Mutiny [Community Project]

[Breezeep]

That looks great, AD! Looking forward to play it!

Spoiler

Maybe I should make a layout for this project for once

[40oz]

ALPHA 01 RELEASED

Attention all Mutiny Team Members! This is a compiled alpha of the maps in their current state. At this time I'd ask for all currently listed testers to have a run through this and begin jotting down their thoughts. (If you would like to be a tester, please post here, and please keep your reviews to yourself until after your name has been added to the OP, thank you)

PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS THE CURRENT STATE OF THE PROJECT. MANY OF THESE MAPS ARE INCOMPLETE, WHICH CAN RESULT IN UNFAIR OR LEGITIMATELY BROKEN AND POTENTIALLY UNFINISHABLE MAPS. MY REQUEST IS THAT YOU REVIEW THESE MAPS ACCORDING TO WHAT THEY CAN BE, NOT FOR WHAT THEY CURRENTLY ARE.

Mappers and testers are on the same team so please be patient, and understanding. These mappers are depending on you (testers) to assist them in making their maps the best they can be. Please understand that these maps are designed to accomodate all skill levels and should be tested as such. When you test these maps please indicate the skill level, and source port used when reviewing and/or reporting errors. Demos, Screenshots, bulleted error reports/suggestions or lengthy reviews are much appreciated. Please be meticulous and specific, but fair and friendly. Please do not hesitate to use cheat codes, dehacked patches, gameplay mods, or to observe the map from a map editor. In fact, you are encouraged to do so, but please mention it in your review if it is not obvious.

During testing, please check that the maps have the following:

1. Player Starts 1-4
2. Deathmatch Starts
3. Doombuilder Visual Camera thing types removed
4. At least 1 secret area
5. At least 1 "item" (for 100% items)
6. Difficulty settings implemented
7. Some Multiplayer specific items/monsters
8. No HOM effects (if it is obviously not intended)
9. Possibility of completing the map in ~10 minutes or less with no monsters
10. Gameplay that you would consider to be fun

Mappers, should you continue to work on your map, please continue to work on your single map file and upload it alone in the MAP01 slot. DO NOT EDIT THE ALPHA AND UPLOAD IT PLEASE.

DOWNLOAD

MAP01: Surface by Fonze, Jimmy, and 40oz
MAP02: Shipyard by Pinchy
MAP03: Gravity Well by 40oz
MAP04: Warzone by joe-ilya, AD_79, and 40oz
MAP05: Downtown by dt_
MAP06: Faceless Corporation by Angry Saint, Corsair, and dt_
MAP07: Bunker Base by 40oz
MAP08: Compactor by Pavera and jmickle66666666
MAP09: Construction Site by Impboy4, Doomkid, and dt_
MAP10: Generator by scifista42, NoneeLlama, and dt_ UPDATED VERSION
MAP11: The Furnaces by AD_79 and 40oz
MAP12: Wildcard by purist and traversd
MAP13: Laboratory by Egregor and 40oz
MAP14: The Firewall by AD_79 and Breezeep
MAP15: Breaching The Unknown by KevinHEZ and dt_
MAP31: The Brain (OPEN)

[AD_79]

Anyone interested in creating The Brain with me? :)

EDIT: should The Brain play on MAP31 so we get a different sky (SKY3 is awesome btw) specifically for it?

[Fonze]

Oh awesome I'm going to have some fun with these 40! I'll try and get you some demos later on.

AD: I'd love to offer to team up; I think it'd be a lot of fun, but I just don't think I'd be able to keep up with you speed-wise. I do wish you good luck and look forward to playing it :)

*Edit*
Matter of fact, it sounds like Breezeep wants to make another map and I think the The Firewall turned out just awesome; I think it'd be cool to see another corroboration between you two.

[MrGlide]

I'm still working on my map, do you want me to share it? yjere are no monsters yet and the core geometry isn't done yet. I'll be glad to mplay test all of these, I think I'm decent at testing, what do you think 40oz?

[40oz]

AD_79 said:

EDIT: should The Brain play on MAP31 so we get a different sky (SKY3 is awesome btw) specifically for it?

Oops, that's correct. That was the original plan, I just forgot as I was compiling everything. The final map shall be MAP31.

MrGlide said:

I'm still working on my map, do you want me to share it? yjere are no monsters yet and the core geometry isn't done yet. I'll be glad to mplay test all of these, I think I'm decent at testing, what do you think 40oz?

Yes id love to see your map! The maps I made on my own were intended to be placeholders in case there weren't enough maps. I'd gladly yank them out once your map is done. Also ill add you to testers too :)

[AD_79]

So starting tomorrow I'm going to go through the maps and (at least try to) provide feedback, record demos etc. I've had a look through, and I noticed something on the Firewall: There's a secret that allows you to telefrag the cyberdemon very early on in the map. When was this added? Honestly, I'm not a huge fan of this secret, as the cybie in my eyes is kinda integral to the map and the couple encounters involving it. I'd prefer if that secret were to be changed to something else, please!

[40oz]

Sorry AD_79, I think that was me. I added a secret area for extra ammunition for coop players so that you wouldn't have to pile shellboxes along the main path. The teleport back probably shouldn't have used the same teleport destination the cyberdemon uses. I could create an alternate teleport destination elsewhere or you could make one yourself if you prefer.

[AD_79]

I think it would be a bit quicker if you were to do it, heh. I'm more than fine with the area existing solely for the purposes of co-op!

EDIT: an_mutt has shown interest in teaming up with me for The Brain.

[Fonze]

Ok, I'll start with the first map and go from there.

Here are my current list of demos.

MAP01: Surface
by Fonze, Jimmy, and 40oz

- All player starts
X No DM starts
- Visual mode camera absent
- 2 secret areas
- 12 items
/ Difficulty settings implemented, but HMP is missing some monsters present on HNTR. A group of imps on the far west side of the map contains 6 on HNTR and 2 on HMP. There seems to be no reason that less would make things more difficult for that part so that might be a bug?
X No multiplayer anything
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- I found this fun. Each route was easy to start with and gave the player everything they needed. Nice, easy opener.

I also loved that you scaled many areas up to make them bigger and the final detailing looks really nice.

In the demo I left a couple imps behind, so I had to go back and get 'em; no need to watch the last minute of that demo.



MAP02: Shipyard
by Pinchy

- All player starts
X No DM starts
- Visual mode camera absent
- 1 secret area
- 3 items
X Difficulty settings not implemented; 2 monsters present on all levels.
X No multiplayer anything
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- No gameplay to note, but the rev+berserk is always a good combo

This map looked very nice! The only thing I noticed was a texture misalignment on the white circle (light maybe?) right above the secret switch. Funny thing is, in the demo I was actually shooting at the texture misalignment.

I got pretty confused at first here. I didn't realize that there were 2 ways to teleport going to the yellow key/green armor. But maybe I'm just dumb.



MAP03: Gravity Well
by 40oz

- All player starts
X No DM starts
- Visual mode camera absent
- 2 secret areas
- 19 items
- Difficulty settings implemented
- Multiplayer contains extra things
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- Fun map. Gonna have to go back and finish it out; I kinda freaked out at the end there and didn't play as good as I should've. Then I tried for two more attempts that both started poorly and ended quickly, heh. I should've quit while I was ahead... oh, wait... Joking aside, I really like the way this map plays, though my only gripes so far would be the first baron (maybe the only one, I forget) that I encountered prolly could've been a HK, the monsters outside, by the yellow door all conglomerated around the door before I entered the sector, making for a bit of door-campage, and the doors are not able to be opened by monsters, which I think would really benefit at least two doors in this map. But all of those are little things, I had fun playing it. Unfortunately I don't have time for another go tonight, but I'll come back to this one later on. This will be my last one for tonight; hopefully I can get through at least another 3 tomorrow, but we'll see :)



MAP04: Warzone
by joe-ilya, AD_79, and 40oz

- All player starts
X No DM starts
- Visual mode camera absent
X 0 secret areas
- 5 items
X Difficulty settings not implemented
X No Multiplayer anything
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- Gameplay was nice; lotta plasma action in this map made damn near every encounter pretty easy to manage, which is good for this map's slot.

Detailing, once again was on-point. Thematically better than the previous map, which had a lot of grey and seemed to match the theme of "dark, dull colors buttressed by bright, eye-popping colors" a bit less.

Could not complete this map. Got all the way to the blue key (but couldn't get it) with 4 monsters left and had to quit.

The demo for this one was long as f*ck because I got lost; drinking and playing; c'est la vie. Also lengthened by my confusion over the blue key.



MAP05: Downtown
by dt_

- All player starts
X No DM starts
X Visual mode camera present
- 3 secret areas
- 6 items
- Difficulty settings implemented
X No Multiplayer things
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- What a great map so far. The detailing is excellent and the encounters fun. Totally got my ass whooped for tonight, but it was fun ^^ For my FDA of this map; three deaths are included. The furthest I got was the yellow key, though I didn't survive the encounter. Silly mistakes abound in this demo. I will have to come back to this one later on, along with MAP03, but everything feels well-balanced and the map flows nicely. May my inebriated demo bring you some entertainment for now, heh. I also liked how I felt like I was finding a secret, but really just making progress at a couple of spots.



MAP06: Faceless Corporation
by Angry Saint, Corsair, and dt_

X One player start
X No DM starts
X Visual mode camera present
- 5 secret areas
- 12 items
- Difficulty settings implemented
X No Multiplayer things
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- Another great map. I really loved everything about this map, from the architecture to the execution of the theme, but felt it could have used a touch more health, in particular in some of the rooms right after the SSG. But then again, I couldn't do anything right tonight, heh, as this FDA was another failure from me. I did make a decent run of it on my last one, though, despite so many stupid mistakes, but what fun would it be otherwise, right; heh. My last run ended due to some cacos with their thin, infinite-height bodies too small to render blocking me in and gang-raping me at the backpack. Yet another one I'll have to get right on the second go-around.

MAP07: Bunker Base
by 40oz

- All player starts
X No DM starts
- Visual mode camera not present
- 1 secret area
- 1 item
- Difficulty settings implemented
- Multiplayer contains extra monsters
- No HoM's
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- I remember playing this one, as well as 03 a little while ago. I had a bit to drink, so excuse my uncoordinated playing, but I almost finished this one... I died due to basically running out of ammo at the end. That's really the one problem I have with this map, that the end can go wrong very easily. Never mind that the first outside encounter is a bitch to get started without door-camping or getting perforated, heh, or the 6 cacos and 12 hell knights that surround you at the red key while on a very narrow bridge, (which I remembered dying at last time as I was playing, heh), but that final encounter is a bit cruel given the lack of ammo in the room with the AV's. Sure, if the player knows where the switch is and knows to kill the AV quickly (assuming a second one doesn't fail to teleport, which has happened a couple times) they can kill, hit, and exit rockets and plasma blazing (oh, also if they knew to save their plasma). But more likely people are gonna run to the exit, see it close, run to the door, it not open, then look for the switch, all the while the 4 AV's are all reviving mobs outside, where there are plenty of HK's, revs, barons (if you found the secret, which turns out to lose you 8 rockets in the long run if both barons are revived once) caco, mancs, etc. I wouldn't say it's unfair, just that it could use a bit of ammo in the AV room, maybe in the form of rockets because they at least have some element of risk in payback for their damage potential. Also, given the possibility of 2 AV's staying in the room and the fact that every time I got that far I had less than 75% health, perhaps a medikit would be nice in there too.

Aside from that, I really enjoyed the excess of projectile-based enemies in this map. It was fun that most every fight involved dodging many shots at the same time and managing somewhat larger groups of enemies. In particular I liked the numbers of enemies used in your clusters; many areas felt like just the right amount and one or two spots were areas that the player could be cornered simply due to the sheer number of enemies (like the HK's at the red key). I also liked the PE's outside the red key room; I was not expecting that at all. But I did unfortunately have to go with the cheesy method of retreating to beat that part; no way I'm going to survive dodging shots like that and releasing the HK's and staying in that room appears to be some form of suicide. Same goes a bit for the first outside fight in which I had to door-camp my way in a bit. I just didn't see a path through with the 4 chaingunners there, combined with a lack of ammo made that part a bit stressful, but I didn't conserve ammo as well as I'd've liked to tonight, missing many shots. Still, included is my final failure and a collection of my "learning pains" for this map, because some people find those more entertaining to watch. Still, if I would have had more ammo I could've easily pushed my way to the yellow key and the final 2 chaingunners wouldn't have stopped me. Damn shame tonight ended this way, though I will say that in previous runs I did much better with my ammo, in particular my cells and when I did the end quickly I was able to finish the level, so perhaps more ammo truly isn't necessary. Idk; these are just my thoughts from tonight.

One thing about this map, it doesn't seem to fit the theme of the megawad so much with its texturing. MAP03, I think it was, suffered from it a bit as well, but there were a lot of dull colors and few bright contrasts in this map. That's not to say it didn't look awesome, though, so please don't get me wrong there.

The secret in this map was really tough to find, as the wall's difference isn't immediately apparent given the difference in lighting and similarity of the textures, with the main difference being one is grey and the other isn't; the pipes look very similar. Inside the secret, I don't think barons are necessary; all they do is eat up ammo and punish players later on for finding the secret before unleashing the 4 AV's at the end.



MAP08: Compactor
by Pavera and jmickle66666666

X Only player 1 start
X No DM starts
X Visual mode camera present
- 4 secret areas, though the one in the north-west with enemies inside didn't appear to open...
- 100 items
X Difficulty settings not implemented
X Multiplayer contains nothing extra
X ONE HoM! Sector 38 adjacent to the SSG either raises or lowers near the end of the level, revealing a HoM effect. (see main MAP08 demo towards the end)
- Can complete in less than 10 minutes without monsters
- I played this map before as well; fun map then and I like the changes I see! I notice the sign is gone, which is a shame because I totally forgot that the lava was "aesthetic," heh. Health was plentiful in this map, as was ammo. Cell and rocket counts were on point, though. One nice thing about this map is knowing that as long as I can survive the next encounter there will be more health coming up, plus more I can go back and get. Had a few bad runs on this thing, which I included in the zip file since they're tiny anyway and might be useful or at the very least entertaining to watch.

I will say that I had no problems with the cyber's implementation here; he was not elevated enough to worry about splash damage unless you got in real close to SSG-out (and conserve cells for the next, harder fight that ironically doesn't come, though in one of my runs I died at that AV+chaingunner there because I didn't realize the CG was behind me as I plasma'd the AV, freaking out about the lack of cover, of course ;p ).

I really liked the implementation of most of the AVs in this map. The first hallway (in the lava with the green armor) that you encounter with tons of zombiemen was nasty with the shotgunner trap and rev trap. Retreat back down the curved hallway proved to be a mixed bag, as curved hallways and revs often do. I think that was one of my favorite parts of the map, simply because of the extra hazard the curved hallway adds to the standard rev ambush.

The layout of this map was awesome, being so interconnected and the use of the crushers was grand. I also liked the secrets of this map, save the one I couldn't get to open. I notice that the trigger-line is at the red key and is a W1 line; clearly it worked right because the wall (sector 38 where the HoM is, or right next to it [you can see the HoM towards the end of the main MAP08 demo) lowered, letting me out and the wall near the start, after the red door, also lowered. Not sure why the platforms didn't though.

Texturing for this map was great; everything looked like a 3D object. Colors-wise there wasn't a lot of variation going on, but it certainly fit the theme of dulls in the dark and vibrants in the light. Detailing was on-point.

[40oz]

Nice work on those reviews, Fonze! Those are very helpful and are an excellent model for future reviewers.

[dt_]

Hi Fonze, look forward to your reviews- Just a few notes on the maps I've been involved in:
Map5- only UV is properly implemented, there is about a 4/5 monster difference between that and the other modes.
Map6- complete
Map9- needs some slight re texturing in a couple of areas, and more work done to skill modes. Not sure which version 40oz has posted up, but since we handed our works in for testing ages ago I have done away with the fall damage simulation.
Map10- up until a few days ago Noneellama was still working on this, he's handed it back to me to work on, so take this one as quite a WIP.
Map15- complete
Oh, and I think they've all got the visual mode camera still present, sorry mate!

[NoneeLlama]

Seeing as MAP10 is a very old version of our map in the alpha, I'll share the current version of it here: http://www.mediafire.com/download/23edv1yyv336q8f/mut10V013_scifista42_NoneeLlama_dt_.wad

[pavera]

40oz said:

MAP08: Compactor by Krispavera and jmickle66666666

Hey nit pick, but can I be credited as Pavera? Krispavera is an old moniker that I don't like to go by anymore.

[40oz]

Pavera said:

credited as Pavera?

Sorry, thought your forum name was still Krispavera. I fixed it.

NoneeLlama said:

old version

Sorry, I must have not had this version on hand. As more updates come along ill replace that map with this one in the next alpha. For now there's a link to it in the maplist.

dt_ said:

Oh, and I think they've all got the visual mode camera still present, sorry mate!

Its no trouble, we'll get it worked out :)

[pavera]

Thanks 40oz.

Now to help move things along, here is everything I can think of off the top of my head that needs to be addressed about Compactor:

Spoiler

- Difficulties are not implemented

- Some areas are still unfinished, and therefore can feel kinda empty and undetailed

- There is a bug in the gameplay flow: if you jump into the lava pit next to the red key BEFORE getting the red key, you will be stuck there. I'm aware of this and will try to fix it in a way that preserves the intended flow of the map (i.e. getting the SSG after getting the red key)

- The final area isn't very well balanced, and there is still a misaligned flat on the floor button that stops the crushers at the end

- Also in the final area, there is an indent in the wall next to the stairs that lead to the archvile and mancubi: This indent was supposed to have a switch that lowers a nearby platform, giving you access to some rockets and health.

- The battle right before and right after acquiring the blue key could be better.

- There are some visual errors in the lava pit you drop into after grabbing the blue key, namely some sidedefs scrolling up and down with the movement of the crushers :P

That's all I can think of for now. Glad to see the alpha put together, as it definitely gives me some motivation to continue working :)

[gaspe]

Fdas for the alpha, at least for the maps I haven't played before. Demos did on PRBoom+ cl2, UV. While browsing the maps on ZDoom I got some unknown texture warnings on MAP09 and MAP13.

MAP03: it was good allthough too monochromatic for my tastes. Imo there could be at least one medikit to support you in the final battle.

MAP04: the first area with the sewers is really bare, even more if compared with the latter city part. From there it was cool. I couldn't finish the map, the moving floors to get the blue key don't activate.

MAP05: this one was excellent. The mood is really nice and the gameplay fits well.
Though in the fda I died at the cyberdemon as I got trapped under some flying monsters from above.

MAP07: I think it's allright but there should be at least some ammo in the last room, the archviles can resurrect many monsters in the previous areas.

MAP09: interesting setting, I really liked the mastermind battle. I died in a stupid way... From the building where you get the blue key the buildings far in the scenery (sectors 303,304) look like they are made of paper. Also you can get stuck into the sector 232.

MAP11: this one was really good. It's nice to see the CEMENT textures used. It looks like everything is allright here.

MAP13: there's really the need of more ammo (perhaps a chaingun?) at the start. But it looks like the thing placement is still wip, almost all the rooms I visited had nothing in there. You can get stuck in the room with the blue armor and the lava.

[baja blast rd.]

FDAs for the first three maps: http://www.mediafire.com/download/bb9dnrn415w9ll1/muta01-03_rdwpa_fda.rar

[joe-ilya]

gaspe said:

MAP04: the first area with the sewers is really bare, even more if compared with the latter city part. From there it was cool. I couldn't finish the map, the moving floors to get the blue key don't activate.

I made it more active, and added more areas, but 40oz butchered it for some reason.

[AD_79]

joe-ilya said:

I made it more active, and added more areas, but 40oz butchered it for some reason.

40oz can (and should) correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I remember your additions made the map way longer/bigger than it needed to be. What's there already is definitely enough, if not more than enough.

[40oz]

joe-ilya said:

I made it more active, and added more areas, but 40oz butchered it for some reason.

Unfortunately i think there must have been a miscommunication. I asked you to help by adding the things to the map. I had been actively stitching the layouts AD_79 and I had made. I attempted to use the things you placed on the map the best I could. In the future I'd hope that you'd talk about what you're doing with the map before you go ahead and do it. That's an important part of being on a team.

[Magnusblitz]

I'll try to take a whirl through playing this weekend, probably. But here's what I can ascertain through a quick look in Doom Builder:

Player 1-4 starts: MAP06, MAP08, MAP10, MAP11 and MAP13 only have P1 start.

DM starts: All the maps are missing them except for MAP09 (has 4) and MAP14 (has 6).

No cameras: MAP05, MAP06, MAP08, MAP09 and MAP13 still have cameras.

Secrets: MAP04, MAP10 and MAP13 have zero secrets.

At least one item: All maps have at least one score-screen item.

[AD_79]

Currently adding co-op starts to 11, and while I'm at it, I'm going to do difficulty settings. Might be done by tomorrow.

[AD_79]

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/106557511/mut11_ad79_40oz_v2.wad

Here's The Furnaces with difficulty settings. It could probably use some better balancing in places.

Regarding multiplayer thing placement: uhhh I'd like to request someone else do that. I'm not good with that sort of thing :P

[Fonze]

I edited in reviews for maps 04-06. Didn't finish any of them like a scrub, but MAP04 I think cannot be finished right now. I couldn't get the blue key and ended with 4 monsters remaining.

dt_ sorry I didn't finish your MAP05 or y'all's MAP06, but I'll get it right on the second go-around for each that I fail. UV-or-bust and all that jazz.

I will say that all three maps I played tonight (as well as the first three) were beautiful and well-crafted. The encounters were fun and despite my many stupid mistakes I felt like it was all well-balanced. There was a lot of very nice architecture to each of these maps that made things look very much like real, 3D objects rather than sectors with wallpaper plastered on, making each map interesting and fun to explore. The layouts were intricate enough to support the idea of a large city-scape which says a lot about the quality of these maps. I look forward to coming back to these maps that I fail later. Though I didn't find all of the secrets in MAP05 or 06, I really liked the ones I found. This CP is shaping up to be a hands-down Cacoward winner, or at least will set the bar very high and provide some tough competition for other projects, imo. It will be interesting to see what wads rival this at the end of the year.

[40oz]

For those of you who cannot complete map04 because of the blue key, I'm not at my computer right now, so I can't confirm whether or not I uploaded a legitimately bad version, but there is a puzzle that might require a bit more intuition then should be generally expected of a normal player.

There are 2 pads in front of the blue door with health bonuses on them. When you stand on the left or right one, the corresponding pillar outside will begin to rise or descend. When you step off of it the pillar will stop. These are the control panels that let you move the pillars to a height you can dash across.

If this is the issue then perhaps I could do a better job color coding it. And maybe add some WR move floor to lowest floor actions to trigger a sound cue.

[gaspe]

I checked it and it works. But the pads look like they are there just for decoration, they need to be more distinct.

[40oz]

Here's an idea, I could use walkover light effects to illuminate the pillar to 255 when you stand on the pad, and turn off when you step off. Hopefully the light change on the pillars will draw the players attention long enough to notice the floor moving as well. Do you think that could work?

AD_79 said:

Regarding multiplayer thing placement: uhhh I'd like to request someone else do that. I'm not good with that sort of thing :P

I could do that for you :)

Magnusblitz said:

I'll try to take a whirl through playing this weekend, probably. But here's what I can ascertain through a quick look in Doom Builder:

Thanks Magnusblitz, that's very helpful :)

[gaspe]

40oz said:

Here's an idea, I could use walkover light effects to illuminate the pillar to 255 when you stand on the pad, and turn off when you step off. Hopefully the light change on the pillars will draw the players attention long enough to notice the floor moving as well. Do you think that could work?

If it works I guess it can be allright then. But imo the problem is that the pads are blue on a blue floor, making them of another material (for example somekind of tek) would give to them a more "special" look in the room where they are.

[AD_79]

40oz said:

I could do that for you :)

That would be excellent. Thank you!