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quakke

Hating doom is cool now?

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Anyone else start to get bit annoyed how clueless kids bashing doom now? Forexample. I see constantly this praising of Shadow Warrior 2 (which isn't even anything like the 3drealms made game) as if it's mighty king or something, eventhough DOOM4 is actually classic style fps compared to that yet another hordeshooter but still people actually sincerly shit on doom and praise shadow warrior with their dicks hard..

Grinds my gears how people don't respect doom and then go and praise something as "hurr durr the doom that doom 4 is not hurrhurr" eventhough these new shadow warrior reimaginations are pretty much as far from the roots as it can be and me being a huge shadow warrior fan, i just see it as generic creation that is very disrespectful towards the original.

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Well, everybody is entitled to their own opinions. Doom does not appeal to every gamer, some prefer Call of Duty, or Battlefield, Shadow Warrior etc.

I don't think it's necessarily cool to hate on Doom but everybody has different opinions as to what makes an enjoyable 1st person shooter.

Although, I totally agree that Doom is much better than Shadow Warrior...

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Don't really know anything about Shadow Warrior, but Doom is looking just fine. This is just a handful of elitist morons just hating on something decent. I wouldn't put stock into what they say especially since alot of their arguments are based on nothing. "ZOMG the levels are so linear!" How the fuck would you know? It's a freakin demo, what you want them to go wandering around for 5-10 mins? People are stupid man.

I've come to notice recently that alot of games that are being announced are getting unwarranted amounts of flak. Gamers these days are just spoiled.

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Who are these people? Do you hang out with young kids in their teens and 20s or something? Not trying to be funny here, because honestly, I don't hear anyone talking about neo-Doom besides me. Then again, very few of my friends are gamers.

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I'm going on the opinions of about 5 or 6 people I know irl, but from what I've seen, people who dont play games much at all thought the new doom looked awesome, while the closet gamer types felt it was too modern shootery and not classic gamey enough.

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I believe the taste in most gamers have simply changed. First person shooters aren't all the rage now, but RPGs seem to be since the Pip Boy Edition of Fallout 4 keeps being sold out.

But I can live with that. I don't like things going too big and corporate so I'm cool with the way things are with Doom. I kinda wish it was easier to find people to play multiplayer with, though. D:

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potnop said:

Where are people praising shadow warrior 2 in that way?


On the YouTube trailer video and sites like NeoGAF, which is full of people who think they know Doom better than us.

It's really funny because the impressions of Doom around here have been very balanced and mature, unlike the sites I mentioned where it's exactly the opposite. Everyone regurgitates the same snarky shit over and over even when counterarguments have been provided.

As for Shadow Warrior...I think the reason for this phenomena is the fact that Flying Wild Hog are sort of the "underdog" indie dev and their fans are like like "yeaaa, you're really showing them". I've seen this behaviour before when BioWare, CDPR, Blizzard and Path of Exile are compared. Another, similar situation was the guy who made those recolored Doom shots. Everyone was like "yeahhh you showed them, a fan is better than a professional artist", which is just ridiculous. It's just like when kids think they are smarter than the teacher for a presumed mistake he made.

They overblow the good parts of the indie game while they use the most ridiculous and subjective gripes when talking about the AAA developer. These arguments almost always come from ignorant brats who just want to fit in. They are the same people who give Dragon Age 0/10 MOMENTS after its release just because it has a gay character. The thing that bothers me the most though is not their ignorant and reductionist opinions but rather that they have so much power (as a collective).

They are really tiresome.

40oz said:

I'm going on the opinions of about 5 or 6 people I know irl, but from what I've seen, people who dont play games much at all thought the new doom looked awesome, while the closet gamer types felt it was too modern shootery and not classic gamey enough.


What exactly makes it modern shootery? It has no reloading, carry all the weapons, strong indications of non-linearity (check my level design thread), an alternative to regenerating health, you can carry tons of ammo, emphasis on mobilty, mostly projectile enemies. What makes it modern shootery?

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DooM_RO said:

What makes it modern shootery?


The video makes it look boring ;p

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Yes, You can say that hating doom is now cool since everybody got different definition what makes good doom game and why original Doom was so great. Some wants another Serious Sam arcade shooter, some wants spiritual sequel to System Shock, some ones want it to be colorful as Shadow Warrior, and some want it to be dark and moody. Everybody in internet want to be expert even if have no experience.
I do not hate new Doom. I accept it as it is. I do not play it yet and I believe that best option would be to discus on what we know for sure, and let id developers made that game in way they want to do it.

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Gzegzolka said:

Yes, You can say that hating doom is now cool since everybody got different definition what makes good doom game and why original Doom was so great. Some wants another Serious Sam arcade shooter, some wants spiritual sequel to System Shock, some ones want it to be colorful as Shadow Warrior, and some want it to be dark and moody. Everybody in internet want to be expert even if have no experience.
I do not hate new Doom. I accept it as it is. I do not play it yet and I believe that best option would be to discus on what we know for sure, and let id developers made that game in way they want to do it.


That's a very good point. All these interpretations of Doom are correct but none are more valid than others. Id will have to find a way to balance all of them.

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DooM_RO said:

That's a very good point. All these interpretations of Doom are correct but none are more valid than others. Id will have to find a way to balance all of them.


Except there is one point that sets Doom appart from any other fps games (atleast modern). Level design. Level design in original doom's is not same as in serious sam (linear) and duke3d and shadow warrior classic also had them, while the new shadow warrior doesn't. Maps were made with very high importance and that sets it appart from these modern games.

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I think apart from the slow-down caused by the radial control scheme as well as the inability to fully modify your creations in SnapMap, I'm looking forward to the new Doom.

Then again, I'm the same person who preordered and collected the Balls of Steel Edition of Duke Nukem Forever on the day of release from Blockbuster for the Xbox 360 and cycled home with it with the rain covering the box. I enjoyed the game apart from some of the graphical issues, and I have it on the PS3 and Steam now.

I think that the game should be good fun to play however it's all a matter of waiting for the game to finally drop so that we can finally make up our respective minds on if the game is good or bad.

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When Doom comes out everybody will shut up and play it. Even the ones who trash it now. People are stupid. Simple as that. You're stupid. I'm stupid. It's a fact. But Doom is Doom. No matter what it'll make sales, it'll generate a fan base, and it'll always have haters because of its success. That will also be a fact.

And the new Shadow Warrior is fun. Thats why people like it. No it's not like the 3DRealms version because let me tell u why. THEY DIDNT MAKE IT!!

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People are stupid, yeah. But it doesn't matter if game will be really good. If it's only bunch of gimmicks and weak CoD parody nobody can save this game from hating.

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NoisM said:

People are stupid, yeah. But it doesn't matter if game will be really good. If it's only bunch of gimmicks and weak CoD parody nobody can save this game from hating.


U sound like u haven't been following this game at all so far.

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VGames said:

And the new Shadow Warrior is fun. Thats why people like it. No it's not like the 3DRealms version because let me tell u why. THEY DIDNT MAKE IT!!


That's actually subjective, not a fact. I forexample found the game extremely tedious because of the upgrade thing, complete level linearity with the constant "walk to next battlearena, finish it and now walk corridor until next battlearena comes and locks you in and rinse repeat..". Voicing was also atleast horrible because it was just so annoying that i basically just said "stfup" and then went and muted the dialog..

Seriously, if the game didn't use Shadow Warrior name, it might get a free pass but since they used the damn Shadow Warrior series name it's pretty stupid decision to completely switch everything and then wonder why people hate it. It's not really a Shadow Warrior game but more just some Hard Reset 2.0.

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I don't think they really care what u or anybody thinks about the game. It's successful. That's all that matters. And the original shadow warrior was nothing more then Duke Nukem with a reskin. I love the old game but it's not exactly something I still turn to for fun. The new shadow warrior is a hit no matter who hates on it. that's why we're getting a sequel. The original SW didn't even get a second look. It was a miss. Sadly.

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It's no og sw, that's for sure, but I do personally think it's fun as well (this is coming from someone who's re-played the original + expansions recently). I love the original, but the later levels (especially in the expansions) do get a bit repetitive and slaughter-y as well.

I got pretty tired of the later levels handing you every single weapon + a couple fortune cookies within the first five minutes of the level. Kind of makes 'katana starts' a lot less interesting.

But anyway, that's a discussion for the sw forum. :P

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There has always been such a counter-current ever since Quake was released, of newkids and ship jumpers trumpeting the death or irrelevance of the Doom community and how their new favorite game makes it pointless and obsolete. The backlash to the first wave of this helped produce the long-lived clan known as [QS], which is short for Quake Sucks.

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Quasar said:

There has always been such a counter-current ever since Quake was released, of newkids and ship jumpers trumpeting the death or irrelevance of the Doom community and how their new favorite game makes it pointless and obsolete.

That's apparently where Requiem got its name, since it was supposed to be the last big megaWAD for Doom. 18 years ago.

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Most of my initial concerns were blown away since ID assured it would be relatively non-linear and have secrets and puzzles. My only real nitpick is the yellow hell but that's not going to prevent me from enjoying it and I hope there's a way to edit maps on a level that is deeper than the simplistic Snap editor. Just do what Valve did with Portal 2, it had an in-game editor that was simple and easy to use but you could also use the Hammer Editor if you wanted to play with something more complex. More options is always a good thing.

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DooM_RO said:

On the YouTube trailer video and sites like NeoGAF, which is full of people who think they know Doom better than us.

It's really funny because the impressions of Doom around here have been very balanced and mature, unlike the sites I mentioned where it's exactly the opposite. Everyone regurgitates the same snarky shit over and over even when counterarguments have been provided.

As for Shadow Warrior...I think the reason for this phenomena is the fact that Flying Wild Hog are sort of the "underdog" indie dev and their fans are like like "yeaaa, you're really showing them". I've seen this behaviour before when BioWare, CDPR, Blizzard and Path of Exile are compared. Another, similar situation was the guy who made those recolored Doom shots. Everyone was like "yeahhh you showed them, a fan is better than a professional artist", which is just ridiculous. It's just like when kids think they are smarter than the teacher for a presumed mistake he made.

They overblow the good parts of the indie game while they use the most ridiculous and subjective gripes when talking about the AAA developer. These arguments almost always come from ignorant brats who just want to fit in. They are the same people who give Dragon Age 0/10 MOMENTS after its release just because it has a gay character. The thing that bothers me the most though is not their ignorant and reductionist opinions but rather that they have so much power (as a collective).

They are really tiresome.


Thank you for this.

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