Will DooM actually be able to pull of a plot?

[Guest wrexsoul]

I am going to show my wishlist for the plot/character aspect of DooM and hope some people agree with me:
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I think id could learn a lot from Resident Evil. As bad as Resident Evil plots are amongst console games, they are still better than most PC games, expecially in the CHARACTER department.

CHARACTER:
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I want to play as more than one character. I would like to see a group of varied, and identifiable characters(a couple of marines and a few civilians) trapped in the hell dimension. I think this game can be pulled off with human characters, and still give the feeling of isolation against hordes of demons.

This can be done by having the plot accomodate for it (ie: marine is wounded, so his partner has to go out into the darkness and find a medic room to bring him to. Also characters get split up.)

I don't care how id does it, I just DO NOT this to become another game where you are plopped in the shoes of some, two dimensional "amerikan badass" for the entire game, without any other characters.

PLOT:
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DooM offers many possibilities for intriguing plotlines
1.) What is the story behind UAC, I bet they are aware that the teleporters would form a link with the hell dimension. What are their plans?
2.) how about satan creates an antichrist capable of transcending the dimensions and invading earth.
3.) I would like to see id responsibly involve Christ and Christianity into the plotline

introspection and message:
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The game should cover theology issues, and the concepts of salvation and hell, life and death. Maybe characters with different religioms will react differently to being in hell. It would also be nice if id could manage to think of a good theme or message behind the entire game.

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Well in this post-halflife age, I don't think this is too much to ask. If id wanted to be truly groundbreaking, they could do it by bringing the first great story to a single player PC action/adventure game. Japanese console games have been doing this forever, and there is no excuse why it can't be done on the PC.(if you want expamples check out Metal Gear Solid, Silent Hill, and Resident Evil series.)

And I don't want people talking about games like Deus-ex. DX had jack shit for identifiable characters, and some derivitave, overly loopy, conspiracy plot.

If anyone wants to talk further about this, my AIM username is 'zero wrexsoul'.

[CHAINSAW+DGM]

OK! first don't put christ into doom!
I don't want your book,I don't want your bullshit
I just wanna play DOOM!
if I see one bit of christain bullshit I'm gonna go mad!
doom is set in the future where we have long since rid our
selfs of christains
by the way the cyberdemon is called 'belphigor' and not satan

yes your right, resident evil sucks ass!

playing as diffrent marines might be a good idear!
you ever played hexen/hexen2?,you get to play as an assassin,
a necromancer,a knight and a diffrent type of knight

some thing I would like to see is to meet other marines
controled by the computer like in unreal-tornament
so you can send them in on sewer-side missions
this would make death match look really cool

but I sure don't wanna have to rescue hostages or human
sacrifice's - I just wanna kill

it would also be really cool if you could play as imps or something and maybe lead an army of hellspawn to battle
and then death match could be human V's demons

as you can see I wanna stick with the fantsy/horror side
of DOOM and NOT the SI-FI ie: UAC and oh shit! I've opened
a gate way to hell for the 3th time now

...or maybe - OK this is going too far - play the guy from
quake or the guys from hexen/heretic as well as a marine

the plot should be explained on the help pages,and not at
the beggining in a starwars style text screen

[wasted]

Well, let see what we've got here...

1) Character aspect: Thats nonsence. Since Doom it was just one character - you. If you want to play for different characters why will you get one of RPG games?
Instead of playing characters i suggest have 3 types of players (i offered that for multi before, but nobody really liked that idea :( It might be option for player constitution and carrying abilities: Light/ Scout; Medium/ Sarge; Heavy/ Grunt.( If you want i can post big message here bout that....)

Idea about invade Doom by NPCs was make some noise here, but most of the people disliked. But im still for it...

2) I dont like Christianity to be included in the game. Its no point to make a Doom story like story of Crusade at the End of Times. You can't find nothing about lonesome space marine saving the Earth from forces of Satan in Revelation. Antichrist - thats plot for each second cheap horror movies, that plot is wasted (just as i :( , so im concerned that id will cook some special Doom story line (i hope it will be more Sci-Fi there...).

3) About message: id can put whatever... Besides, the games created for your imagination, so after playing you can get rather different message then athor person, so it depends more from players then from id... Wasted for Seek &Destriy style....

[Guest wrexsoul]

CHAINSAW+DGM said:

I'm not saying that the game should preach Christ or Christianity. But I would like to see some sort of theological analysis in this game along the lines of what was in Neon Genesis Evangelion, Xenogears, and maybe Event Horizon.

I find it is very interesting when people use pseudo science and pseudo religion in stories. On some level, it makes you feel like the story might actually be true.

I'm talking about when a writer takes some accepted theological notions and twists them into his own story, with his own take on the materials.

As for "in the future, christianity has vanished" sounds like a cool thing to talk about it in the game.

I'm not christian or anything, I would just like to see this game present different views, possibly through the characters. Like one character could be an athiest who thinks believing in god is a waste of time, another could be some guy that isn't very spiritual at all, and another could be a devout christian. All of these characters could be given a chance to express their views without the story dictating one is either right or wrong.

I would again like to reiterate the movie "Event Horizon," because I feel this movie shares a few paralells with the story line of doom (marines sent on exploration of a ship that had a interdimensional warp device that landed it in hell for 5 years and has all of the sudden reapeared with everyone on board massacred)

If you want pure action, go play serious sam. Doom has a lot of concepts going for it that I would love to see elaborated in a game that isn't just a shootemup. I don't think anyone wants to see just action in a single player game. I mean we have all been playing action only, multiplayer games online for years now, why do you want to play a single player game to just go around shooting AI enemies?

I garuntee you id is going to attempt some sort of plot in this game, They aren't making a single player focused game just so you can shoot at AI. What I am trying to do is drum up support for the direction I think the plot should go in.

[Guest wrexsoul]

wasted said:

I know the original Doom was just one character, but for a story you need more characters, that is unless is ID is up to doing a plot like Cast Away where it focuses on the characters internal struggles during stressful times.

There where a couple of novels released about DooM that I thought where decent. About a quarter of the way through, the doom marine met another marine who survived the initial attack and they worked together to survive. I think there where a couple of other people alive in hell too.

As for revelations, I think it would be cool if ID skews things in Revelations for their own purposes. It is a story, it doesn't have to be accurate. something like "the bible is wrong and this is what really happens..."

Yeah the antichrist idea is kind of lame, I'm just throwing out ideas here...not making the game.

I like messages that aren't preaching but they inspire thought. I think ID should try to make a story that inspires discussion and contemplation.

[Tetzlaff]

You don´t necessarely need more then one character to make a good story. Have you never seen a one-man play in theatre?

[Guest elyuca]

Look at my previous post. It explains a good way to implemewnt religion into the plot:

http://www.doomworld.com/forums/doom3/messages/11199.shtml

[fodders]

The guys at ID have probably realised that having a believeable plot will be worth around $40,000,000 extra to them for the film rights, Doom1+2 was unable to support a semi-decent plot , hence no film was made. ID can make up for that fact and recoup most of game outlay by just having a decent plot

[danarchist]

CHAINSAW+DGM said:

OK this is going too far - play the guy fromquake or the guys from hexen/heretic as well as a marine

Hey that idea with the guys from all the id games coming together is something I've been thinking about since about the time Quake came out. Maybe all the enemies they were fighting were spawned from the same dimension/hell. Desparil from Heretic was a daemon who went to a distant dark-age world and took it over, the same thing happening to the worlds his brothers Korax and Eidolon conquerd (all this taken from the storyline of Hexen II). But unfortunately, they were all destroyed. Then hell set it's eyes on Earth, unleashing a subversive daemon named...Hitler. Well, his armies were taken down by B.J. Blackzowitz (spelling?). Then the daemon Shub-Nigurath (from Quake) unleashed her spawn upon the earth, but was defeated. Then comes doom. In this scenario, scientists are messing with the old slipgate technology again and they let a gateway between our universe and hell open again and many daemons led by the Icon of Sin took over the colonies of the humans: Phobos, Deimos, Mars, and eventually the Earth. Of couse, the Icon was killed via too many rockets to the brain, and the humans once again had to rebuild. No sooner had they done that then they were attacked by the Strogg, boimechanical horrors created on a planet long-ago overtaken by hell and ruled by a daemon called the Makron.
Now then, the story for this conceptual game goes like this: all the powers from hell have been ressurected by a greater evil through the control of the time-stream, a technology recently discovered by the daemons. They then use the technology to capture all of the heros and bring them to the new Daemon fortress at the End of Time. Here they will be sacrificed in a rite that will bring total control of the universe over to the daemons. But something goes wrong and the heros escape and begin to kick daemon ass. Features of this game would include the heroes traveling to the different epochs in time to face the returned daemons, and then a final showdown at the Fortress at the End of Time to fight the Ultimate Evil.
Pretty cool, huh?
The heros would be the Sidhe from Heretic, a couple of the classes from Hexen, B.J. from Wolfenstein, Quakedude from Quake, Doomguy from Doom, and Mr. Marine-Cannon-Fodder from Quake II. Now that would be cool.

[GooberMan]

Perhaps that would be a good idea for a mod, but I couldn't see that being a full price retail game that people have high expectations for... the plot would go almost nowhere once you get playing the game (it'd be like Quake 2's plot: set it up, give you goals during the game, and big battle right at the end of it).
If the ua-corp.com domain name registering is anything to go by, id are fleshing out the rather lacking-in-detail universe that is Doom. What they do after fleshing it out is anybody's guess (although it has been revealed part of it will take place on Mars - UAC again I should think). Where will it go from there? Hopefully pure surprise (I wasn't expecting the ending to Half-Life but it was the most satisfying ending to any game I had ever played). Speculation is great, it's a good way to get some mod ideas for when the game comes out, and that idea sounds great for a new Generations/SOG type mod.

[CHAINSAW+DGM]

danarchist said:

COOL!
BUT I LIKE TO THINK WOLF-3D HAS A SEPPARTE PLOT

I THINK THE ICON OF SIN IS SOME KINDA LIVING 'DEMON SPAWNER'
AND THE CYBER DEMON LEAD THE INVASHION OF HELL