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Patrol1985

Brutal Doom v20 released

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I don't think anyone noticed that he was joking.

I like it... but I think Sgt Mark IV should change the skin color of the chaingunners to be white, and make the imps pink so that the game would be slightly less racist. He should also have the white characters utter racial slurs so that you won't feel bad about killing them.

...every single last one of them.

Poe's Law. ;)


Also, what's with the Call of Duty comparisons? What does BD have to do with Call of Duty at all? ADS and reloading? Serious Sam 3 and the new ROTT had those, guess they're like CoD too.

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Call of duty is a multi million franchise, scooping up cash because of the fact that oh so manny people truly like to play it. Reason enough for the internet to contradict the sales numbers and to stir up the hornets nest, and to compare everything with it. From my point of view, the hype around acting cool by being against anything succesfull has long past my head from the moment i got older than 16.

Brutal doom is fun, it adds something old named violence to something old, together with adding some new additions like aiming. Its somebody his hobby and nothing to be graded as if its made by a multi million dollar company.

And its succesfull.

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alexz721 said:

Thanks for commenting on the gameplay and not crapping on the mod like everyone else.

Seriously guys, take a chill pill. Brutal Doom fans aren't ruining vanilla or the mapping community.

It's not about anyone ruining anything, it's about people posting stuff like this:

illuknisaa said:

I don't want to sound like an ass but BD is better than vanilla in every way.

The feel of the guns in vanilla is just awful. The pistol is easily one worst weapons I've see in an fps. Low damage, slow fire rate, inaccurate. Take a look at pistols in other games. In fear 1 pistol is accurate, can be dual wielded for more fire power and can take out most enemies with well aimed shots. In hl2 pistol is really useful for long range shots and taking out smaller enemies like headcrabs and manhacks. Even in call of duty pistol has many advantages over other guns. In BD assault rifle is a really versatile weapon.

The enemy variety and ai is just dull. The imp most likely most common projectile enemy in doom and it is completely harmless. The imp moves slow, has a slow attack and its ai is not aggressive (it only tries (and fails) to kill you every other second). Baron and hellknight could be named as imp 1.5 and imp 2.0. In BD imp has more interesting move set allowing them to make a leap attack if the player is close (this means they can also jump down from ledges). Imp is an interesting enemy in BD.

BD also allows more varied gameplay styles. I can go the classical way of shooting everybody I see, I can go stealth neck snapping (even if I get spotted I can retreat and wait enemies to calm down) or I can interact with the environment to create ambushes by moving barrels or using them as platform to approach locations from different angles.

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It is that person his oppinion, he likes BD over vanilla and he explains why... I see no problem, it is exactly the same as people saying they prefer vanilla over BD while giving a reason.

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VGA said:

It's not about anyone ruining anything, it's about people posting stuff like this:


The point you are trying to make is that people shouldn't post opinions and views that differ from your own?

Wouldn't it be easier to just change what you can, and accept that sometimes you can't change certain things, and just try to live in peace and harmony with other Doom lovers?

Getting upset because someone likes Brutal Doom more than Vanilla Doom is kinda silly, and it kinda makes you look like this: http://imgur.com/BRVFB9H

edit: Brutal Doom and Vanilla Doom (or Freedoom) both have their places, and sometimes you can only use one or the other with certain maps. I think Brutal Doom is mostly intended to be used with Vanilla Doom, and Vanilla Doom is mostly intended to be used with everything that isn't Brutal Doom compatible, which is a lot of mods and maps. I usually play maps first in Vanilla Freedoom, then I play them with BD if it looks like there isn't anything that will be broken.

edit2: My one major beef with BD v20 is that the weapons don't auto-switch like in vanilla Doom, which can make things a little stressful when you have to look at the screen to figure out which guns have ammo, and then you have to waste a second or two to hit the right button for that gun. Well, they auto-switch SOMETIMES in BD, but there are times when they won't, for unknown reasons. Typing IDFA will definitely break the auto-switcher.

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illuknisaa said:

You are arguing that doom weapons are good because they are consistently awful? In vanilla I don't have to aim because of crazy aimbot (crazier than your console shooter and we all know how good console shooters are...) Total lack of skill shots, guns sound flat (except shotgun which sounds like somebody is farting) and extreme lack variety in weapon design. Shotgun, ssg and bfg are basically the same gun reskinned. Chaingun has identical bullet spread when compared to shotgun... Doom basically only has 5 different weapons, melee, chaingun, shotgun (sg, ssg or bfg), ear rape, and rocket laucher. Pretty much every other fps has more weapon variety (maybe call of duty has only 5 too).

Other projectile enemies are hardly much different from the imp. Only hit scanners and arch-vile are really dangerous. Projectile enemies are a non threat unless you cant dodge their attacks.


lol at you knowing nuttin.

Shoots a zombie with ssg in vanilla. It falls down on the ground.

"THIS GUN IZ STRONK, me likey"

Shoots a zombie with ssg in BD. The body explodes into flesh giblets and paints the walls in red. Player gets flow into a lava pit from the kick.

"feels weak"


I think he meant to quote this.

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@FireFish @frithiof
The point isn't that he prefers BD to vanilla, it's that he is saying that Doom sucks basically. And what's with that shitty image you posted? I'm getting out of this thread before I get out of line.

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SavageCorona said:

The vanilla shotgun really pisses me off just because of that tiny flesh coloured thing poking out of the bottom right. I assume it's his pinky finger but why would it be so far from the rest of his fingers? It's next to the rest when he pumps it.


Damn you, I never noticed that before and now I can't unsee it.

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DeathMetalAccountant said:

Damn you, I never noticed that before and now I can't unsee it.

Use the Minor Sprite Fixing project:
http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/62403-doom-2-minor-sprite-fixing-project-v1-2-release-updated-1-1-13/

or my Dehacked smooth weapons release:
http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/73149-smooth-vanilla-weapons/

or if using (g)zdoom, Smooth Doom.
http://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=45550

Or use the Doom Retro port.
http://www.doomretro.com/

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VGA said:

@FireFish @frithiof
The point isn't that he prefers BD to vanilla, it's that he is saying that Doom sucks basically.


I'm pretty sure that if he genuinely thought Doom sucked, he probably wouldn't even bother using Brutal Doom.

I mean, I think Doom 3 sucks, and even if there was a Brutal Doom 3, I wouldn't play it because I don't like the underlying game. I want to like Doom 3, but it just doesn't... it's like going out on a date with a girl when you aren't attracted to her at all, and you know you'll just end up ignoring all of her calls and text messages. And then after a couple years you forget whose number that is, and you call her up and go out on another date, and you end up being disappointed again.

Doom 3 is that girl.

Doom 1/2, however, is that girl that you end up marrying. Brutal Doom is the harlot that you cheat on your wife with, but you always end up returning to your one true love...

Anyhow, my point is that there's not really any point in getting angry about this stuff. It's just a game.

Also, what is up with that red mystery timer in the upper right corner?

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Mark is a dick, sure, but he can make a good mod!

v20 is cleaner, it runs better on my PC, it has more gore, it feels different when I play it, etc. etc. I like it. It's fun to play every once and a while because I like blowing things apart in video games. That's why I'm getting DOOM 4. It's gory and it's got Brutal DOOM elements - like it should.

You can say what you want about Brutal DOOM spawning obnoxious fans and it having balancing issues, (v20 fixes a lot of stuff.) and Mark not giving credit, but he did make a good mod. I can't really play any gameplay changing mods that add things that aren't "Doomy" unless there's custom sprites and maps to accompany it - such as Action DOOM 2) Brutal DOOM is one of the best mods that stay "Doomy" but at the same time add a new layer that makes the game more fun for some people.

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Elaxter said:

Mark is a dick, sure, but he can make a good mod!

v20 is cleaner, it runs better on my PC, it has more gore, it feels different when I play it, etc. etc. I like it. It's fun to play every once and a while because I like blowing things apart in video games. That's why I'm getting DOOM 4. It's gory and it's got Brutal DOOM elements - like it should.

You can say what you want about Brutal DOOM spawning obnoxious fans and it having balancing issues, (v20 fixes a lot of stuff.) and Mark not giving credit, but he did make a good mod. I can't really play any gameplay changing mods that add things that aren't "Doomy" unless there's custom sprites and maps to accompany it - such as Action DOOM 2) Brutal DOOM is one of the best mods that stay "Doomy" but at the same time add a new layer that makes the game more fun for some people.


Would you say that Brutal Doom is "Doomier than Doom"?

:P

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I've decided to try BD 2.0 and I have to admit it's absolutely fantastic. I'm really impressed by those otherwise insignificant changes that could have easily been omitted, but which have been included anyway - such as water ripples. Great job Mark! I'm joining the ranks of BD fans :P

However, I will NOT agree with people who say that BD is harder than vanilla. Right now I'm playing "Doom II" IWAD and thus far (I reached map08) each level has been significantly easier (I play on ultra-violence and compare it to vanilla ultra-violence). When I first blasted a Revenant into oblivion with just one super-shotgun shot I thought "really? that's all it takes?", mind you it's not a BAD thing - the MOD is insanely fun because of that. I'm just stating that it is NOT harder than vanilla. The spin-up time of chaingunners gives me plenty of time to run and hide from the barrage. Shotgun guys have to reload their shotguns, most weapons deal insane damage and even the default assault rifle can make short work of many mid-tier opponents because of headshots...

... and I love it! Brutal Doom is not meant to be competitive. It's meant to be fun and definitely delivers in that area. I genuinely recommend it for people who seek some leisure killing instead of trying to make those nightmare runs succesful :D

I'm eagerly waiting for Sgt. Mark IV's map pack.

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illuknisaa said:

guns sound flat (except shotgun which sounds like somebody is farting)

I think you don't know what farting sounds like.

This is the 2nd time I've seen someone claim the shotgun sounds like farting. Hmmm...

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TheUltimateDoomer666 said:

I think you don't know what farting sounds like.

This is the 2nd time I've seen someone claim the shotgun sounds like farting. Hmmm...



It's clearly a duck.

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frithiof said:

Would you say that Brutal Doom is "Doomier than Doom"?

:P


I would not say that at all! Lol. Doom is the Doomiest Doom that ever Doomed. Nothing's going to replace the classic Doom feel. Brutal Doom is just an augmentation of Doom that, like many other gameplay mods, add layers that some like and others don't.

I hope Doom 4 is "Doomier than Doom."

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Elaxter said:

I would not say that at all! Lol. Doom is the Doomiest Doom that ever Doomed. Nothing's going to replace the classic Doom feel. Brutal Doom is just an augmentation of Doom that, like many other gameplay mods, add layers that some like and others don't.

I hope Doom 4 is "Doomier than Doom."


I just hope Doom 4 doesn't turn into a Doom 4ever, like a certain other FPS game.

That was horrible. I still occasionally have nightmares about the Holsom Twins.

Honestly, I wouldn't even be all that mad if Doom 4 ended up essentially being Brutal Doom for Doom 3. And if they stole some ideas from the Going Down megawad, that would be cool, too.

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Patrol1985 said:

When I first blasted a Revenant into oblivion with just one super-shotgun shot I thought "really? that's all it takes?", mind you it's not a BAD thing - the MOD is insanely fun because of that. I'm just stating that it is NOT harder than vanilla.


A very well-placed SSG shot will kill a revenant. Get it off by just a little bit and you'll only make them angry. Plus their top half might keep going and blast you anyway. It makes playing levels on BD that over-rely on revenants *cough*BTSX*cough* completely insane. Honestly I'm not sure you can accurately say BD is either harder or easier than Vanilla, it's just a different style of gameplay with strengths and weaknesses very different from where you might find them in the original game.

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Sorry for the bump, and if this has already been posted. I searched more than half the pages of this thread and didn't find anything similar, so I am being lazy.

1. Does anyone have a list of flats that 'glow' in Brutal Doom? Obviously, all of those which represent lighting do this, but there are others which do not, and they do not glow in standard GZDoom.

2. Invisibility spheres becoming captured Marines is awesome, but is there a list of other features which mappers can use, besides what is in the changelog?

3. In checking a Map07, I used the console command, "kill monsters", but none of the tag 666 sectors lowered. Is this a bug, or does it only happen because I was cheating?

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I'm pretty sure the glow effect caused by liquids in BD is because of some fancy shmancy engine stuff that Mark will have to tell you how he did. It's highly doubtful that the flat is what gives off the glow seeing as you can just straight up rip the flat into a standard Doom map and it won't give the glow effect.

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The flat glows are produced by a GLDEFS lump. Just copy and paste this into a wad.

Glow
{
	Flats
	{
	        BLOOD1
		BLOOD2
		
		FLAT17
		FLAT2
		FLAT22
		FLOOR1_7
		RROCK01
		RROCK02
		
		
		RROCK05
		RROCK06
		RROCK07
		RROCK08

		
		tlite6_1
		tlite6_4
		grnlite1
		ceil3_4
		ceil3_3
		floor1_7
		gate4
		gate1
		gate3
		TLITE6_6
		
		NUKAGE1
		NUKAGE2
		NUKAGE3
		LAVA1
		LAVA2
		LAVA3
		LAVA4
		DOORBLU
		DOORBLU2
		DOORRED
		DOORRED2
		DOORYEL
		DOORYEL2
		
		SLIME03
		SLIME02
		SLIME01
		
		SLIME09
		SLIME10
		SLIME11
		SLIME12
		}
}

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Thank you for the list, Sergeant_Mark_IV, and for your marvelous mod. (Old stuff to you regulars, but I just discovered it!) Everything is beautiful with the GL glow, but it was CEIL3_3 that made me wonder. Using as an upper texture for decorative alcoves, I thought something was wrong, since none of the other non-lighting, non-animated flats seemed to glow.

So then, I can use this GLDEFS lump to edit which flats glow in Brutal Doom v20, without changing anything else in the mod?

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Linguica said:

I hear it's actually going to include a full megawad level set with it, which interests me .

Did it ever happen ?

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