Doom 4 Unveiled

[Zack]

I log in so rarely to this forum that it amazes me every time I remember the password. Hi. :)

I'm seeing a good number of erm..."passionate" responses about how this game isn't the classic Doom experience we were hoping for. Frankly if you want the classic Doom experience, Chocolate Doom exists for a reason. id obviously can't make the exact same game with better graphics and expect it to be a smash hit.

That said, I do agree with Jewellds that the game is too "brown." They should have learned that lesson not from Doom 3 but from Quake 1 long, long ago. Otherwise, the graphics and enemy design still show an awful resemblance to Doom 3 (which is now as old as Doom was when it came out).

I don't see that changing in 8 or 9 months so I guess that means we're going to have to cross our fingers that the game play (already nearly shining if you ask me) and the questionable level design will be perfected to make this game a real treat for us fans and everyone else.

I'm really hoping I can say this game is everything I had wanted to see in Doom 3. But it looks like we're going to have a good time even if that mark is missed.

[SyntherAugustus]

I'm excited. It captures the "Some douche on mars" logic that the classic dooms had very well. One can hope the level design still involves keycards.

[scifista42]

DooM_RO said:

What cutscenes?

All weapon pickups had a cutscene. Then there was the helmet scene at the beginning, and the ends of both gameplay videos. Was player's movement restricted during the beginning of the hologram scene? In that case it counts as cutscene too. All fatalities and chainsaw attacks are short cutscenes.

[Jaxxoon R]

Cutscenes are always bad because.

Even Half-Life had cutscenes, only it pretended they weren't by letting you wander around in a locked room until you listen to what some fool has to say. Then he stoically delivered his message while you massaged his face with a random crate you found.

[punnyone]

So far I like what I see. I appreciate the fact that the game is very anti-call of duty in a sense that you take the action head on without resorting to ducking and covering. And they were quite a bit more enemies appearing on the screen at once than there were for doom 3, which tended to be more about taking enemies on one or two at a time. Also, the new mancubus and revenant designs look great.

What I wasn't a fan of was the overuse of over the top slow Mo death animations. Having these peppered in every once in a while is fine but it seems like almost every encounter featured them and after a while it seemed a bit too hokey. Also from what I can tell the weapon and enemy progression seems to be a bit too rushed. If this is apparently the second level in the game, it seems a little bit too soon that we have the plasma gun and we are fighting revenants. It was also at first glance hard to tell most enemies apart with the exception of the mancubus, revenant, and cyberdemon.

What I'm still unsure of is the level design and locations. I hope there is more than just Mars tech bases and Hell. Although I did think that the level design is an improvement over Doom 3's versions of these types of locations. There was also a lot more room for vertical and large range combat. While I don't think we're going to get the incredibly nonlinear level design as in the classic games, the game doesn't at first glance appeared to be strictly corridor based either which is a plus.

Overall, while I don't think nor expect this to be a groundbreaking game. It looks like it will be a fun challenge that will live up to my expectations, so color me impresssed.

[mouldy]

Yeah those weapon pick up cut-scenes were about 10 seconds each, and there was the whole "key" nonsense, and all the "fatality" type kills and chainsaw stuff. Anything that takes the control out of your hands even for a moment sucks in this kind of game. I'm assuming that because this is a cinematic type presentation of the game that a lot of this might be just for show, but still the movement and gameplay looked pretty leaden. When you consider that was 7 minutes of "gameplay" there, thats about average for most traditional doom maps in their entirety. I saw monsters in this video that moved faster than the player could, and the enemy attacks seemed to be to fast for them to bother dodging. With movement that slow I doubt you'll get any really interesting level design, because no one will want to backtrack or explore a complicated map at a walking pace.

Still, I'll reserve my judgement until I ever play the actual game, thats just my impression based on this video, which might not represent the game experience anyway.

[DooM_RO]

scifista42 said:

All weapon pickups had a cutscene. Then there was the helmet scene at the beginning, and the ends of both gameplay videos. Was player's movement restricted during the beginning of the hologram scene? In that case it counts as cutscene too. All fatalities and chainsaw attacks are short cutscenes.

So what? The helmet one plays only at the beginning of the level and the weapon cutscenes are pretty brief. Fatalities are optional.

[LkMax]

It had much more positive things than negative, that's good enought to me.
Also, oldschool non-regenerative health and great freedom of movement... I think I'm just restoring my faith in iD.
=D

Now to see how iD Tech 6 will do.

PS: And I just remembered the original plan for Quake 1 was to have monsters laughting/taunting/wathever at you when you die. That Revenant scene put a grin in my face.

[Buckshot]

My only real gripe about it as how tiny the monsters look (though that's probably streaming/camera perspective), the radial-menu for weapons switching slows down ingame time (which Stratton in the post twitch interview said this was done to give gamepad players a fair chance to switch weapons quickly... if they can option this out for the pc version, would be great), and the fact the UAC labs look like the Mustafar system from Star Wars: Episode III.

I was expecting more machine tech-wall and green ooze influenced levels, but still doesn't look bad... just different with all the orange and yellows and tron-like wall colorings. The HUD needs to go.. as well as the nanosuit.... The Crysis factor is just too much with the suit/HUD and really defeats the Doomguy's traditional personality and appearance. Maybe even the weapons need more traditional DOOM-like influence, and less DOOM 3/Crysis-style... couldn't help but cringe when I saw that single barrel shotty design and scope zoom.

And I was hoping to see more color in Hell like E3M1 or E3M6 instead of Lovecraftian-design... but hey, it still looked pretty badass.

All in All, its a huge step in the right direction... and I'm excited =D

[hardcore_gamer]

Buckshot said:

the radial-menu for weapons switching slows down ingame time (which Stratton in the post twitch interview said this was done to give gamepad players a fair chance to switch weapons quickly...

Don't think this will annoy me much. I am already use to using a feature like that in CS: Go. That said, I can think of no reason for why the PC version won't allow us to choose weapons with the number keys. Not like it would be hard to implement.

Buckshot said:

and the fact the UAC labs look like the Mustafar system from Star Wars: Episode III.

The level in the demo was taking place in a iron refinery as far as I know. The rest of the base will probably look different.

Buckshot said:

The HUD needs to go.. as well as the nanosuit.... The Crysis factor is just too much with the suit/HUD and really defeats the Doomguy's traditional personality and appearance.

lol. What is there that the doom guy did in that demo that he can't do in the original? The doom guy has always been able to run extremely fast and survive huge falls. It appears that the game is merely giving an explanation for why that is the case.

[Linguica]

SailorScout said:

Also, hi guys! Been a looooong time. How have you been? I've been just fine since you murdered me.. *ahem* ..wait, different franchise.

Sup SailorScout. Recently we had a vote and E2M2 is the best Doom level ever. Thought you would like to know.

[Flesh420]

I wonder why they chose D3's Baron design. The classic design would look fantastically intimidating today. I wish there was more, I've been scouring these boards and the web for every nugget of info or footage or image I can find. Did they mention if Singleplayer campaign will be coop?

[Breeder]

Brutal DOOM 3D, with a page taken from the DOOM Bible (severed hand + hand scanner).

Level design is pleasing, though I was hoping for Hell on Earth... maybe it will get there.

The game pause effect for weapons changing does suck. It does not ruin the game, but will pause the game play to cater to people too daft/lazy to learn how to use a freaking PC instead of a Console with joypad, thus killing the non-stop action aspect that was DOOM.

The Fatalities are cool, but again kind of pause the action for a second, hopefully they can be turned off for when the novelty has worn off.

Platforming... I hope so!

Puzzles... better be! Lord knows I don't want to be putting in key codes and reading E-mails in the middle of the action.

[Reisal]

Why the hell is the mancubus fire GREEN? That is the baron and knight's color!

[kristus]

I think it looks to be pretty damn cool.

EDIT: It is entirely possible that the slowmo effect is only there when you use the weapon wheel. A feature that wasn't required to be used in Rage at least. I would be very surprised if there weren't also binds for the weapons. But that's just speculation from my end.

[Walter confetti]

Hey, BROOOODAL Crysis Doom Edition here looks fun!

[boris]

Looks pretty cool. The hell level seems to have pretty frantic gameplay. My only gripe is that the monsters all look gray again.

[Donut]

I agree with most of the critiques, it should be more metal, and the cutsceans. But here's the thing; its there game, let them make what they want.

The ONLY thing I think they NEED-need. Co-op. To me that was one of the things that made doom. I mean that's why I come to this site SNS! (And of course the news and awesome community).

I don't care as much about the double jump, he's a space marine on Mars or petes-sake. And even if the map editor is somewhat crippling, it is there, unlike other games.

Overall I'm pleased, I just really hope for co-op.

[Reisal]

I do believe it does have co-op and better yet, a level editor as well.

[Doomkid]

I'm pretty fucking stoked, this looks damn good :)

I'm especially excited about the Deathmatch.. Sorta reminds me of a Doom/Q3 mix, from looks alone.

[VGA]

scifista42 said:

All weapon pickups had a cutscene. Then there was the helmet scene at the beginning, and the ends of both gameplay videos. Was player's movement restricted during the beginning of the hologram scene? In that case it counts as cutscene too. All fatalities and chainsaw attacks are short cutscenes.

You should be using the term "canned animations", not cutscenes...

[Jannak]

At least it is better than what they originally planned to do...

[Hyomoto]

One piece of information some of you are glossing over, the 'reveal' level is probably not going to be in the game at all, and even if it were, it won't be the way we saw. The point is to highlight the fatalities, the weapons, mobility and hint at 'bigger' things. Even the 'single-player' level is supposed to give a taste of the actual game, but they started with all weapons and the enemies are just some random mishmash culminating in a cyberdemon reveal. It's highly doubtful the final product will use that flow so while it's fair to care I'd take the layouts with a grain of salt.

Some stuff that bothered me: there were a few points where an Imp would explode goodies. Classic Doom is interesting because you always know exactly what enemies will drop, and the lack of randomness is what allows the calculated precision a lot of great Doom maps enjoy. Next to the random ammo and health, the graphics bothered me since they were just ... lifeless. Classic Doom dared to use PINKS, PURPLES and GREENS. I agree, who could tell any of the enemies apart? It does appear faster paced, not that you can really tell since the camera was clearly controlled to avoid any twitch movements.

I thought the coolest reveal was the Snapmap though, as my literal first thought at seeing the reveal level was "this is pretty much the death of mapping". It's too complex, and while I like the verticality, it just doesn't represent an interesting place to fight, it's all style and no substance. Then they talked about Snapmap, and if they provide varied tile sets, I expect this will be a really cool feature. Stuff like this is cool in that it both encourages 'modding' on consoles, but also sets a higher standard for the tools modders can use.

And with that ... I disappear.

[cacnotron]

Jaxxoon R said:

Do you even Doom 64?

Also, I too like the new cyberdemon. I actually hate the original cyberdemon design, it just looked too damn goofy and dim-witted for my tastes with its nostril eyes and all. I actually preferred the Doom 64 redesign, with its more feline facial features giving it a sort of cruel wit and drive.

LOL! I hated Midway's shit Doom 64!

[AD_79]

cacnotron said:

LOL! I hated Midway's shit Doom 64!

Doom 64 is a perfectly fine game though!

[Ladna]

Thoughts, more or less in order:

- Fucking awesome, rip and tear
- I can't tell any of these enemies apart, but who gives a fuck they're meat now
- These maps have all the problems Doom 3 maps did
- Fucking awesome, rip and tear, OH SHIT SSG
- Plasma rifle sounds like a 2 year old taking a piss
- OHHHHH SHIT CHAINSAW
- Hell looks more like Conan the Barbarian lives there, not Satan, it makes too much sense
- I wonder if you can goomba stomp opponents in multiplayer
- Finally, some RL action
- BAHAHAHA eat it you fat fuck BOOM!
- Huh, Doomguy is circle-strafing kind of fast in this pit, maybe this is gonna be a good game
- Snapmap looks amazing, especially the logic editing

I don't think it's Doom-level greatness. Needs some maps like Downtown for that. But it's definitely worth a buy. I'm honestly really stoked.

It's also probably the case that you can't get up to Doom-level of monster count and speed because of modern renderer limits. Moving the scene too fast kills your FPS, as does too many models on screen. So the days of that kind of thing are probably over, at least until hardware catches up to "can't tell if this is fake or not".

[Creaphis]

An earlier leaked concept for Doom 4 had the player character as a low-tech lone survivor on Earth, trying to outwit demonic forces as the world went to Hell. That would have had incredible atmosphere, but I'm not surprised they had to go back to the drawing board when they couldn't reach the gameplay they wanted with that as the backdrop.

Now they've gone too far in the other direction. I'm not complaining about double-jumping - that could be the perfect thing for a modern Doom - but because they've totally disregarded atmosphere. Play Doom 3 again and just look at the walls. All game long, the artists are riffing on the ideas of Mars, tech, and Hell; they're playing jazz. Every way you could think to combine and corrupt those basic ideas is in the game somewhere. Now we're on Mars again, and it's gotten blander, more plastic? Is there nothing left to say? Have id's artists devolved into a legacy band, playing to octogenarians looking for their nostalgia fix? Is there some reason they couldn't throw their wacky game mechanics someplace new? It doesn't have to be Earth if we're not ready for that yet. But that would be pretty cool.

The canned special kill animations might get old fast. The likely scenario is that players get bored of them and try to avoid them. Skilled players will learn how to game the animation system and will be forced to include animation manipulation in their tactics whether they want to or not. Mass Effect 3's multiplayer lets you avoid some instant kill melee attacks just by standing on sloped ground; enemies stop using those moves because the animation doesn't line up vertically. That's the kind of thing I'm expecting to see here.

Fusion said:

I hope there's a collectors edition, but doubtful as there's been no mention of one.

Yeah, it'd be awesome if id charged $40 bucks extra for a version of the game with a few DLC maps and some multiplayer skins. Too bad it's 2015 and that never happens.

[Cynical]

[Crossposted from another thread, but relevant here as well.]

I am hyped as fuck. Overall, the look and "feel" that I could discern from the footage shown reminds me a lot of a faster, more polished Necrovision (the second half more than the first half, of course), which itself was an awesome game. Level design looks good (in the techbase level, it's subtle, but there's evidence of at least one branch with monsters down it being skipped, so it's unlikely that this will be a scripted-sequence fest, and the Hell level looks outright fantastic, an open-ish "arena" with criss-crossing catwalks and side corridors in a very old-school way, and it has a visible secret that the player probably intentionally skipped). Movement looks good. Combat has nice "heft" to it while maintaining a brisk pace. Visuals are appealing. No two gun limit bullshit, or regenerating health. And it's got Sarkeesian up in arms, massive bonus points for that.

[printz]

Is the player on a permanent berserk medication?! Why can he just rip limbs like he does in the comic after he gets his berserk pack there?

Also, wasn't the Cyberdemon in Doom 1 supposed to be a terrible surprise? I don't like how they show it right-away nowadays. It really was a monster who makes a strange new sound, moves quite fast, and shortly after it sees you, you're splattered. None of that slow lumbering roaring big monster stuff.

[DooM_RO]

Did you guys see the Soulsphere in the hell section? Also, the door that reveals the Mancubus is BIGDOOR7.