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Chewyninja69

A question to those who have/have played the Doom 3: BFG Edition on PS3

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I have been speedrunning Doom and Doom 2 as of late, on the Doom 3: BFG Edition on PS3. Some top times I have been able to top and others I haven't (and probably won't be able to, either do to hacks/cheats/what have you or generally not being "good" enough). My question is this: can one still do the same thing(s) that speedrunners on PC can do? Like strafe running, strafe jumping, shooting rockets at walls to push yourself over/on certain ledges, etc.

I've tried doing some of these things, but wasn't really successful. So I'm basically just curious if it's even possible on consoles.

And another thing I was curious about was the running speed of this version of Doom and Doom 2 compared to the PC versions; it seems like on consoles you run noticeably slower. Is that right or am I imagining things?

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DMGUYDZ64 said:

Maybe you can, it's just a port of PC Version to PS3 with some tweaks .

Like I stated previously, I've tried doing those things but either I lack the skill/talent/precision/etc. to execute or they're just absurdly difficult to pull off on consoles.

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It is practically impossible to match mouse speed/precision with a gamepad. Turning speed in particular will be the ruin of matching many/all speedrun attempts.

As for SR40/SR50 movement, forget it. Again, the lack of precision compared to a mouse will kill any hope of matching or bettering the direction of movement in a top record, unless you get absurdly lucky.

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Until the Dooming community (and in particular demoers/speedrunners) finally decide to create per-controller leagues/categories, which will finally highlight the pros and cons of each controller, there will always be people that believe that ALL control methods are equivalent (well...they are in the sense that they all let you fully (?) control the player) and that they are equally efficient and easy to master.

Maybe one day the (unborn yet?) "best" Doomer of all times will play exclusively with a gamepad, who knows. But even then, I won't be able to help but wonder: "What if he was using a mouse + keyboard?" ;-)

Spoiler

QED, I will surely get AT LEAST one reply saying that "I've been playing console version X of Doom with a gamepad and never had any problems". Brilliant stock answer, really, but completely missing the point, esse.

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People have modded 360 controllers to replace the right stick with a trackball before. Perhaps that could be considered on par with M+KB, if not better due to the much finer movement precision over WASD?

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Sodaholic said:

People have modded 360 controllers to replace the right stick with a trackball before. Perhaps that could be considered on par with M+KB, if not better due to the much finer movement precision over WASD?


The mouse offers a unique combination of precision and speed in two dimensions, and furthermore allows multiple fire controls to be readily accessible, all by using just one hand, and in an economical, durable, easy-to-design device.

It's possible to have controllers that exceed it in one area (e.g. long control sticks are more precise but slower, arcade-style joysticks are quicker but less precise, rotary dials are more precise AND quicker but only work in 1 dimension etc.), but all have trouble with also giving access to more than one fire key at the same time, in a way that isn't awkward to use. It's also much easier to fuck up the design and ergonomics of a joystick.

A trackball, while also quick and precise, has the disadvantage of not having any fire keys ON it, at least not a thumb-sized one. Maybe a palm-sized one (but one large enough to be ergonomical, fast and precise, would also need a trackball at least the diameter of a softball or grapefruit), and require a recessed desk for installation. If it's a "half trackball" or something like that, then it's not a trackball at all, but rather a "captive mouse" design.

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I tried practising circle-strafing with Xbox controller under Doom Retro, and effects were far from perfect. Theoretically it should be possible but I found that playing differently with gamepad than with keyboard+mouse is more practical.

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Consider this example taken from sports: in theory, by looking at the ITF rules you could still play tennis at a professional event level with a vintage, wooden tennis racket using catgut strings, which is both heavier, less springy and has a smaller head area than the current synthetic ones (interestingly, there only seem to be maximum limits to the rackets' dimensions, but not on materials or weight). So, for all effects and purposes, it's to the players' advantage to use the stiffest, lightest and broader racket possible, which they all do (mostly limited by budget and current material technology).

But for the sake of discourse, let's even admit that you're a tennis player who insists competing today using your grandpa's vintage racket, vs "modernly" equipped opponents.

You will be disadvantaged in nearly every conceivable way (weight, stiffness, string elasticity, contact area). The natural outcome is that you won't be able to compete at the maximum of your capabilities. If by some freak accident of fortune you manage to hold your own and even beat better-equipped opponents, then of course the question will arise on how much (even) better you could be with proper equipment, and in both cases everybody will be asking why you're handicapping yourself. Barring the possibility that all of your opponents sucked hard, ofc.

But, so far, no such "vintage wonder" tennis player has appeared, nor has any Doomer demonstrated that he can perform at COMPET-N levels without using mouse + keyboard (or specifically, by using a gamepad or trackball. I think there was one pure keyboarder COMPET-N demoer, but I don't know if he holds any unbeatable records).

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