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Blackmantis

Real Doom Weapons/toys (with photos)

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FireFish said:

Something which has been bothering me for a very long time is the BFG 9000 being made from a transforming toy.

I can't remember where he might or might not have said this, but I swear I recall Romero saying that the plasmagun and BFG both used the same Rambo gun toy as a basis. I'm pretty sure the Rambo toy had other (attachable) pieces than the what the OP's posted photos show and could be reconfigured.

Keep in mind there's always a good chance that they did some hand-edits on the weapons (and a certainty for some like the chaingun).

Some of the pistol's firing frames are just edits of one another (zoomed, stretched in some parts), so it's possible that any number of changes could've been made by hand to the base sprite before that warping and realigning on the pistol.

The chaingun might've had its red tip digitally recolored (but I can't see the real toy in enough detail to be sure). One thing for certain is that the ends of the barrels connected to the plate were copy-pasted and stuck on the end (possibly scaled a bit) to make it look like the barrels extended slightly past the plate. This can be seen by comparing the press release beta and final version of the sprite.

The shotgun's idle frame was clearly messed with, but the pumping frames were largely unchanged from the alpha version. The alpha idle sprite really is more "true-to-life" (even if it is a bit unclean/messy) as the hand wasn't shrunk (the toy seems kinda small) and the tip of the barrel is consistent with the real toy and the pumping frames (though it looks decidedly BIGGER in the alpha, probably poor cropping from a blurry photo).

Due to all that, liberties to make it physically closer to the sprites will certainly need to be taken if 3D models are made from the actual toys.

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The idle alpha shotgun tip always made me think that it was rather crudely drawn over the photo. Perhaps that part of the crappy source photo was even crappier than the rest.

The chaingun seems to be pretty consistent with that toy photo. I doubt that a lot of it was hand-drawn.

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Sodaholic said:

I can't remember where he might or might not have said this, but I swear I recall Romero saying that the plasmagun and BFG both used the same Rambo gun toy as a basis. I'm pretty sure the Rambo toy had other (attachable) pieces than the what the OP's posted photos show and could be reconfigured.


Well, the tip of both the plasma gun and the BFG are the same, so, that could be what Romero was remembering.

I admit I don't actually have a 1984 Megatron toy, but aside from the similar color scheme, I don't see anything that jumps out as an obvious point for it to be a scan. Maybe something from the back - does this have any details that are shared? My initial inclination is no...

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Magnusblitz said:

Well, the tip of both the plasma gun and the BFG are the same, so, that could be what Romero was remembering.

I admit I don't actually have a 1984 Megatron toy, but aside from the similar color scheme, I don't see anything that jumps out as an obvious point for it to be a scan. Maybe something from the back - does this have any details that are shared? My initial inclination is no...


I don't think the Megatron is what the toy was based on.

Perhaps Metroplex?



He's complex enough to have BFG details, but I need to find some rotated versions of him to check it out. No word from Romero yet.

Also had the first seizure of my life yesterday, sorry for not getting the weapons photos, I'll get them today once I've finished packing.

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The pic you posted is from a Metroplex toy... released in 2013. The one released back in 1986 would be this sucker. This is the best photo gallery I can find, and again, nothing leaps out at me...

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BFG has at least a few similarities (some of them more vague than others) to the dark techy textures:



Details on these textures were most likely taken from various sources. Some of them don't look very transformery to me. In any case, it's more stuff to compare stuff to.

Blackmantis said:

Also had the first seizure of my life yesterday, sorry for not getting the weapons photos, I'll get them today once I've finished packing.

Ouch. I hope you're okay.

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I'd like to lay my hands on the source from which W17_1 and WALL24_1 were sloppily assembled. Must be an interesting image (or a set of images).

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Nice to see some entirely new shots of the various (known) toys used to create the Doom arsenal. I think your images of the Shotgun in particular are the first I've seen using an 'in-game' perspective for the weapon; until now the only image I'd seen like that was this one for the Plasma Rifle (which you've also covered).

DMGUYDZ64 said:

Reaction

Are you trying to become a champion shitposter?

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Not really, but it makes you an annoying poster anyway. Once you get over the top with that kind of posting (which you're already close to, seeing the numerous threads you've recently spammed with random images/animations), you might regret it after getting Losered or banned.

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david_a said:

Where did the notion that the BFG is based on a Transformer of all things come from?


John Romero stated that it was photographs of a transformer toy. Not sure if that's "Transformers Robots in Disguise" transformers, or some generic 1980s car-transforming-into-a-jet toy. I asked him what specific transformer it was if he could remember but he hasn't answered.

BaronOfStuff said:

Nice to see some entirely new shots of the various (known) toys used to create the Doom arsenal. I think your images of the Shotgun in particular are the first I've seen using an 'in-game' perspective for the weapon; until now the only image I'd seen like that was this one for the Plasma Rifle (which you've also covered).


If you google Tootsietoy Dakota, most of the images that pop up are mine as well, from when I bought the first lot back in 2008. I'm actually surprised no-one else has made an effort to secure them and photograph them, since as far as I'm concerned, they're of significant thematic/game historical value.

This one was the first Tootsietoy Dakota I got which was brand new, and has the fancy engraving pattern.



Miserable attempt at modeling it in 2009.


I'm in the middle of a very tight move at the moment, am leaving the state on Friday, but I promise that I'll get around to getting some high quality in-game-style shots once I arrive at the new home, and I'll see if I can get the perspectives, angles, hands etc as close as possible. Chaingun #2 has arrived, but I'm boxing everything up at the moment. Eager Beaver comes next!

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Blackmantis said:

I think so, yeah. Toy guns apparently had normal tips from the 50s onwards. I remember toy guns here in Australia began getting the red tips around the late 1990s (especially after the Martin Bryant shooting in 1996). It isn't a problem if the tip is just temporary or inside the barrel as they can be removed, but it's a real pain in the butt when the manufacturers actually make the physical muzzle out of solid red plastic. Spray-painting doesn't stay on plastic so well without scratching off as far as I've found.


What do you think of the conspiracy theories stating that he couldn't possibly have had the shooting skills that the gunman demonstrated, etc?

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Blackmantis said:

I'm in the middle of a very tight move at the moment, am leaving the state on Friday, but I promise that I'll get around to getting some high quality in-game-style shots once I arrive at the new home, and I'll see if I can get the perspectives, angles, hands etc as close as possible. Chaingun #2 has arrived, but I'm boxing everything up at the moment. Eager Beaver comes next!


So soon we can expect HD Weapon sprites for Doom? Sweet! =D

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I would like to take advantage of this 11 month old bump to point out the imgur pics from the OP are down.

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invictius said:

What do you think of the conspiracy theories stating that he couldn't possibly have had the shooting skills that the gunman demonstrated, etc?


You never know - he may have had a low IQ, but there are people with congitive and mental disorders out there that can also remember pi to 484 decimal places.

Piper Maru said:

How on earth are you guys finding this stuff? Regardless, cool beans!


Magic ;)

But in actuality, it's all out there online. I guess if you search hard enough, you'll find the info you want online. I've trawled through ancient 90s Chatroom/IM/Newsgroup logs, interviews, all sorts, and you find little bits at a time.

IMX said:

I would like to take advantage of this 11 month old bump to point out the imgur pics from the OP are down.


Sorry about that, been trying to keep my imgur gallery clean and simple so I can find what I need, and at the moment it's choked up with random doom stuff. However, once I get some really nice high quality pictures, I'll stick them in an album and leave them up for good.

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Hey BlackMantis, once you get some high-quality pics up on imgur.... do you think people may or may not make some higher-quality sprites of the weapons? =P

Or maybe even smoother animations? =3

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DoomzRules said:

Hey BlackMantis, once you get some high-quality pics up on imgur.... do you think people may or may not make some higher-quality sprites of the weapons? =P

Or maybe even smoother animations? =3


I think that will be at the forefront of everyones thinking ;)

Thanks for mentioning smoother animations - I'll make sure to get HEAPS of captures so we can make uber smooth shotgun pumps and chaingun rotations etc. Just cropping them is gonna take time.

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