Ammunition in Hell?

[Tompig]

Hey guys, a thought crossed my mind the other day when I was going over some doom theories with my wife... Do the demons manufacture their own ammo?

I know that in the UAC bases things like shotgun shells, bullets etc were probably dropped by former humans and marines but you still find these in abundance in later hell levels. (obviously for gameplay)

Zombies aside, because of Cyberdemons, revenant , arachnotrons and the Spider-mastermind is it a possibility that there are some hellish munition factories kicking about?

And if there were, would they also care enough to supply the zombie forces, or is the fact they are armed just a happy coincidence for hell?

[Deleted_Account]

I think it's for the zombie army the demons seem to have kicking around their dimension.

[nxGangrel]

I have wondered that same question for years. I never understood why there are guns, ammo, and health on hell, and why there are marine zombies present also. Apparently Doomguy wasn't the only marine who went to hell. I guess the only really reasonable explanation is the forces of hell merged with the technology developed by the UAC, explaining most of the reasons why.

[Deleted_Account]

Also the Cyberdemon needs rockets and the Spider Mastermind needs it's bullets etc.

[Tompig]

I don't think the zombies are marines, non of them wear the same armour as doomguy. I think they might be generic dead dudes who are given their kit whilst in hell... just a thought. (I would assume if there were factories they'd melt down marine armour for more useful things, hence why the zombies are all in basic suits.)

[40oz]

In Doom 1 specifically, knee deep in the dead is significantly more ammo dense than the other episodes.

Sometimes you gotta look past the realistic context of item placement in Doom for it to work in the game. No one just leaves that shit on the floor. Put it on a shelf or a table or something.

[Clonehunter]

As for the first and second episode of Doom, I figured that the ammo on the ground was stuff dropped by the soldiers who preceded you.

As for the bigger guys, I'm guessing they just manufacture their own ammo internally through magic. And if anything, despite the Cyber's big rocket launcher, his missiles seem to come more from his crotch. One Hell of an orgasm.

[GreyGhost]

The stuff's manufactured and delivered by Santa Claus, it's Mrs. Claus' way of getting him out of the house on the 364 nights that aren't before Christmas.

[Maes]

I recall some 1994 WAD had a very existential readme and plot, which involved trying to discover WHO has been secretly playing "on your team" for so long, leaving all those supplies and ammo for you to find, even in the most desolate and bizarre places.

[scifista42]

Indeed, ammunition in Hell doesn't make sense. It doesn't even make sense lying on the floor everywhere. It's there for gameplay, because Doom is a shooter game. Same for zombified humans in Hell, they're there because of enemy variety (hitscanners pose a different threat than slow projectile throwers).

[LogicDeLuxe]

It's also interesting that monsters never run out of ammo.
And why are there medkits everywhere but no injured monsters bother to use them?

I wonder how different the game would feel, if monsters could run out of ammo, and if they could pickup medkits, armor, weapons, ammo and even powerup spheres whenever they have a use for it.
And if you pick up a dropped weapon, it should have just as much ammo, the monster had in it.

[Maes]

Even better, you could get in business with an archvile: have him resurrect any zombiemen that you kill, you pick up their weapons, repeat: soon you'll have an infinite arsenal of weapons and ammo, which can be sold for profit, or at least melted for metal. Hey, more efficient than manufacturing/mining!

Doom: Capitalist Exploitation Edition ;-)

Edit: I wonder if crushed barrels can be resurrected...hmm...

[LogicDeLuxe]

Maes said:

Even better, you could get in business with an archvile: have him resurrect any zombiemen that you kill, you pick up their weapons, repeat: soon you'll have an infinite arsenal of weapons and ammo, which can be sold for profit

To bad, there is no one willing to buy anything in Doom. There isn't any money to begin with.

Related to my last post, monsters should be revived without a weapon if you picked it up. Or with no ammo, if they ran out already.

[joe-ilya]

[Clonehunter]

LogicDeLuxe said:

It's also interesting that monsters never run out of ammo.

This is probably the only thing I don't question in video games, to the point where I begin to wonder "Why do enemies run out of ammo in Max Payne?"

[scifista42]

LogicDeLuxe said:

I wonder how different the game would feel if monsters could run out of ammo

Like deathmatch against total wimps.

Enemies in games should act like sources of threat, and the game itself challenges you to deal with the threat. I'm willing to accept tweaking some logic to improve this threat - it will improve the game, not break it. Not only thanks to the challenge, but also thanks to stimulating imagination. Strict realism tends to be boring, but even the silliest fantasizing can be really fun.

and if they could pickup medkits, armor, weapons, ammo and even powerup spheres whenever they have a use for it.

It would mostly lead to unfairness to a player without foreknowledge of what's going to happen, even more than usual. Unless the item placement and game design were crafted out really really carefully.

[Memfis]

I think monsters put health items and ammo everywhere because they don't really want you to die. The thing is, all of them are cursed with eternal sleep. You can see it for yourself: none of the monsters move until they notice you, so that means that you're the only thing in the world that can awake them. Of course they want you to survive for as long as possible because they hate being in that lifeless state. Monsters actually have a lot of respect for Doomguy.

[Marnetmar]

they eat humans and shit ammo.

[xAn]

Ever heard about import? Capitalism even works in hell...

[wildweasel]

The ammo committed cardinal sins in its life on Earth and was condemned to Hell for all eternity. So by picking it up and firing it, you're granting it a second lease on life.

[Inkie]

They come from previous doomguys that happened to die there.

[Jaxxoon R]

Hell is a realm of fire and brimstone, chock-full of nasty pink demons. The forces of chaos cause tools of destruction to sprout like mildew from the seed that is the hatred within the very soil of the land.

[HorrorMovieRei]

Jaxxoon R said:

The forces of chaos cause tools of destruction to sprout like mildew from the seed that is the hatred within the very soil of the land.

So basically, ammo grows on trees because the landscape of hell is made of hatred? This is the most Metal thing I've ever read

[SYS]

I guess this is a better logic thread than "UAC toilets and where does all the demon poo go?"

[Darch]

xAn said:

Ever heard about import? Capitalism even works in hell...

Hell is clearly another invention of the pharmaceutical and arms industries to sell more ammunition and medkits in order to obtain higher profits.

[GreyGhost]

LogicDeLuxe said:

To bad, there is no one willing to buy anything in Doom. There isn't any money to begin with.

There's apparently a thriving black market in souls, lost or otherwise.

[Janus3003]

I wrote a short fanfic about the Icon of Sin once, and I went with the idea that Hell leaves weapons and ammo lying around mostly to taunt the Marine. Let him hope to survive so that his final despair is all the sweeter.
Granted, that explanation doesn't really work in the game itself where Hell gives you more than enough firepower to wipe them all out.

Tompig said:

I was going over some doom theories with my wife...

...I need a woman like that in my life.

[RightField]

An Arch-Wife?

[SyntherAugustus]

If you think about it, you'll have an even worse time trying to figure out how there's ammo in Quake.

[Unholypimpin]

joe-ilya said:

http://comics.farazparsa.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/2009-08-18-medpacks.jpg

LOL thats pretty funny!

Also i'm pretty sure the demons dragged marines down to hell kicking and screaming and loaded with ammo and health, after the marines were eaten by the demons they just left the ammo and guns there because most demons don't give a shit about human technology. I could imagine when arachnotrons or spider masterminds find these human items they slap the shit out of the nearest demon and say wtf is wrong with you? WHY WOULD YOU LEAVE THIS HERE FOR THE DOOMGUY TO PICK UP!!!