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Buckshot

did the UAC bioengineer and fuse demons with cybernetic enhancements?

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I've always tried to make sense of the cybernetic and hydraulic weaponry, implant's and prosthetic limbs of the doom demons...

it seems that in the classic Doom games, the demons just appeared from the teleportation experiments with these devices already fused into them, while in the doom movie the "alien mutations" didn't seem to have such implants other than pinkies chair being fused to him when he turned.

Now looking at Doom 3 and from trailer footage of Doom (4), I see UAC logos directly engraved into those demons cybernetic enhancements (and the new doom trailer seems to suggest that scientists engineered them with such... possibly to make some sort of demon-like military sentry).

anybody have any clear-cut explanation? I can't honestly think any corporation who went into The depths of hell and extracted demons to mutilate and mechanize would have possibly thought that was going to end well... Unless I'm misunderstanding this.

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It's all there in the manual.

The Doom manual said:

For the last four years the military, UAC's biggest supplier, has used the remote facilities on Phobos and Deimos to conduct various secret projects, including research on inter-dimensional space travel. So far they have been able to open gateways between Phobos and Deimos, throwing a few gadgets into one and watching them come out the other. Recently however, the gateways have grown dangerously unstable.

The demons have had access to UAC technology for years. When they eventually learned how to make use of it, they did.

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Foxpup said:

It's all there in the manual.

The demons have had access to UAC technology for years. When they eventually learned how to make use of it, they did.


Hmmm. By gadgets I always assumed they meant "tossed in a wrench to see if it'd come out the other side."

Course it appears they sent in people as well that came back horribly deranged, so guess it makes perfectly good sense they tossed in plasma rifles, rocket launchers, robotic prosthetics, etc for no reason whatsoever, lol

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I always assumed the Cyberdemon was just a product of hell.

It's clearly supposed to be a merger of demon and human technology, just like the rest of E2 which has tech base levels that are half transformed into demonic settings. The Cyberdemon is the final product of that - it is E2 personified.

One of the Doom alphas had the pinky demons in an alternate version with metal teeth. I wonder if they were originally conceived as E2-specific monsters?

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fraggle said:

I always assumed the Cyberdemon was just a product of hell.

It's clearly supposed to be a merger of demon and human technology, just like the rest of E2 which has tech base levels that are half transformed into demonic settings. The Cyberdemon is the final product of that - it is E2 personified.

One of the Doom alphas had the pinky demons in an alternate version with metal teeth. I wonder if they were originally conceived as E2-specific monsters?


so what you're saying fraggle is hell, more or less, assimilated and 'consumed' the tech and the base as it came through the portals? I can see that transformation... like a fungus spreading as transforming terrain as you get closer to the portal... defintley apparent in doom 3 as the levels progress... you can see it growing and transforming everything in the base now that I think about it.

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In addition to what's been said, don't forget that various Doom games are basically non-canon. Doom 3 was a reimagination of the classic games, Doom 4 will apparently be another reboot. Even Final Doom and Doom 64 are considered non-canon with the classic D1/2 games, at least story-wise and at least by some people. The "rational explanation" of the rules of Hell and its technology might not be consistent between the games.

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I like to think it was aliens, or any kind of third force here, besides human and hell-kind. Notice how Doom 1 episode 3 gets darker towards the end, until you get to E3M8 which has that gigantic TEKWALL corridor and the central gizmo building. Also both final bosses are robotic, and the final Doom 1 boss is the most peculiar one (what's got a giant brain on steel legs have to do with Satan?). Basically I mean that a third, brain-like species has manipulated and experimented on the demons, then sent them to Mars.

I like to imagine there being a PWAD, deep in these aliens' world, full of strange robotic brain monsters, enslaving normal demons and humans alike (think of Strogg for example). Even cooler if it crosses over into the Strife world (the Order).

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scifista42 said:

In addition to what's been said, don't forget that various Doom games are basically non-canon. Doom 3 was a reimagination of the classic games, Doom 4 will apparently be another reboot. Even Final Doom and Doom 64 are considered non-canon with the classic D1/2 games, at least story-wise and at least by some people. The "rational explanation" of the rules of Hell and its technology might not be consistent between the games.


So with this... that means the -only- plot we should be focused on is DOOM 1 and DOOM 2?

I thought (its been mentioned here in the past as well) DOOM 64 was also cannon, while final doom was not?

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Buckshot said:

I thought (its been mentioned here in the past as well) DOOM 64 was also cannon, while final doom was not?

I've always considered Doom, Doom 2, Final Doom, and Doom 64 to all be canon, though I don't think there's ever been an official statement.

Also, wasn't it Carmack or Romero who said Hell has its own technology? Something about... if humans have high tech weapons and stuff, why shouldn't the demons have some too?

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fraggle said:

One of the Doom alphas had the pinky demons in an alternate version with metal teeth. I wonder if they were originally conceived as E2-specific monsters?

I think you've got that all wrong. The imp and pinky were designed before the final plot was hashed out. The pinky's eyes were originally tan and his teeth white. The imp's teeth are white too, they're not metal.

From what I can tell, there were 2 art passes done on the pinky since the alpha version. The first pass was a simple recoloration, the eyes turning yellow and the teeth turning tan to appear stained. The second pass ignored the attack and pain frames, leaving those inconsistent with the rest of the frames. There, the legs were redrawn from scans of a posable dinosaur toy to look more like raptor running and less like clumsily rubbing his feet along the floor. Fresh bloodstains were added to the tips of his teeth, orange bumps were added to his shins for some weird reason, and the contrast on his skin was bumped up.

I've got no idea where the final version's death animation fits into all of this.

fraggle said:

I always assumed the Cyberdemon was just a product of hell.

It's clearly supposed to be a merger of demon and human technology, just like the rest of E2 which has tech base levels that are half transformed into demonic settings. The Cyberdemon is the final product of that - it is E2 personified.

Tom Hall came up with it and its original name was the "Technodemon", where the demons stole it somehow.

I strongly suspect E2 and E3 switched roles sometime around October to November. Tom's original story was Techbase, Hell, Corrupt Techbase. The game as-released featured Techbase, Corrupt Techbase, Hell. The press release beta (likely built in late Sep. or early Oct.) had E2M2 and E3M5 in the other episodes' slots (though, this doesn't necessarily mean anything).

The beta's scores for killing enemies was directly proportional to their spawning HP. If the Cyber and Spider demons swapped places, you'd get 20,000 points for killing the E1 twin bosses, 30,000 for killing the E2 hell boss, and 40,000 for killing the final corrupt tech base boss.

Though, the spider demon is tougher due to its higher damage and aggressiveness, and even then, the boss placement doesn't necessarily have to depend on the setting.

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I've always thought that while E1 and 2 were in progress, the demons were pillaging the UAC bases to steal their tech to make hell-factories.

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DooM_RO said:

I've always thought that while E1 and 2 were in progress, the demons were pillaging the UAC bases to steal their tech to make hell-factories.


Well I mean, heh...

"All your base are belong to us"

just throwing that at there :P

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In the original games I like to think the demons simply assimilated human weaponry. As for Doom 3 I think Betruger outfitted the demons with said technology, either that or the demons took it from the ancient Martians aeons ago. I'll even speculate that the D3 Revenants are the reanimated remains of the Martian race.

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I always thought that because the UAC had been experimenting with the teleporters before hell invaded, the demons where influencing UAC scientists before the actual invasion occurred. While the scientists didn't directly work on the Cyberdemon or the Mastermind. They probably gave the raw materials and technological knowledge to the demons either directly or indirectly. Hell simply waited tell they had amassed enough knowledge of our tech to turn it against us before invading.

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HorrorMovieGuy said:

The phobos anomaly was an inside job.

Je suis UAC.

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HorrorMovieGuy said:

The phobos anomaly was an inside job.


Hellfire doesn't melt steel prosthetic legs.

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From what I can read in this thread, I suppose the bottomline is: it's up to everybody to make it's own interpretation of the how and the why of the different aspects of Doom's universe.

I think the background and story were purposefully left unclear (the pinnacle being Doomguy himself - doesn't even have a proper name) so that people can use their imagination and fill up the gaps the way they want.

My own thinking has always been that Hell was simply another dimension and the demons were alien species with their own advanced bionic technology, that UAC tried to copy and assimilate (see the portals' design that clearly seems to be the product of Hell).

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printz said:

I like to think it was aliens, or any kind of third force here, besides human and hell-kind. Notice how Doom 1 episode 3 gets darker towards the end, until you get to E3M8 which has that gigantic TEKWALL corridor and the central gizmo building. Also both final bosses are robotic, and the final Doom 1 boss is the most peculiar one (what's got a giant brain on steel legs have to do with Satan?). Basically I mean that a third, brain-like species has manipulated and experimented on the demons, then sent them to Mars.

I like to imagine there being a PWAD, deep in these aliens' world, full of strange robotic brain monsters, enslaving normal demons and humans alike (think of Strogg for example). Even cooler if it crosses over into the Strife world (the Order).


Um... I think it would make more sense if the aliens and there advanced tech got enslaved by hell before humans were attacked. The brain-like monsters are alien versions of zombies while the bioenginnered demons were made by hell making use of alien tech.

As for my own theory, Doom doesn't make a lot of sense, so the mad scientist types that went to hell over the ages were forced to work for the demons as a part of their eternal torment. And besides... If humans can have sci-fi weapons, why can't demons?

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Piper Maru said:

either that or the demons took it from the ancient Martians aeons ago.


Probably this.

It's really dumb and doesn't make sense, but this...

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