Test my first wad!

[sesalpinogamer]

Hi people!I wanted to start a quick thread here so you can test my wad here,it is my first one,so it is pretty crappy i think,and it uses Freedoom Phase 2 graphics,so run it using the freedoom 2 wad (move it in a specific folder,rename it DOOM2.wad and run it the wad with zdoom,gzdoom or skulltag,then select doom2,or was it just freedoom 2?)
I got some notes too:
-This level is short,not very well designed and pretty easy.
-I wasted countless hours with the lighting here
-There might be some bugs here and there
-Rate fairly for a crappy first level ever
-AGAIN use freedoom phase 2
-Tell what is good,what isn't,and how i can improve
And the most important one...
ENJOY!!!
Level:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/yy81c18zhi6h50a/new.wad

(It is far from done now,i want to make it less glitchy and much longer and detailed!)

Freedoom:

http://freedoom.github.io/download.html

(Click on Freedoom Phase 1 + 2)

[Fuzzball]

Might wanna hold back on the posting a little there! Few topics happening like this with no real content to show~

If you're going to make a project and announce it- it's usually a good idea to have something to show for it first, a screenshot or two would be nice. Asking us to test a project that hasn't been released isn't the way to go about it!

[SavageCorona]

I'd get your maps finished before you tell us to test it since you still have another thread asking for help with it. That doesn't really give me too high hopes honestly.

[sesalpinogamer]

Screenshots (Note that i am on NO MONSTERS cheat)
1:Starting area:

http://imgur.com/4UuDy6t

2:Main room full of toxic waste:

http://imgur.com/TR1o62V

3:Super shotgun!:

http://imgur.com/mNU79av

4:Unfinished area:

http://imgur.com/1uDMiZx

5:A window?:

http://imgur.com/Z5VvrvY

6:The window view (unfinished):

http://imgur.com/Yt1jv7u

Note that most screenshots exept the double shotgun room,the starting room and the main room are finished,but the map is small so only a few more sectors to go.

[BaronOfStuff]

Basic stuff, but sharp, clean and inoffensive to look at. Keep going.

[sesalpinogamer]

BaronOfStuff said:

Basic stuff, but sharp, clean and inoffensive to look at. Keep going.

Thank you!

[sesalpinogamer]

I stumbled on to a problem,apart from some lightining effects,but i already fixed that,i have the whole map in mind,however,i don't know how to do in the window room,any ideas?

[sesalpinogamer]

Wad:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/yy81c18zhi6h50a/new.wad

[xnv]

Some pics with comments: https://imgur.com/a/UL5mx
Pretty pointless and easy combat. No reasonable weapons progression. Ugly and boring just like my wads. Keep trying.

[sesalpinogamer]

xnv said:

Some pics with comments: https://imgur.com/a/UL5mx
Pretty pointless and easy combat. No reasonable weapons progression. Ugly and boring just like my wads. Keep trying.

Thank you!I AM thinking about making hard arena style levels,there are tons of dudes,kill em all,next level,no puzzles and very little exploration or detail,only pure action.Good idea?

[xnv]

sesalpinogamer said:

Thank you!I AM thinking about making hard arena style levels,there are tons of dudes,kill em all,next level,no puzzles and very little exploration or detail,only pure action.Good idea?

Why not? Slaughtermaps are pretty popular. Check out Holy Hell for example. What amount of detail you consider "very little" though?

[joepallai]

always nice to see new mappers; keep at it and don't get discouraged--also play lots of levels and look at the levels that you really like in an editor to get ideas.

[Fonze]

SavageCorona said:

I'd get your maps finished before you tell us to test it since you still have another thread asking for help with it. That doesn't really give me too high hopes honestly.

^ This.
Also, I'd rather hear someone say that they, at least, actually like their own creations. If you don't like your own creation, how can you expect others to? It's the same with self-respect, but that's off-topic.

Now, I'm not saying talk it up like it's the greatest thing, but just tell us you're new and as a result it may not be up to snuff with the community. Don't say you think it sucks unless you're working closely with someone and your looking for that specific persons help.

A message to the public has to be handled right, because people have no knowledge of what's going on aside from what you say. As a result, people are also more likely to read between the lines on a message to the public.

[sesalpinogamer]

xnv said:

Why not? Slaughtermaps are pretty popular. Check out Holy Hell for example. What amount of detail you consider "very little" though?

Only not to make levels look very ugly

[scifista42]

sesalpinogamer said:

Thank you!I AM thinking about making hard arena style levels,there are tons of dudes,kill em all,next level,no puzzles and very little exploration or detail,only pure action.Good idea?

It's one of many ways (actually, of infinite number of ways) how to make a Doom map. Whether it's good or not will depend on the execution. Different players have different tastes, and no mapper will ever be able to please everybody. Just try what you can, different people will give you feedback, and you will take what you want from it (possibly learn how to improve).

I personally value Doom's gameplay for both action and exploration, I also like to see variety in both visuals and combat scenarios, and inventiveness (not basic-ness). And on the other hand, I dislike blatantly ugly texturing and alignment, repetition of anything, abundance of basic rectangular-shaped rooms, areas too cramped to comfortably move around, improportionate thing placement, monsters being too easy to run around (without threatening the player), monsters taking too much time to kill (without challenging the player), etc.

I've noticed many of these exact negative traits in your map (plus the bugs already mentioned by xnv). That's why I would call the map very amateurish, and I would advise you to work to improve those aspects. Perhaps take inspiration from other community-made wads, think about what makes them fun, and try to imitate their traits with your own style on top of it.

[sesalpinogamer]

Here is a slaughterfest wad i did in half an hour,don't expect something awesome,it is pretty hard,i think,it may lag on older computers,and i am going for something different,but anyways,see if you like it:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/ad8hd6ulmc9l92m/death_from_all_sides.wad

This time it is doom 2 itself,no extra textures or anything.

[scifista42]

The last map is shit for the following reasons:

-The first door open, then close, only once. If you haven't stepped out, you will be trapped in the start room.
-The map itself is yet another plain rectangular block, this time only one room for an entire map.
-Items were lazily thrown at the beginning without thought.
-Similarly, random monsters were lazily thrown in the middle of the room without thought.
-The fight is entirely skippable. You can outrun all monsters and exit without challenge. In one second. By moving in one direction.
-Ugly monochromatic texturing, non-unpegged door, linearity, obvious idealessness and laziness on the mapper's part.

[SavageCorona]

I literally ran straight through everything and went to the exit in 9 seconds.

[sesalpinogamer]

I don't really want to make levels like that,i made that shit in 30 minutes,what i am thinking about doing,however,is less action,more exploring,but to make some progess in the level you must kill a lot of guys,and certain enemies(The stronger ones)will be needed to kill,has they open doors that leads to keys,switches and the exit etc..

[Fonze]

scifista42 said:

...
repetition of anything,...
areas too cramped to comfortably move around,...
monsters being too easy to run around (without threatening the player),...

Not to cut it up too much, my apologies if that's offensive.

Everything scifista says is true, as is typically the case, but you can't have it both ways bro ;p I know they're separate things, but one is a way of preventing the other and goes into the whole variety is the spice of life thing. Also, how can you hate repetition of anything when your likes are pretty specific? Nevermind that cramped areas make projectile-based monsters pose a greater threat to the player.

Off-topic, my apologies as well, but sesal, the way you are marketing yourself makes me not want to even open your maps. :(

Every time you release a new map, you say it's shit, then repeat that it's shit after everyone says it's shit, then say you were thinking about doing exactly what the others said they like. Try taking an entire month, or five, to complete a map. Put that kind of work into it and maybe, MAYBE, I'll give it a shot. Not to be a dick or anything, but networking and marketing 101 man... None of this sounds worth my time, maybe I shouldn't even have typed this.

[sesalpinogamer]

Fonze said:

Not to cut it up too much, my apologies if that's offensive.

Everything scifista says is true, as is typically the case, but you can't have it both ways bro ;p I know they're separate things, but one is a way of preventing the other and goes into the whole variety is the spice of life thing. Also, how can you hate repetition of anything when your likes are pretty specific? Nevermind that cramped areas make projectile-based monsters pose a greater threat to the player.

Off-topic, my apologies as well, but sesal, the way you are marketing yourself makes me not want to even open your maps. :(

Every time you release a new map, you say it's shit, then repeat that it's shit after everyone says it's shit, then say you were thinking about doing exactly what the others said they like. Try taking an entire month, or five, to complete a map. Put that kind of work into it and maybe, MAYBE, I'll give it a shot. Not to be a dick or anything, but networking and marketing 101 man... None of this sounds worth my time, maybe I shouldn't even have typed this.

OK then,i am working on a map,but i am scared that if i work really hard on it for a long time and it ends up sucking?

[scifista42]

If it sucks, it just means that people will identify more of your mistakes, which is a good thing, because you will be able to learn from them. That's a better situation than keeping your current lazy-basic production.

[dobu gabu maru]

Not to be rude, but can you not determine the base quality of your own maps? If people said your stuff was great and you should make more like that, would you have done so, or did you actually upload your two maps with some semblance of how rough and slipshod they were? Rather than spending time mapping, what you should do is play some highly-praised megawads and analyze what makes them great (like Alien Vendetta). Look at the weapon placement. Look at where and how the enemies are used. Pay close attention to the texture use and how clean everything looks. Look at the automap and see how both orthogonal and freehand lines work cleanly together. Try to emulate that style, or rebuild the map without copying it from another builder. Until you understand what makes Doom fun and challenging, you're not going to get the praise you're looking for.

[sesalpinogamer]

Ahhh,you know what?I GIVE UP.I take my time and effort to make a map,thinking like this "Fine,let's see if the people in the doomworld forums like it" but EVERY SINGLE FUCKING TIME I UPLOAD YOU COMPLAIN IT IS NOT A PROFISSIONAL WAD LIKE ALIEN VENDETTA!Christ!Crucify me,but i don't like Alien Vendetta!These are my first maps,i am unfamiliarized with gzdoombuilder and you keep complaining that it is not a good wad!For God's sake!Why should i take a month and a stupid ammount of effort when you will probaly complain about the same thing!And about the "See what you like and adopt it in your own style",I WAS trying to do that in a wad i am making now,but i just deleted it because you would probaly complain about it!It is not like you're telling me how to fix my shit,you just expect me to learn from the nothing!I will finish a wad that i was doing but i discontinued it when i created this thread and fuck it all if what i get is "It is terrible,DOT",Give me a few days so i can make a good thing,okay?I am asking you DAYS,so even if it ends up sucking at least tell how to make it good!Tell me why it sucks and even give a good example of a nice wad you made!I am a little more calm at this point of the post because i know exactly what i want.

[dobu gabu maru]

Okay okay, I'm sorry if I came on too strong in my post. I didn't mean to insinuate that we need "Alien Vendetta" levels of quality, it was just that you seemed so directionless that I was trying help give you some guidance. It's perfectly fine to keep familiarizing yourself with GZDoombuilder and working on your own maps; show them to us when you feel you're ready.

[sesalpinogamer]

dobu gabu maru said:

Okay okay, I'm sorry if I came on too strong in my post. I didn't mean to insinuate that we need "Alien Vendetta" levels of quality, it was just that you seemed so directionless that I was trying help give you some guidance. It's perfectly fine to keep familiarizing yourself with GZDoombuilder and working on your own maps; show them to us when you feel you're ready.

It is okay man :D!I will think my wads are crappy now,but each wad will be better than the last one,because of feedback,until i make pretty good wads,is this the way to go?

[Fonze]

I apologize as well if I came across dick-ish.

Understand that how you present yourself is key. I like to think I'm a decent enough guy and I try to my fullest extent to be understanding.
Having said that, if you simply put some time, thought, effort, and care into a wad, then come on here and tell us that you worked hard on it, even if it is your first map, people like me would try it out for you. Look at the reviews I've been doing here since I became active, I don't care if someone says, "this is my first wad," so long as they also state that it meant something to them and they invested their own time into it. The more the better, in my book.
To just put out something and straight-up say, "hey everyone, this thing sucks and I don't even care much for it. I did it in 30 minutes, please invest your time" is border-line insane.

Keep making maps, you'll get better. If you really want I can put up my second wad, since I lost my first, and you can see how much it sucked. We all start somewhere and typically it's at the bottom. Market yourself correctly and people will help you.

FYI, my second wad was an attempt at a Doom 1 1-episode megawad, but like most people I gave up half-way through. Even still, a lot of time went into making the 3 short levels that comprised it, even though by the community's standards they sucked, lol. I still enjoy to play them, though, which is important. You must like what you produce.

Also, put some time into helping the community and people will respect you more. I can't say that I'm respected yet, as I haven't been active here long, but I have made it a point to do what's necessary to get there, because I love Doom and this is my outlet. ;p

[sesalpinogamer]

Fonze said:

I apologize as well if I came across dick-ish.

Understand that how you present yourself is key. I like to think I'm a decent enough guy and I try to my fullest extent to be understanding.
Having said that, if you simply put some time, thought, effort, and care into a wad, then come on here and tell us that you worked hard on it, even if it is your first map, people like me would try it out for you. Look at the reviews I've been doing here since I became active, I don't care if someone says, "this is my first wad," so long as they also state that it meant something to them and they invested their own time into it. The more the better, in my book.
To just put out something and straight-up say, "hey everyone, this thing sucks and I don't even care much for it. I did it in 30 minutes, please invest your time" is border-line insane.

Keep making maps, you'll get better. If you really want I can put up my second wad, since I lost my first, and you can see how much it sucked. We all start somewhere and typically it's at the bottom. Market yourself correctly and people will help you.

FYI, my second wad was an attempt at a Doom 1 1-episode megawad, but like most people I gave up half-way through. Even still, a lot of time went into making the 3 short levels that comprised it, even though by the community's standards they sucked, lol. I still enjoy to play them, though, which is important. You must like what you produce.

Also, put some time into helping the community and people will respect you more. I can't say that I'm respected yet, as I haven't been active here long, but I have made it a point to do what's necessary to get there, because I love Doom and this is my outlet. ;p

You weren't dick-ish,the comunity of this forum is really nice,and the sick part of me want to play your E1 megawad attempt,can you give me a mega or mediafire link?I don't care if it is in any other site,or just a attachment,but it is just my preference.

[Fonze]

I mean, I can, but it did suck pretty bad, lol. If that's what you want, though, I'll make a thread for it later tonight and everyone can have fun talking shit about it tomorrow :D

Maybe it would turn into a post your shittiest wad and let's talk shit about it thread, haha. That would be funny.

A better example, at least from my peanut gallery, would be the Father's Day map I made. You can find it here:
http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/73334-fathers-day-maps/

But I'm not the best mapper by any stretch. I've been mostly a hermit, til recently, so I never went too crazy on detailing. I always focused more on making concepts that I enjoy to play.

All the info on the map can be found in both the post with the link or the text file it comes with. I'd recommend reading the text file with any maps I make because I typically work with concepts, they help me to overcome a mappers block.

It would be best for you to look at many mappers, Walter's map "Storage Bay" looked beautiful and was a shining star for detailing, as was Doomkid's "Sinister Seven." Of course these are not the only examples of what we all should strive for in detailing, but they were my most recent play throughs. But look at the famous ones too.

While detailing is important, as that's what sucks a player in in the first place, pay attention to the way others go about stuff like how encounters play out, what strategies, if any, you must use, gun progression, etc.

Gameplay is the most important category by the time a player completes the map, but aesthetics are what sucks them in.

[sesalpinogamer]

Fonze said:

I apologize as well if I came across dick-ish.

Understand that how you present yourself is key. I like to think I'm a decent enough guy and I try to my fullest extent to be understanding.
Having said that, if you simply put some time, thought, effort, and care into a wad, then come on here and tell us that you worked hard on it, even if it is your first map, people like me would try it out for you. Look at the reviews I've been doing here since I became active, I don't care if someone says, "this is my first wad," so long as they also state that it meant something to them and they invested their own time into it. The more the better, in my book.
To just put out something and straight-up say, "hey everyone, this thing sucks and I don't even care much for it. I did it in 30 minutes, please invest your time" is border-line insane.

Keep making maps, you'll get better. If you really want I can put up my second wad, since I lost my first, and you can see how much it sucked. We all start somewhere and typically it's at the bottom. Market yourself correctly and people will help you.

FYI, my second wad was an attempt at a Doom 1 1-episode megawad, but like most people I gave up half-way through. Even still, a lot of time went into making the 3 short levels that comprised it, even though by the community's standards they sucked, lol. I still enjoy to play them, though, which is important. You must like what you produce.

Also, put some time into helping the community and people will respect you more. I can't say that I'm respected yet, as I haven't been active here long, but I have made it a point to do what's necessary to get there, because I love Doom and this is my outlet. ;p

Better than anything i did