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Ironwill

Hell Extended

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.. learned the stuff . . . must change every-sprite then (even if I checked many use the old sprites/textures + new ones not only new sprites/textures).

about the plutonia+nuts, different from something that is there just as a trolling, everything was tested and possible, but yes, after all sometimes the idea is to just run and not stop by and kill but sometimes thats still possible to kill all those cyberdemons at the area.

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You have modified an IWAD and posted it. That's wrong. You're supposed to make and share a PWAD that contains only your own stuff: maps, custom textures etc, and NOT all IWAD sprites and textures and sounds and resources. Not only it bloats up file size unnecessarily, but it's illegal to share, even.

To fix it, take down the link, make a new empty wad, copy your own maps into it (and other non-stock-IWAD content you might have used), and post a new link.

By the way, don't use the term "vanilla" along with "ZDoom". A map is either vanilla compatible, or it requires ZDoom.

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Basically it's like Plutonia + Nuts. Each level it's filled with Cyberdemons, Spiderdemons or has multiple Icon of Sins.

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Yeah you should make your own maps from scratch rather than build off of the pre-existing Plutonia template. Now that you have a grasp on making levels it shouldn't be too hard to do.

Also don't do stuff like this, it's not really fun to play.


Also a sadistic part of me wants to see Dime play through these maps

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Would any of you folks who managed to download it be able to make a patch file to apply? I'm interested to try this out legally. I'd be really appreciative if anybody is willing to oblige.

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I don't know what part of you made you think you needed to add in every single asset from the Doom 2 wad. Just make the maps and people who have Doom 2 can play it legally.

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dobu gabu maru said:

Also a sadistic part of me wants to see Dime play through these maps

Altazimuth said:

Would any of you folks who managed to download it be able to make a patch file to apply? I'm interested to try this out legally. I'd be really appreciative if anybody is willing to oblige.


As mentioned by scifista42, if it illegal (what I was a noob to the rules and didnt know) then no one should play it as its illegal to share (what also mean, taking it out of my pc or changing so much it can be kept).

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Ironwill said:

As mentioned by scifista42, if it illegal (what I was a noob to the rules and didnt know) then no one should play it as its illegal to share (what also mean, taking it out of my pc or changing so much it can be kept).


I think you misinterpret. A patch file basically contains information that tells a program to convert a file into a modified version of that file. This is how romhacks work, and how they are legal. By only making changes to the file you modified to get to the end product, you are unable to distribute the file without the person requiring the WAD. This point is moot now, given I'd imagine you are just going to release it as a map pack.

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I only hope that you didn't delete your actual IWAD, or the maps you made. That would be an unfortunate misunderstanding. You need your original (unmodified) IWAD to be able to play Doom at all, and sharing PWADs containing your own work is obviously OK and legal (they just shouldn't include commercial IWAD content).

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No, I wont.

For that several changes would have to be done as even parts of the original maps cant be used, and, yes, you may think I spent quite a long time at it and I would have to spend even more time (even because changing textures and sprites would be something else).

For as long as I am concerned, the wad is dead.

edit: the dumb thing I mad was not asking for rules before I started and before I posted.

Until I can change everything accordingly, the wad is dead (and probably will stay dead, because maybe less for some big maps like map 31, but still I would have to change a lot of stuff, end it a lot sooner (deleting map parts) and making it the proper way to be able to share (for one map only).

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Simply deleting all lumps between PLAYPAL and F_END (inclusive) was enough to fix the most blatant copyright infringement. But then again, the maps are just edits of Plutonia maps, so they're questionable anyway. They wouldn't be accepted to /idgames archive, at least. In addition - but that's just my subjective point of view - they're cheap edits in the spirit of "copy-paste corridors and spam big monsters everywhere", and the resulting gameplay is terrible.

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Ironwill said:

For as long as I am concerned, the wad is dead.


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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scifista42 said:

Simply deleting all lumps between PLAYPAL and F_END (inclusive) was enough to fix the most blatant copyright infringement. But then again, the maps are just edits of Plutonia maps, so they're questionable anyway. They wouldn't be accepted to /idgames archive, at least.


Still, as I said, wad is dead, not available for download and out here too . . . thats nothing else to question because thats nothing else to question.

As I said before, it was my mistake, I was warned and I took it out and sent it to thrash as it wouldnt be worth all the work to make it legal (would be like making a whole new wad to cover what should be replaced, + all the maps scripting and textures/sprites).

I already made other stuff, big, at War Craft 3, Minecraft and all but I was never found of such kind of thing so I wasnt aware. Now that I am aware of it, if I ever take back to making maps at DOOM again, what at least will take a good time, I will not repeat the same mistakes, but this wad is dead as I cant be sure if just doing the " PLAYPAL and F_END " you mentioned and deleting the official maps parts it would make it legal, even if some maps are 70% to 80% created by me, using the original maps would still make it illegal ... maybe, the giant maps I could use, put together and make a wad but, now, I wont.

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Don't let this discourage you. It was an easy, understandable mistake. Next time, try mapping a PWAD with 100% original content and release it to the community like you did this. It's a very satisfying labor of love.

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For someone who has an "Ironwill", you certainly gave up on this pretty quickly!

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Job said:

Don't let this discourage you. It was an easy, understandable mistake. Next time, try mapping a PWAD with 100% original content and release it to the community like you did this. It's a very satisfying labor of love.


Don't misunderstand this, the wad you create and share with us should have 100% original maps, but its supposed to be run in conjunction with the Doom or Doom 2 IWAD, which everyone here should have. When you play your wad without the Doom or Doom 2 IWAD, it should be missing too much data to operate on its own.

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Pavera said:

For someone who has an "Ironwill", you certainly gave up on this pretty quickly!


Believe it . . . it took a good (large) amount of time to do these maps, test and bring it to as hard as possible but still possible, also to make the map designs . . the main mistakes were to use these along with the original maps, also not changing sprites/textures and not changing the scripting (or starting from scratch) to make it legal and valid.

Right now I am very disappointed with myself for not searching the right way to do and doing it the wrong way but, as long as I would have to change everything anyway, I trashed the wad for good. more like 1 year (sure, not 1 year every day several hours/day but) spent on something not legal and that I was not aware of.

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The right way to do it is literally to open Doom Builder, create a new .wad file, and start drawing lines until they become a map. Just take whatever actual original mapping exists in this wad, and put it into a new wad file. Bam, legal.

You don't need to create all new textures or scripts or anything like that, just make some maps and release the PWAD. We all have Doom, so you don't need to worry about us not being able to play it or anything.

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Ironwill said:

also not changing sprites/textures and not changing the scripting (or starting from scratch) to make it legal and valid.

Like Pavera and others have said, you don't need to do new sprites, textures and scripting—just creating the maps from scratch (and not the entire game) should be fine.

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As I said before ... I got very disappointed with myself for doing all this without searching for the right way to do it AND for posting it here. In the end all I could see when looking at the wad file was disappointment and that pissed me (I dont use to do this "kind" of mistake over and over to take it like it was nothing, indeed I kind of care for details and I havent care about what was most important, to make it legal).

Maybe, if I still have a backup somewhere even if outdated, I re-make it the right way. Right now I am still pissed with myself for being so dumb and not checking stuff before I started neither before I posted.

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I think you can just use the "Save Map Into" function in Doom Builder and it'll put the map into a WAD without all the IWAD resources.

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Opening the wad in SLADE3 and deleting the IWAD resources manually is easier. In his wad, they were all in one continuous block that could be block-selected and deleted.

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Anyway, thnk u all for all the advises (and patience).

Maybe with some time I come back with something legal (still, for those who dont like the harder stuff or maps filled with demons, cyberdemons and other stuff that are there just to make the map harder, sorry but probably if I get back I will get back with something like that. I like the idea that every map should be both unique and as hard as possible on its own way).

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http://doomwiki.org/wiki/IWAD
http://doomwiki.org/wiki/PWAD

These pages should clear something up for you. When you make a custom Doom wad, you typically make a PWAD. A PWAD must be loaded along with an IWAD, otherwise it cannot be played. Commercial IWADs are being sold (and are illegal to distribute), some IWADs are free (like Freedoom). Every Doom player must own an IWAD on his own computer to be able to play usermade PWADs. PWAD may contain maps, and these maps may reference resources from the IWAD without being actually added into the PWAD. This is how you make maps using IWAD textures/monsters/sounds/palette/everything without adding them to the PWAD - you don't need to, because these resources are inside the IWAD on the player's computer. Then, you only distribute the PWAD, and tell the user which IWAD (on their computer) they're supposed to load it with. This is the proper way to make maps, a common practice since year 1994, and 100% legal of course.

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