Doom in Doom or Doom in Hexen? ZDOOM or ZDaemon?

[ThePolishBeast]

Hey what setting should I choose to map build with? Lot of people are saying to use zdoom doom to doom; it's great. And others are saying to use doom to hexen because it allows scripting. So I'm a bit confused about it all. Then there's zdaemon doom to doom or just doom 2.

[Jaxxoon R]

UDMF. If you want. Maximum power.

[Zed]

This may be helpful:

http://zdoom.org/wiki/Map_format

[ThePolishBeast]

Zed said:

This may be helpful:

http://zdoom.org/wiki/Map_format

So from what Ive read I'm a little confused on UDMF. Is that in zdoom doom to doom?

[Edward850]

What even is a "zdoom doom to doom"?
Either way, UDMF is a map format, like/unlike the original Doom format (Vanilla/Boom) and the expanded Hexen format (Hexen/ZDoom). The basic principle of UDMF is that you have access to every engine feature that is provided or ever could be, where is the Doom format is vastly too archaic to provide and the Hexen format can't provide something directly without scripts or rather restricted line/actor types.

Basically, if you want to be sure you can always do something in a map right now or in the future, use UDMF. The ZDoom-Hexen format is technically the most compatible, but is otherwise still port specific in function, and the ZDoom-Doom format is the equivalent to "Yes, you can technically make a Doom format map for ZDoom. No idea why you'd want to do that to yourself, though."

[ThePolishBeast]

Edward850 said:

What even is a "zdoom doom to doom"?
Either way, UDMF is a map format, like/unlike the original Doom format (Vanilla/Boom) and the somewhat expanded Hexen format (Hexen/ZDoom). The basic principle of UDMF is that you have access to every engine feature that can be provided, where the Doom format is vastly too shorthanded to provide and the Hexen format can't extend without scripts or rather restricted line/actor types.

Sorry for the confusion doom in doom. When I start doom builder 2 I should choose zdoom doom-in-doom or...?

[Edward850]

You should choose the map format you want (we can't tell you what you want). As stated, if you want UDMF, select UDMF.

Also, I can't find any case in which someone would seriously tell you to use the old Doom format for a ZDoom map, what with being unable to even use ACS properly. They'd have to be taking the piss.
Unless they are suggesting that you make a vanilla map, but that'd be just Doom or Doom 2. Nothing to do with ZDoom at all.

[ThePolishBeast]

Alright I understand a good amount now. Im going to guess I should get gzdoom 2.3 with doom builder 2?

[Zed]

OK, so putting it in very simple terms, it goes like this:

-If you want your map to be compatible with basically any port, but you will have to work with some limitations (http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Static_limits), choose vanilla (Doom in Doom).
-If you don't like the idea of working within those limitations, but still want it to be compatible with most ports, use Boom format.
-If you prefer something more "advanced", you have UDMF, which is actually quite powerful, but keep in mind that currently only ZDoom/GZDoom/Zandronum support it (and Eternity will in the near future).

Sorry if I can't explain it better, I don't really understand it completely myself.

[Edward850]

ThePolishBeast said:

Alright I understand a good amount now. Im going to guess I should get gzdoom 2.3 with doom builder 2?

Both Doom Builder 2 and GZDoom Builder support all commonly used map formats and configurations. GZDoom Builder even more so due to its active development (yes, despite its name, it's not specific to GZDoom).
It is generally recommended to use the latest version of whatever port you're intending to edit for, however that's not necessarily because of the editor you're using. When in doubt, use the latest.
As a note, I don't think that there is a GZDoom 2.3. Latest is 2.1.

However, it is however not a good idea to initially test a vanilla map in ZDoom. For example, you could very well step over limits that ZDoom otherwise extends. If you intend to make a map for Vanilla, you'd use Chocolate Doom instead, and then test in other ports afterwards.

[ThePolishBeast]

Edward850 said:

Both Doom Builder 2 and GZDoom Builder support all commonly used map formats and configurations. GZDoom Builder even more so due to its active development (yes, despite its name, it's not specific to GZDoom).
It is generally recommended to use the latest version of whatever port you're intending to edit for, however that's not necessarily because of the editor you're using. When in doubt, use the latest.
As a note, I don't think that there is a GZDoom 2.3. Latest is 2.1.

However, it is however not a good idea to initially test a vanilla map in ZDoom. For example, you could very well step over limits that ZDoom otherwise extends. If you intend to make a map for Vanilla, you'd use Chocolate Doom instead, and then test in other ports afterwards.

im a little confused i thought gzdoom was a plugin for doom builder 2?

[Zed]

ThePolishBeast said:

im a little confused i thought gzdoom was a plugin for doom builder 2?

Maybe this post will clarify it for you:

https://www.doomworld.com/vb/post/1425551

[Edward850]

ThePolishBeast said:

im a little confused i thought gzdoom was a plugin for doom builder 2?

See I'm more confused than you. GZDoom is a sourceport. GZDoom Builder is a map editor (a fork of DB2). Neither of them are even remotely plugins (and a sourceport has no reason to be a plugin for a map editor).

[ThePolishBeast]

Edward850 said:

See I'm more confused than you. GZDoom is a sourceport. GZDoom Builder is a map editor (a fork of DB2). Neither of them are even remotely plugins (and a sourceport has no reason to be a plugin for a map editor).

i get it now thank you for the help i miss understood what i was reading thats all it all make seance now