouldn't have anything to do with the mod in the first place. It's one thing to be edgy for shits and giggles but it's another when sexist shit gets spewed into a mod. If you want to add shockvalue fine but don't let it hinder the story or gameplay.

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9 minutes ago, Wereknight said:

*Bit o' crassness*

 

Tread lightly, you're one of the people contributing to said implosion.

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Well......if putting achievements are more important than doing a simple asset removal and do the right thing........

 

Damn. 

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2 hours ago, Major Arlene said:

Those "friends" of yours must be very special to you, Torm...

 

Well uh, these sprites exist. (WARNING: NSFW CONTENT, potentially triggering).
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Woah, this is a bunch of Yikes.

This type of content has no place in this mod.

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2 hours ago, Major Arlene said:

Well uh, these sprites exist. (WARNING: NSFW CONTENT, potentially triggering).

 

Well that's a whole bunch of disturbing. What is this guy playing at? He just cannot seem to go five minutes without fucking something up.

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1 hour ago, TheMagicMushroomMan said:

I figured things would go down like this, if you go a few pages back in the thread you can see that I questioned some insensitive things in this mod, to which Torm replied that there was nothing to worry about. I don't know what it is lately with people ruining otherwise great mods by including things of shock value. Newsflash for those kinds of content creators: it isn't even shocking, it's just dumb and juvenile and makes you look like you are perpetually an angry teen with a Slipknot hat on. 

If you dont want to play it, then DONT PLAY IT. You dont have to play it if you disagree with the content. Creators arent obligated to censor their work to appease everybody who complains.

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7 minutes ago, whirledtsar said:

If you dont want to play it, then DONT PLAY IT. You dont have to play it if you disagree with the content. Creators arent obligated to censor their work to appease everybody who complains.

Indeed, and people are similarly not obligated to censor their own concerns about content that reflects poorly on the community.

 

Regardless, I've taken your advice and do not plan to return to my playthrough unless/until concerns are adequately addressed.

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While am happy to honor the debate about creators rights to create stuff and gamers right to not play said stuff, I feel that these are broad issues, and don't address the specifics at hand. The creators of this game should be under no obligation to do so, but it seems to me that the offending sexist/trans material could easily be removed without affecting the game even slightly. So that one to me is a no brainer. 

 

Is a content warning required due to the themes of the persecution of jews, slavs, poles and other holocaust survivors? I don't think it is necessary, as it is not gratuitous, intentional or out of context to the game itself, but there is certainly no harm in having a content warning, out of respect for those who may wish to be forewarned, as well as respect for those directly or indirectly affected by the holocaust itself.

 

*The only broader issue worth noting is how intolerant should we be of the intolerance of others.

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My suggestion for an achievement would be quitting the game successfully...

 

Other than that, just do the standard shit all the other FPS do...

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32 minutes ago, HunterZ said:

Indeed, and people are similarly not obligated to censor their own concerns about content that reflects poorly on the community.

 

Regardless, I've taken your advice and do not plan to return to my playthrough unless/until concerns are adequately addressed.

 

Of course you should also be free to (civilly) voice negative opinions. The thing is your post implied that you assume it's a given that if somebody complains, the creator will and should change their work. Whats disconcerting is the broader attitude in this thread that the mod should be censored or the creator should be shunned.

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3 minutes ago, whirledtsar said:

 

Whats disconcerting is the broader attitude in this thread that the mod should be censored or the creator should be shunned.

 

I see those as reasonable options to someone putting transphobic shit in their mod. Take it out or remove yourself from the communit-wait a minute

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51 minutes ago, whirledtsar said:

If you dont want to play it, then DONT PLAY IT. You dont have to play it if you disagree with the content. Creators arent obligated to censor their work to appease everybody who complains.


You're not wrong, this much is true. However, apart from the obvious things that have already been mentioned; the right of the player to not play it, the right of the critic to criticize, etc. It's also the prerogative of the community to police itself--not just for itself, but for the image it projects to others.

I'm just a no-name Youtuber and fan, but people like MajorArlene and TWC are creators in this community and their voices carry wisdom.

This goes without saying that BOA solicited donations that, had this been public knowledge prior, they may not have generated.

The core issue at play as I see it isn't one of censorship, but of necessity. How much of this problematic content is necessary for the realization of the creator(s) vision?

Whether you are cool with it or not is your own, personal prerogative, but even something like a mod (a very impressive one at that, which is why this is such a baffling and disheartening situation) is subject to the same esthetic scrutiny as everything else. What is the creator saying by putting this into their mod? What messages are they sending by deadnaming and misgendering a person who is inextricably linked to the vitality of this community? As a collective, *who* and *what* ideologies are we supporting by supporting this mod?

Fix the mod, sure; that'd be great from a PR perspective. However, I would hope that the creator(s) might have a sincere conversation with themselves and figure out why these things are necessary to the esthetic vision and--if found unnecessary--why they were there in the first place.

Ideas don't exist in a vacuum, unfortunately, but this is a teachable moment.

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27 minutes ago, dew said:

To complete this thread's nazi bingo, it is actually "its creator".

Made an account to say that's a bar. But uh, yeah, weird torture porn in doom wads is kinda bad, yeah.

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1 minute ago, Dieting Hippo said:

I see those as reasonable options to someone putting transphobic shit in their mod. Take it out or remove yourself from the communit-wait a minute

What specifically is transphobic? I havent played the mod myself. Have you? It seems like a lot of people are just taking every vague accusation at face value and not giving Tormentor667 any benefit of the doubt. It seems like it would be very strange for him to post this mod (a collaborative effort that took a long time to create) on the forum in a seemingly normal/friendly way, but also have outright personal hatred in it.

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1 minute ago, whirledtsar said:

What specifically is transphobic? I havent played the mod myself. Have you? It seems like a lot of people are just taking every vague accusation at face value and not giving Tormentor667 any benefit of the doubt.

 

I played the entire game and my rundown of everything I felt was wrong with its content is posted in this thread.

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Just now, whirledtsar said:

What specifically is transphobic? I havent played the mod myself. Have you? It seems like a lot of people are just taking every vague accusation at face value and not giving Tormentor667 any benefit of the doubt. It seems like it would be very strange for him to post this mod (a collaborative effort that took a long time to create) on the forum in a seemingly normal/friendly way, but also have outright personal hatred in it.

Deadnaming is the use of the birth or other former name of a transgender or non-binary person without the person's consent. Deadnaming may be accidental; however, it may also be used to intentionally dismiss, deny or reject a person's gender identity.

 

misgendering: refer to (someone, especially a transgender person) using a word, especially a pronoun or form of address, that does not correctly reflect the gender with which they identify.
 

a very quick and Googleable lesson.

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1 minute ago, whirledtsar said:

What specifically is transphobic? I havent played the mod myself. Have you? It seems like a lot of people are just taking every vague accusation at face value and not giving Tormentor667 any benefit of the doubt. It seems like it would be very strange for him to post this mod (a collaborative effort that took a long time to create) on the forum in a seemingly normal/friendly way, but also have outright personal hatred in it.

Just gonna assume you just missed this - I know it took me a bit to find it after seeing it quoted elsewhere - so here it is again:

 

6 hours ago, Not Jabba said:

-There's a character in the game who's a "tribute" to Randi Heit, a prominent transwoman in the Doom community who created ZDoom. In the process, she is deadnamed and misgendered. The character named after her is also a shitfaced drunk who jokes about his huge dong. Other tribute characters fared no better, to be fair -- the guy named after Enjay is an emaciated prisoner shitting in a concentration camp outhouse. I can only pray Torm never sees fit to homage me.

 

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3 minutes ago, whirledtsar said:

What specifically is transphobic? I havent played the mod myself. Have you? It seems like a lot of people are just taking every vague accusation at face value and not giving Tormentor667 any benefit of the doubt. It seems like it would be very strange for him to post this mod (a collaborative effort that took a long time to create) on the forum in a seemingly normal/friendly way, but also have outright personal hatred in it.

 

Have you been even reading the thread at all?

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