*** The "ask a miscellaneous editing question" thread ***

[MaxED]

scifista42 said:

Probably because, after you changed the script, you didn't compile it before testing.

DB2/GZDB automatically compile SCRIPTS lump if it was changed when saving or testing the map.

[scifista42]

I suspect that, at least sometimes, DB2 fails to do so, possibly due to a glitch. I vaguely remember something like that happening to me years ago (I might have even believed that it was the normal behavior), and I remember discussions with several people (one of them provable by a map download) who changed the SCRIPTS lumps in their maps and saved them, but their map still contained a previously compiled version of their script afterwards.

[MaxED]

Unless you can provide something more solid to work with, I can't verify or fix this...

[scifista42]

I still can't explain illuknisaa's today's issue otherwise than that his map editor failed to recompile a script before testing. But it turned out that my issue might have been a false alert. The map I was talking about (city escape, which has a different in-wad script code than actual in-game script) was made by riki2321, and I've searched back to his post to find out that he was actually using SLADE3 and wasn't very experienced with it, so he possibly changed the script in the plain text mode without recompiling it.

[everennui]

Would it not work if he doesn't have zcommon.ACS in the right directory?

Addendum(s):

Is it possible that there needs to be a space after the parenthesis?

if (random (0,10)>= GCE) 

like this:

if (random (0,10) >= GCE) 

The reason I bring this up because I was watching a guy on Twitch the other day and I was trying to explain to him what zcommon.acs was and when he included it, it said that it couldn't find the directory or something.

I wasn't sure where it needed to be. Is it in GZDB?



The last three are from the first instance of gzdb that I downloaded and newbishly screwed up. I didn't fully understand how directories work for programs and how .dll, .exe etc. work with each other and cross reference each other like libraries.

[scifista42]

everennui said:

Is it possible that there needs to be a space after the parenthesis?

Nope. The sole purpose of whitespaces (spaces, tabs and newlines) in C-style programming languages is to separate symbols that the compiler couldn't recognize as separated otherwise (for example, "int i=1;" requires a whitespace between "int" and "i", but doesn't require any whitespaces between "i", "=", "1" and ";", because those character sequences aren't forming any valid symbol names when combined together, only each one on its own is a valid symbol name), and superfluous whitespaces are ignored completely (programmers only use them to make their source codes better readable, but the code could be correctly compiled without them too). In your example, the character sequence ")>=" is not a valid symbol name, so the compiler correctly splits it to ")" and ">=". However, if there was a whitespace between ">" and "=", that would be incorrect, because the compiler would be forced to treat them as separate symbols, thus misinterpret their meaning and (in this case) end up with a syntax error or (in other hypothetical cases) make your program do something else than you intended to.

[Empyre]

In ye olde days of BASIC, a whitespace was even more optional. READY would be interpreted as READ Y, and FORD = 1 TON would be interpreted as FOR D = 1 TO N.

Sorry for going off on a tangent, but I thought that this might be interesting to some of you.

[illuknisaa]

Maybe my script issues happened because I might have been running two instances of gzdoom builder one running a different map and the compiler some how used settings for the other exe.

[illuknisaa]

I was derping around with SetActorState and I ran into some problems.

1. I have this custom revenant actor with this state:

Spoiler

Actor JumphappyRevenant : Revenant1 
{
	states
	{
	JetpackSee:
		APYT A 0 A_PlaySound("arachnophyte/engine",8)
		JKEL A 2 A_Chase
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("BurnParticlesNoPain", 50, 0, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, 35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, -35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		JKEL A 2 A_Chase
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("BurnParticlesNoPain", 50, 0, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, 35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, -35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		JKEL B 2 A_Chase
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("BurnParticlesNoPain", 50, 0, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, 35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, -35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		JKEL B 2 A_Chase
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("BurnParticlesNoPain", 50, 0, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, 35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_CustomMissile("ExplosionParticleVerySlow", 50, -35, random (0, 360), 2, random (50, 130))
		TNT1 A 0 A_Jump(0, "DeactivateJetpack") //changed this line
		TNT1 A 0 A_CheckCeiling(3)
		Loop
		TNT1 AAAAAA 0
		TNT1 A 0 ThrustThingZ(0,-5,0,1)
		Goto JetpackSee
	}
}

Sometimes the revvie turns off his jetpack even though the chance to do that is zero (i think?).

Other problem I have is trying to make a zombie man to do a barrel roll.
suitepee streamed footage of this (00:56:00):
https://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/v/38501819

script 15 (void) 
{
	Thing_Activate (3);
	SetActorState (3,"AvoidRight");
}

The animation performs but the zombie doesn't actually fire his gun (no bullets come out). If the zombie is already aware of the player then the bullets come but not otherwise. I've tried NoiseAlert but it doesn't seem to work.

Spoiler

Pain.Avoid:
	    TNT1 A 0
	    TNT1 A 0 A_Jump(255, "AvoidLeft", "AvoidRight")
        Goto AvoidLeft
	  
   AvoidLeft:
	    POSS A 1 A_FaceTarget
	    TNT1 A 0 ThrustThing(angle*256/360+192, 15, 0, 0)
        ZRO2 ABCDEFGH 3 A_FaceTarget
        Goto Missile
	AvoidRight:
	    POSS A 1 A_FaceTarget
	    TNT1 A 0 ThrustThing(angle*256/360+64, 15, 0, 0)
        ZRO1 ABCDEFGH 3 A_FaceTarget
        Goto Missile

[scifista42]

illuknisaa said:

I was derping around with SetActorState

http://zdoom.org/wiki/SetActorState said:
Note that you should refrain from using this function for any actors that use the monster AI, or unpredictable results could occur.

[Noobirus]

Hello again,

I was playing around with doom builder last weekend and I am close to finishing my short campaign (the maps just need 20x more details). I have encountered a new bug though...

MAP04 (you need to cheat to get here) - Doomguy clips through most doors, switches and some walls, that are placed in the small underground base on the south of the map (for example: try running against the wall outside the base, or against the small "generators" in the destroyed room). Switches who act this way also don't work at all. I checked all linedefs and sectors, and I have no idea why this is happening.

I also need to clean up the wad file in SLADE, it's over 10mb...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8ocjndf9EQXWFBKbHNoV25CckE/view?usp=sharing

[scifista42]

I've rebuilt the map's nodes in SLADE3 and the problem was immediately fixed.

Open the map in a map editor, move one vertice, than move it back to its former position (manually, not using the Undo button) and save the map.

I can't tell what caused your map to have improperly built nodes, but it might have been because you had the same wad opened in multiple editors at the same time (for example in SLADE3 and in GZDoom Builder), which you should never do, unless you're specifically using SLADE3's feature "Open Map in Doom Builder" that safely opens the map in (GZ)Doom Builder after it's already opened in SLADE3.

[Noobirus]

Yep, I used SLADE and everything got fixed. Thanks!

EDIT:

Alright, I guess this is my last question, and I'm all set:

Editing MAPINFO

I have set up an intermission screen for each level, but for some reason the game shows errors in all intermission lumps exept the first and last one (?). Also: after finishing MAP02 I get the intermission screen from MAP03.

I'm pretty sure this has something to do with the placement of "}" and "{".

My MAPINFO looks like this:

//ZDoom and GZDoom ZMAPINFO

map MAP01 "Jupiter Ruins"
{
cluster = 1
levelnum = 1
music = "D_RUNNIN"
sky1 = "SKY1"
next = "MAP02"
par = 100
}

map MAP02 "Descent"
{
cluster = 2
levelnum = 2
music = "D_STALKS"
sky1 = "SKY1"
next = "MAP03"
par = 130
}

map MAP03 "The Discovery"
{
cluster = 3
levelnum = 3
music = "D_COUNTD"
sky1 = "SKY1"
next = "MAP04"
par = 130
}

map MAP04 "Departure"
{
cluster = 4
levelnum = 4
music = "D_BETWEE"
sky1 = "SKY1"
next = "EndTitle"
par = 130
}

map MAP05 "Space Agony"
{
cluster = 5
levelnum = 5
music = "D_COUNTD"
sky1 = "SKY1"
next = "EndTitle"
par = 130
}

// Text Screens

cluster 1
{
music = "D_DM2INT"
exittext = "You have entered the strange",
"crypt found in the colony",
"",
"It seems the demons have murdered all",
"the guards and dwellers.",
"",
"You must find the cause of this demonic invasion"
"",
}

cluster 2
{
music = "D_DM2INT"
exittext = "After a few minutes",
"the elevator stops",
"",
"The door opens and before your eyes",
"lie strange, blasphemic constructions.",
"",
}

cluster 3
{
music = "D_DM2INT"
exittext = "You place the strange cube",
"into your backpack",
"",
"After a few hours you managed",
"to reach the surface.",
"",
"Now you must find a spaceship",
"and get the hell out of this planet",
"",
}

cluster 4
{
music = "D_DM2INT"
exittext = "You managed to reach",
"a nearby space station",
"",
"The marines have taken the cube",
"to the laboratory for analysis.",
"",
"You lie down tired on your bed",
"only to be woken up by a scream."
}

[Marscaleb]

I have a question.
Why do I only see options for three difficulties when I edit things in Doom Builder? Easy, Normal, and Hard.

Okay, if I am not mistaken, "Nightmare" is using the same enemy layout as Ultra-Violence, but they add some wicked tricks like regenerating monsters and faster fireballs.

But that still leaves four difficulties. What about them? If there are only three difficulties in the map data, how do we get the four original difficulties?

[scifista42]

Noobirus said:

the game shows errors in all intermission lumps exept the first and last one (?).

The problem is that you put commas after the last lines of the exittext strings. The commas should separate individual lines, but they shouldn't be after the last line. Also, the exittext in cluster 1 doesn't have a comma after its penultimate line.

(Another way to write texts that will display on multiple lines ingame is to write the texts into one line in the MAPINFO but to write "\n" into the text wherever you want the newline to be. But the method with commas is probably better.)

Marscaleb said:

I have a question.
Why do I only see options for three difficulties when I edit things in Doom Builder? Easy, Normal, and Hard.

Doom games have 5 difficulties:

IDYTD = Things with an "Easy" flag spawn + you get double ammo + you take half damage + final boss fires slower.
HNTR = Things with an "Easy" flag spawn + final boss fires slower.
HMP = Things with a "Normal" flag spawn.
UV = Things with a "Hard" flag spawn.
NM = Things with a "Hard" flag spawn + you get double ammo + monsters are fast + monsters respawn + cheat codes don't work.

See also http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Skill_level.

[Empyre]

scifista42 said:

Also, the exittext in cluster 1 doesn't have a comma after its penultimate line.

You used the word correctly, but not everybody knows that penultimate means next-to-the-last.

[Dragonfly]

Scifista (based on my observations) loves to use big/correct words that force both the 'commoner and the non-native English speaker to use a dictionary (or Google) to expand their vocabulary. Surely that's only a good thing, right? :P

[Godfather38]

I don't think that the word "penultimate" isn't common knowledge really, I mean its not a regular term but it is widely known.

[Dragonfly]

You say that, but is IS a word that is used incorrectly almost every time I see it.

[Godfather38]

Yes, that is true, same as ultimate and awesome, but they aren't exactly unknown either.

[Dragonfly]

..? Both of those words are overused when compared to penultimate, and are mostly used correctly, not incorrectly.

Anyways, enough derailing of a thread. :P

[scifista42]

I'm not a native English speaker, and so I don't always understand which words are common and which are uncommon. When I put the Czech word that means "next-to-last" into a Czech-to-English translator, the English word "penultimate" shows in the list of results before "next-to-last" does. For that reason, and also because "penultimate" is a one-word term while "next-to-last" is a three-word term, I've learned the word "penultimate".

[Godfather38]

Wait, how much English are you familiar with? I am curious because that Czech English translator sounds really impressive. and dear god has this thread gone off topic.

[scifista42]

Godfather38 said:

Wait, how much English are you familiar with?

Enough to be posting on this forum for years, almost never using any translator, and when I do, only to translate a single word or term, I've never used translators to translate whole sentences.

[Godfather38]

Damn, I was hoping that google translate was finally competent... anyways, this thread is "off the rails" if you will, so I think if there is any further discussion to be had we should move it off somewhere else, otherwise this thread should go back to its purpose.

[Gez]

Hey, no one said this thread couldn't be about text editing! :p

Ultimate: last
Penultimate: nearly-last

See also:
Insula: island
Peninsula: nearly-island

Umbra: darkness
Penumbra: nearly-darkness

There are probably other examples. Etymology is fun!

But while penultimate is a good word, I prefer antepenultimate (before the nearly last, or second-next-to-last).

[Godfather38]

Whats your favorite nuts word that you will never use? mine is Lopadotemachoselachogaleokranioleipsanodrimhypotrimmatosilphio paraomelitokatakechymenokichlepikossyphophattoperisteralektryonopte kephalliokigklopeleiolagoio-siraiobaphetraganopterygon. don't ask me what it means! and yes there are most likely typos!

[everennui]

Dragonfly said:

You say that, but is IS a word that is used incorrectly almost every time I see it.

I often confuse the word with quintessential. Maybe I learned them on the same day. ...I also often mix-up sour cream and cream cheese sometimes to a large degree of hilarity. (Never try sour cream on a bagel. Cream cheese on a potato is good though)

Godfather38 said:

Yes, that is true, same as ultimate and awesome, but they aren't exactly unknown either.

I think these are better examples of bastardization. We hear the words in context to other things - most likely something being sold - and they just become simple grunts. The words lose their weight and have little semblance to their former glory. It might be a bit of a stretch, but it reminds me of semantic satiation. The word just becomes an easy way to express a general idea without much effort.

There is really no continuity to language. Every word has its own bias for each person who learns it. I can't express a thought and have any reasonable amount of faith that you understand it the way I would like you to. Even if one can reiterate what you've said - verbatim - you don't know how their life-bias has impacted their understanding of even the most simple ideas.

Addendum: I actually, inncorrectly used the word, penultimate on June 15th in a cartoons thread. So when I saw this thread I immediately remembered that I had said it and that - given my history with the word - I had probably used it wrong. ...so I edited it and felt like I should come forward as one of the perpetuators of its misuse and apologize to the God of Grammar. Forgive me! :D Maybe this time it'll stick. Fingers crossed.

Godfather38 said:

Whats your favorite nuts word that you will never use?

I think, "vestigail" is an appropriate one for this situation, though I will use it every time I have the chance because trying to figure out language is fun for fun's sake.

[Godfather38]

Holy sh!t, we have gone from doom to the word penultimate to words in general to food! whats next? spain, france, England, the moon!?

[Dragonfly]

Godfather38 said:

Whats your favorite nuts word that you will never use?

Antidisestablishmentarianism. When I was young (as in, about 11 or 12 years old?) I used to use that word as a way to prove I both knew big words and could spell them, heh.

I always find it mind-blowing how those from outside of English speaking countries who learn English, seem to learn the language better than many native speakers.