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noshutdown

"best" sourceport for dos?

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Then I guess "modern port with boom support" would indicate that it's not tested with the old boom family.

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The best way to handle it is the way Eternal does:

                          You need a MBF compatible OpenGL port with
                          support of hi-res textures in wads, MUSINFO lump,
                          tall patches, and music in OGG format.

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noshutdown said:

are there any other dos ports that can play all "boom-compatible" wads, and has better compatibility for both vanilla and boom demos?

Boom itself has pretty decent Vanilla demo compatibility for the era that it was written in. There are a few bugs that got introduced by mistake but for the most part it plays back most Vanilla demos correctly.

"For the era that it was written in" is the key phrase. Here's the thing: the really accurate Vanilla compatibility that you see in ports like PrBoom+ is the result of a long, slow, uphill battle to identify the source of demo desyncs and emulate them, often through some pretty obscure, deep technical hackery. You have entryway himself to thank for this painstaking work, and it's taken a long time to get here.

I remember reading a post ~10 years ago or more where Colin Phipps (the original author of PrBoom) commented that these classes of desync were reliant on obscure DOS behavior and would probably never be possible to really emulate. entryway subsequently proved him wrong. But the important thing here is that by this time, most source port authors had already stopped developing for DOS. If you want good Vanilla demo compatibility, you need to use one of the ports with good compatibility like PrBoom+ or Chocolate Doom, neither of which run on DOS.

My best suggestion is that you give up on finding a single port that satisfies all your needs. If you want to run on DOS, probably your best option is to use Boom (or better, MBF) for most cases, and if you want to watch Vanilla demos, just switch to good old doom2.exe.

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Maes said:

There's also CDoom


I can't find any download links, do you have one?

EDIT: Nevermind, I've found it.

Holering said:

"Man's Best Friend" seems the most innovative IMO. It's really fun, different and just adds a lot of depth and possibility to "Doom". I don't know of any pwads that take advantage of it, which is really unfortunate (honestly who wouldn't want to play "Doom" with an animal partner kicking some demon ass?).


It's Marine's Best Friend, and the only wads I know that were built for it are the Artica Series by Cyb (I played them a long time ago, I think there is a friendly Baron in one of the maps).

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Never_Again said:

The best way to handle it is the way Eternal does:

                          You need a MBF compatible OpenGL port with
                          support of hi-res textures in wads, MUSINFO lump,
                          tall patches, and music in OGG format.

Is that Ogg Vorbis or Ogg Opus? /s

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fraggle said:

Boom itself has pretty decent Vanilla demo compatibility for the era that it was written in. There are a few bugs that got introduced by mistake but for the most part it plays back most Vanilla demos correctly.

"For the era that it was written in" is the key phrase. Here's the thing: the really accurate Vanilla compatibility that you see in ports like PrBoom+ is the result of a long, slow, uphill battle to identify the source of demo desyncs and emulate them, often through some pretty obscure, deep technical hackery. You have entryway himself to thank for this painstaking work, and it's taken a long time to get here.

I remember reading a post ~10 years ago or more where Colin Phipps (the original author of PrBoom) commented that these classes of desync were reliant on obscure DOS behavior and would probably never be possible to really emulate. entryway subsequently proved him wrong. But the important thing here is that by this time, most source port authors had already stopped developing for DOS. If you want good Vanilla demo compatibility, you need to use one of the ports with good compatibility like PrBoom+ or Chocolate Doom, neither of which run on DOS.

My best suggestion is that you give up on finding a single port that satisfies all your needs. If you want to run on DOS, probably your best option is to use Boom (or better, MBF) for most cases, and if you want to watch Vanilla demos, just switch to good old doom2.exe.


thanks for your info, now i think i'll have to live with all those "imperfect" port for a dos retro rig.
there is one more question that i wanna know: how does eternity change over boom? and how shall i tweak its options to emulate vanilla or boom behavior? as i mentioned, eternity(last dos version) managed to play some long and intensive vanilla demos that boom failed, but also failed some sod demos that boom played correctly, i havn't tried if the same case would happen on other boom wads though.

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Moriarti said:

Is that Ogg Vorbis or Ogg Opus? /s

Vorbis. Opus didn't exist in 2011. Why would anyone want to use a format that targets real-time web applications in a WAD anyway?

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Moriarti said:

Is that Ogg Vorbis or Ogg Opus? /s


"OGG" always refer to Ogg Vorbis. Ogg FLAC/Opus/Theora/whatever else use different extensions.

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Ogg Anything has an extension of *.ogg, it doesn't matter what codec(s) are in the container. However, basically because of ignorance of the difference between containers and codecs, it has become common to refer to Ogg Vorbis files as just "Ogg".

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Well if some mentions ogg support, he probably means ogg vorbis, I mean ... seriously.

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BOOM 2.02 demos are a shaky premise for early EE versions because EE is descended from MBF, not from BOOM 2.02, and the two are incompatible in some fundamental ways.

Support has been improved since, in modern versions, by auditing PrBoom-Plus for codepoints where 202 is treated specially.

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Never_Again said:

Why would anyone want to use a format that targets real-time web applications in a WAD anyway?

Assuming you are referring to Opus there, Opus sweeps Vorbis in quality comparisons at any bitrate. Opus doesn't have a target usage.

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chungy said:

Ogg Anything has an extension of *.ogg, it doesn't matter what codec(s) are in the container.

http://wiki.xiph.org/index.php/MIME_Types_and_File_Extensions

Ogg Vorbis I Profile
.ogg applies now for Vorbis I files only
.ogg has more recently also been used for Ogg FLAC and for Theora, too — these uses are deprecated now in favor of .oga and .ogv respectively
has been defined in RFC 3534 for application/ogg, so rfc 3534 will be re-defined

RATIONALE: .ogg has traditionally been used for Vorbis I files, in particular in HW players, hence it is kept for backwards-compatibility

Ogg Anything-That's-Not-Vorbis is supposed to be used one of the following extensions as appropriate: .ogv, .oga, .ogx, .opus, .spx. .ogg is not among them. .ogg is only and exclusively for Ogg Vorbis and absolutely nothing else.

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Maes said:

There's also CDoom

Zed said:

I can't find any download links, do you have one?


Why was CDoom removed from the idgames database? The links were removed from the DoomWiki article and the three diffrent CDoom versions that were avalaible on idgames are gone.

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Yeah, I'm also curious about that, maybe the author asked Ty to take them down? By the way, there were four versions: 1.9, 2.05, 2.06 and 2.07.

Now, since I have no idea why they were taken down, I will abstain from posting links until I'm given permission, sorry.

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I found it on ftp.mancubus.net in pub/idgames/source/.

Did Carlos had problems with Doomworld's reviewers?

Carlos said:

doesn't matter what the idiot reviewers of doomworld say, accept Jesus


Maybe he asked to remove it before he uploaded it to Sourceforge. I found two different projects:
cdoom7: http://sourceforge.net/projects/cdoom/?source=directory and
compact compatible doom: http://sourceforge.net/projects/cdoom7/?source=directory

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I remember Len mention it occasionally on Usenet 15 years ago or so. Don't think I ever ran it, and back then I tried everything I could lay my hands on: WinDoom, Dosdoom, Legacy, Gldoom, ZdoomGL ... Even then Fusion was an obscure project. Rez, who tested MBF with him, is still lurking around somewhere; I bet he'll have more to say on the subject.

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Quasar said:

The programmer went nuts and cursed Ty Halderman to "the hells" or something.

Yeah, exactly. I think he's actually mentally ill. His files were removed after he personally attacked Ty, and now every few months goes on spamming rampages where he floods the Doomworld idgames comments with allcaps homophobic rants about Doomworld, Ty, the US, God, Obama, Putin, and whatever crazy nonsense happens to be going through his head at the time.

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@noshutdown

Have you tested CDoom and Fusion yet? I'd be interested to see if it's worth to set them up in DosBox for fiddling about.

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I suppose one could download the source code of any source port that uses software rendering and build it with DJGPP (or equivalent) under DOSBox.

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mdmenzel said:

I suppose one could download the source code of any source port that uses software rendering and build it with DJGPP (or equivalent) under DOSBox.

Why? There are DOS binaries available.

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mdmenzel said:

I suppose one could download the source code of any source port that uses software rendering and build it with DJGPP (or equivalent) under DOSBox.



Good luck with that. Most current source ports contain too much stuff that's unsupported on DOS.

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Stuff about Carlos


Well, holy shit O_o

I must have been one of the few that found his port interesting, and even reviewed almost every new map released for it (usually by Carlos himself) in newstuff/.

Sure, it was obvious that he was a bit crazed with Jesus and stuff, but I missed this Wesley Willis-like warhellride...

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VGA said:

Why? There are DOS binaries available.


Outside if CDoom (which has been removed) it has been a long time since any of the DOS ports were updated, so that is why I make the suggestion.

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Graf Zahl said:

Good luck with that. Most current source ports contain too much stuff that's unsupported on DOS.


Which is why this whole thread is a head-scratcher. I offered the suggestion to try to help the guy out but honestly, pretty much all modern platforms (including iOS and Android) have a doom sourceport available. DOS is an unsupported relic of an earlier age that most port authors were loathe to support after WinXP had an established user base.

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