Doom 1 and Doom 2 have different Doomguys

[Jaxxoon R]

While reading through the story in the manual of Doom 2, I noticed something interesting:

"After days of hard fighting in space, you've
returned home on well-earned leave. You're one of Earth's
crack soldiers, hard-bitten, tough, and heavily-armed. When
the alien invasion struck Mars, you were the first on the
scene. By killing, killing, and killing, you won. You stopped the invasion, saved Mars base, and became a war hero."

Notably the fact that the text mentions Mars specifically and exclusively throughout the story, and not once Phobos or Deimos. It also states that this marine was "first on the scene," to his respective mission, but the marine in Doom 1 had stayed behind to guard the lobby of the hangar, if anything he was a 2slow jerkweed. But most importantly of all, there is this:

"But that's all behind you now. You've quit the
military, and are heading home. Your drop pod lands with a
crunch. You open 'er up and look out. Damn! The city ahead
is on fire. What the devil is going on?"

The Doom2guy didn't come to earth through a portal from hell, instead he came directly in a ship from mars. The question is, where was Doom1guy in all of this when Doom2guy was getting shit done? The answer is Thy Flesh Consumed.

[LogicDeLuxe]

I always thought, that the story implies that the hell is on Mars in the Doom 1 + 2 universe. They could probably use the hell teleporters to travel between dimensions anyway.

[Vorknkx]

It's not a case of a different Doomguy... it's more of a case of sloppy game designers ;)

In other words - they messed up their own continuity. Not the first time, not the last either.

The "Thy Flesh Consumed" story, in particular, was just thrown in at the last minute so it doesn't really count, even though it is consistent with the ending of Inferno, which shows Doomguy returning to Earth through the portal. Supposedly, he thought it was a small local invasion and thus the events of TFC (before realizing things are much worse).

Actually, if you skip that part with the drop pod, the story is fine. It could be retconned as "you find your way out of the second Spider Mastermind's lair and look out. Damn! The city ahead is on fire."

[Koko Ricky]

This is interesting, because I've only ever owned a digital copy of Doom 2, so I didn't have the manual and thus was not aware of the "story." I think this is a case of the devs not really paying much attention to story. I think it's pretty obvious they're the same guy, I mean, look at the HUD. Was there ever an official backstory for Thy Flesh Consumed, or is that text/graphic at the end all we got?

[Mithran Denizen]

I noticed these inconsistencies myself a while ago, when we were talking about Doom 64.

While I'd bet they just half-assed the story to the point that none of the details jive properly, I do kind of like the idea that they're different individuals.

The marine in Doom 1 goes from the moons to Hell, then through some warped portal realm (Thy Flesh Consumed) back to Earth. Since the Phobos and Deimos stations were highly-classified military installations with a relatively small footprint, he never really became notable as far as humanity is concerned. Whether he even survived Hell On Earth is uncertain.

Meanwhile, the guy in Doom 2 was busy being a big-time war hero, saving the (presumably larger) base on Mars itself from whatever demons made it down from the moons to the planet. For all this guy knows, Deimos fate is still a mystery. When everything seems clear, he heads back to Earth in his ship, only to find it under attack as well. He runs around deactivating forcefields (or whatever Doom 2's stupid story is about), then kills the Icon of Sin. He finally retires from the military, as he originally wanted to after saving Mars.

Some years later (Doom 64), Doom2guy is called back into service to finish cleaning out the quarantined Phobos (or perhaps Mars) base. He eventually finds a portal to hell, where he decides to stay.

Whether the marine(s) in Plutonia and Evilution are Doom1guy, Doom2guy, or different people altogether, could also be up to interpretation.

[234233424]

Then who was TNT and Plutonia doom guy????

[Jaxxoon R]

Mithran Denizen said:

Since the Phobos and Deimos stations were highly-classified military installations...
Some years later (Doom 64), Doom2guy is called back into service to finish cleaning out the quarantined Phobos (or perhaps Mars) base. He eventually finds a portal to hell, where he decides to stay.

This is interesting that you should say this, because I also found these bits from the story text of Doom 64:

"Your fatigue was enormous, the price for encountering pure evil. Hell was a place no mortal was meant to experience. Stupid military doctors: their tests and treatments, were of little help. In the end, what did it matter - it was all classified and sealed."
...
"The classified archives are opened. The military episodes code named "DOOM" were not actually completed."

So though I'm not quite as sure about this one, but from the way it specifically mentions the military and classified information, I think it's safe to assume that Doom64guy is actually a mentally-tarnished Doom1guy.

[VGamingJunkie]

It gets especially bad if you want to throw Plutonia and TNT into the mix where he would have destroyed the Icon of Sin 3 separate times including the time in Doom 2.

[illYay1337]

I definitely get a vibe like DooM 2 comes directly after Thy Flesh Consumed based on the ending story text and the image at the end.

And the different Icons of sin are totally separate.

In the end, it's all just random levels thrown together for fun.

[Xegethra]

Yeah, those Icons of Sins could all be different ones, maybe that particular breed of monster is best for that sort of demon spawning or something.

But yeah, I think it's a case of lazy story telling....it's all the same Doom Guy to me. Things like this tend to happen when you try to deepen a pretty thin plot line....you kinda lose it a bit. I know depth is good for stories but it helps to keep it from contradicting itself, but many stories do it, and many more have yet to do it.

[TheVoid]

Im assuming that the story is just full of plot holes, rather than be a different Doomguy. Id Software did not care about the story much, if at all, during the development of Doom. Im almost positive I have the wrong person, but I think that it was Tom Hall that made a long and elaborate storyline that ended up playing a part in his firing from Id Software. To quote John Carmack: "Story in a video game is like story in a porn movie: it's expected to be there, but it doesn't really matter." With this attitude, I doubt that Id cared enough to make a second Doomguy, but rather just messed up the story.

[Ledillman]

TheVoid said:

... Im almost positive I have the wrong person, but I think that it was Tom Hall that made a long and elaborate storyline that ended up playing a part in his firing from Id Software....

You mean the Doom Bible? yes, it was Tom Hall who wrote that

Funny and interesting thread, I'm almost sure that those "plot holes" or errors in the story of Doom are mostly because the team didn't care too much about the story, but it's interesting to read theories about different doomguys, and, who knows, maybe the team wanted to have different doomguys but they just forgot to mention it.

TAIM 2 ASKK ROMEROU VIA TWWITERRSS !11

[TheVoid]

Ledillman said:

You mean the Doom Bible? yes, it was Tom Hall who wrote that

Yea the Doom Bible. According to the Masters of Doom book, the Doom Bible was a big part of Hall's firing.

[Xegethra]

Yeah he wanted the game to be huge and really detailed. At least some of the stuff made it in, the Doom we have now is like an incredibly shaved down version of what Hall wrote with lots just not being included.

I think they were a bit too hard on him though, they could have gotten away with including more of Hall's vision, a story that makes sense (or at least a little less plot holey and even if they were to condense it it still would have been cool), the semi realistic setting and some of the power ups perhaps, they didn't need to totally trash his ideas but I guess he failed to convince them.

[printz]

Interesting because the Doom 2 description actually fits with the Doom 3 ending.

[Olroda]

I never noticed this, Jaxxon, and I always assumed that it was the same guy that went through it all. But this is actually better, I think. After all, the Mars base story is yet untold... (unless it is DooM3, as pointed out).

[scifista42]

GoatLord said:

I think it's pretty obvious they're the same guy, I mean, look at the HUD.

Maybe a lot of men in the future have the same face? That would explain multiple Doomguy's looking identical. :)

[fraggle]

I think this must be a mistake.

[Maes]

Doomguy has a split personality. You can catch glimpses of it as his hair style changes depending on the angle and damage he has taken.

When healthy and confident, he has a sporty buzzcut. When in distress, his awkward tupee-Hitlerjugend haircut emerges, as he's unable to keep the facade up, not even to himself.

[Fonze]

@ Maes:
Rofl! I think you hit it on the head, there.

*Edit*
Matter of fact, to actually contribute something to the conversation, I always felt that the Doom story that is displayed after episodes 1, 2, and 3 led straight into Doom 2. Now, I was 4 when the original Doom came out, so of course it wasn't mine, it belonged to my pops. As such I never got to read the instruction booklets that came with the Doom games, but I guess I always figured that it was the same Doomguy,
unless he's a clone of Jango Fett and all the marines are basically stormtroopers. Which would explain why they all seem to die so quickly.

*Another Quick Edit* that would also explain the pet bunny, idk why, I just see stormtroopers having a soft side for bunnies. *Edit End*

One last thing, I always assumed that the lack of a comprehensive story was so you could make it your own. Whether you play like a badass or a cowering toddler writes your own storyline to fill in the gaps. The plot-holes, however, are prolly either a lack of communication brought in by people freaking out about deadlines, or just lazy storytelling