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Buckshot

Does he ever die?

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A strange thought passed through my mind watching some Jason flicks tonight....

Does Doom guy ever actually die? And if he does, does he keep coming back to life to finish the job over and over and over again?

Maybe, he never dies...

Maybe his own personal hell that, as DOOM 64's finale states, he will spend all eternity fighting, brought back to life over and over by some unknown force to keep the demonic hordes at bay? Almost a earthly arch-angel type of warrior?

Just thinking out loud.

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GhostlyDeath said:

I do not believe canonistically that the Doom guy ever gets killed at all.

PWADs might just kill the Doom guy, revive him, or they are someone else.



I mean, I've seen him die... E1M8... and then alive and well in E2M1, like nothing ever happened :/

But you get what I'm saying, right? What if DOOM guy is to pesky demons as Jason Vorhees is to horny teens? I also further this notion as they are both mute and do not speak.

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I've always thought that Doomguy didn't die in E1M8 but they almost killed him and left him wounded in deimos anomaly... he actually recovered tho.

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Because the laws of the other world, the so-called hell dimension, Doomguy was forever changed in the sense that death is meaningless. Sure, he can be killed but he will come back to life, reconstitute as it were. Same with the demons, you can blast them away but through forces unknown they simply reincarnate. Or it could be simple as pressing any key to continue.

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antares031 said:

I always thought the ending of Episode 1 was just a nightmare, or a hallucination, during the teleportation.


I reasoned this as well from time to time, seeing that the manual mentions that some people would come out of the teleporter blathering about Demons. Perhaps they also were "killed" during transportation and came out just fine, but emotionally distraught. (Though it also says that some people exploded when they hit the other side, so I suppose hallucinating is like the good way out).

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Buckshot said:

Almost a earthly arch-angel type of warrior?

A self-resurrecting archie? I like the idea.

My pet theory is that from E2M1 onwards Doomguy is a corpse that refuses to lie down, it's just force of will that keeps him going.

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Doomguy can die temporarily but he always self resurrects like the badass he is. Just get yourself killed on any level and watch the magic unfold. He loses his guns but somehow always has a pistol in hand. No, not the one you're thinking of.

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Alfonzo said:

Look, all Doomguy is trying to do... all he's ever tried to do, is find his way back to E1M1 so that he may locate his starting co-ordinates, say the magic words and despawn once and for all.

It's all he's ever wanted.

Doomguy wants out of the nightmare, and unfortunately death is not an option. Tried it before; doesn't work. He'd better move fast, though...: If Phobos tears apart in orbit around Mars then the Hangar will go down with it, and he'll be Doomed to fight the demons for all eternity.

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I also thought perhaps its like what happens in the ending of Stephen King's Dark Tower saga (spoiler: roland is doomed to repeat the entire quest to reach the dark tower over and over again for all eternity until he gets it right per the rules of Gan [a god-like deity] and each time is like the first time [starts from scratch with little to no prior memory])

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Buckshot said:

I mean, I've seen him die... E1M8... and then alive and well in E2M1, like nothing ever happened :/


That is because he never died at the end of E1M8. After that dark room you teleport into you manage to survive by a thread for the most part.

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GhostlyDeath said:

That is because he never died at the end of E1M8. After that dark room you teleport into you manage to survive by a thread for the most part.


I'm having a hard time accepting that. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I mean come on... what? the demons just stopped ripping you apart to leave you barely alive... for what purpose? Why would they do that? They clearly had the upper hand having you cornered in that room. And then what... you magically heal from that and carry on into e2m1 like no big deal? How much time passed between the ending of e1m8 and the start of e2m1 as far as story goes? Is it even the same marine or did that marine get mauled to death, and e2m1 start is another perspective from another marine?

It doesn't add up. Even as a cliffhanger ending (literally) for a shareware episode, it leaves alot of questions to be answered.

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Doomguy dies if you get to 0 health. There's no way to get back to life without rewinding the session. But since this is a game, you can't just delete Doom and your memories of it the moment he dies. You obviously have the option to try again.

The super ambush at the end of E1M8 never looked real to me. It looked more like what happened to those volunteers who tested UAC's teleportation prototypes in the backstory. Wasn't the episode 1 final teleporter exactly that? Nevermind the satanic decoration, that's just mapper's artistic touch.

Canonically he may die at the end of Doom 2: the mission can still be victorious even if he's dead, unlike all previous situations (e.g. Doom 1 endings). id probably assumed that it was the last Doom game.

The existence of Final Doom, assuming that's the same hero, would deduce that canonically he survived the first spitter.

In Doom 3 Resurrection of Evil the engineer may also be dead or alive after ending the final enemy. Can anyone tell who is the hero of the BFG Edition's Lost Episodes and when do they happen?

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Regarding E1M8... I always looked at it as he did die when he went through the portal. But the thing about it, I think, is where he wound up afterward, which was a place floating above Hell itself (or at least that's what the intermission text always implied [referring to the place]).

With that knowledge of place and of the Doomguy's very recent demise, I always thought that he had died and went to Hell, though whether-or-not he belonged there was unknown as Hell never plays fair with the Doomguy.

In a sense, to take this a bit further, this could mean two things:

1) maybe he fought his way out of Hell after dying and being sent there (as we presume that's how you get there up to this point) and reached Earth eventually and Doom 2.

2) he never made it out of Hell. After death everything that followed was simply part of his recurring nightmare; his eternal torment in Hell. Hell showed him a world destroyed to crush his spirits; that everything he fought for was for naught anyway. In a way, this is furthered by the fact that he never kills the Devil. The hidden impaled head of John Romero was just a gatekeeper as we know, though we just think of him as being the mastermind behind it all (furthered by the fact that the real Romero was the head of the game).



All this aside, part of what made Doom so great to me was the lack of a real, tangible story. All there is is what you are doing, which is running blind while Hell breaks loose.

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No doomguy never dies. At the end of e1m8 it's just a lot of effects and then amid all the action in that little box the director yells "cut", you never hear this btw, and then the monsters and doomguy go out for a break and have some coffee and donuts and get ready for the next scene.

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I think that Doomguy just makes it out. He loses all his weapons samus aran style and then starts on Deimos like nothing happened lol. He could have been infused with Demon DNA which make kickass a lot harder. Hell wanted to get rid of him, he was making a mess of their home and so had enough of him hence why they gave him a portal to earth.

Also this was discussed earlier and we never came to an answer :( https://www.doomworld.com/vb/doom-general/63845-does-doomguy-die-at-the-end-of-knee-deep-in-the-dead/

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Yes, Doomguy actually dies every time his health counter reaches zero. However, the player can choose to return Doomguy back in time (in the Doomguy's timeline) and try to change his fate, as many times as the player wants.

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Doomguy didn't die on E1M8.
The developers chose to skip the killing and get on with it, which is clearly written in the intermission screen after E1M8-After killing all the demons in the room, you wonder where you are...

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driftyloon said:

He could have been infused with Demon DNA which make kickass a lot harder.

Ooooh you know, what if that's the plot of Doom 4? And what the whole "UAC experiments" thing is that they wanted to create super soldiers and Doomguy is the result of that, explaining why he didn't get possessed and become a zombie: he was already something not human.

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That's pretty much like asking if he goes to the toilet, rests, eats or shaves. When. And how.

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Jaxxoon R said:

Ooooh you know, what if that's the plot of Doom 4? And what the whole "UAC experiments" thing is that they wanted to create super soldiers and Doomguy is the result of that, explaining why he didn't get possessed and become a zombie: he was already something not human.


Lol...well it kinda would be cool to see that the super soldier program from wolfenstein the new order evolves and is taken into american hands. The two universes are the same so yeah. Doomguy is a prototype and needs to drink potions to keep him from falling into a coma. He never takes damage but he takes damage to the brain. The potions are medicine to stop him falling into a coma. The armor pickups are helmets which fuse with his armor to improve his ability to take trauma. The soulsphere and megasphere are demon energy which his armor accepts as power. His DNA is half demon so can absorb demon energy such as the fireballs, lightning balls and plasma bolts much better than an ordinary marine. He has super strength and speed from the demon DNA and the weapons are kept in an alternate dimension and can be pulled from that dimension by mental power and thinking of that weapon. Invulnerability is when he engages full demon mode and so can absorb any demon attack. Invisibility has been reversed engineered off spectres.

I think this rant is long enough XD

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Ledillman said:

I've always thought that Doomguy didn't die in E1M8 but they almost killed him and left him wounded in deimos anomaly... he actually recovered tho.

I figure the black room is actually the interdimensional teleportation tunnel to Deimos. The story did say that test subjects tended to arrive on the other side wounded.

With ports you can easily make it so that E1M8->E2M1 is continuous. It's an interesting experience because while you will have a ton of weapons, you'll still start with less than 10 hit points in a level full of hitscanner, so it's not as easy as could be expected.

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Maes said:

That's pretty much like asking if he goes to the toilet, rests, eats or shaves. When. And how.

That's all taken care of during those few hours of the day when you're not playing Doom. If you happen to have multiple IWADs, there's also the often reported but poorly documented phenomena known as "tag team Doomguy", where your multiple Doomguys swap places while the intermission screen is up in order to alleviate marathon gaming session-induced fatigue.

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Maes said:

And don't forget what happens between levels.

Doomguy starts an instant teleporter to finish the job in the other facilities, all by pressing the right switch. And in Hell? Even they have teleporters, or how else would they have attacked mankind? With spaceships? Plus, Doom seems to revolve around the story of teleporters, so what I said here would make sense... If only the exit areas would agree with my post... Maybe its like how Halo's 343 Guilty Spark teleports Master Chief like if its nothing, requiring no wires, no equpiment, no nothing. Just green light.

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Voros said:

And in Hell? Even they have teleporters, or how else would they have attacked mankind? With spaceships?


Uhm...yeah?

The Rain of Monsters

Hell knew more than one trick. Months after the Gate
incident, the yearly supply ship came ahead of time. On
radar, the ship looked far larger than usual. And it was
coming from the wrong direction. Strange, but not
inexplicable. The lax radar operators reported the ship's
approach, and personnel went out to the landing field to
meet it. But it never landed. Instead, it hovered over the
base, miles in the air. The men and women looked up at it
and saw that something was terribly wrong.

The ship could not have come from Earth. It was huge,
kilometers long, and was built of bone, steel, flesh,
corruption, and death. It was a bio-mechano-magical
construct from the depths of Hell, and it had come through
space for its vengeance. Enormous doors, large as football
fields, irised open and hideous demons poured out, plunging
to the ground and blanketing the entire base with their
throbbing, pulsing bodies. They were everywhere at once.
The marines' defenses, set up to prevent an attack from the
direction of the Gate, were worthless. The monsters poured
through the sewers, the air vents, the hallways,
everywhere, rampaging, corrupting, and feasting.

Once more, the surviving humans were left as zombified
brain-dead monstrosities. Existing only to kill and kill
and kill.


Though that's the only instance in Doom canon (as much as Final Doom can be considered canon) where a ship is used by the monsters. Maybe because they needed a an overwhelming attack in numbers, which teleportation couldn't grant them, at least not at those distances (it seems the Demons only mastered close-scale teleportation in their own world. Whenever they attacked Mars/Earth/Deimos/Phobos, it was because of man-made teleporters that brought them there).

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Maes said:

Uhm...yeah?

Though that's the only instance in Doom canon (as much as Final Doom can be considered canon) where a ship is used by the monsters. Maybe because they needed a an overwhelming attack in numbers, which teleportation couldn't grant them, at least not at those distances (it seems the Demons only mastered close-scale teleportation in their own world. Whenever they attacked Mars/Earth/Deimos/Phobos, it was because of man-made teleporters that brought them there).

I never really thought of Final Doom as something...official to the the story of Doom, but more like a TC of Doom 2 (technically it is, as you fight the same boss from Doom 2, just with a different name).
Plus, these demons seem more like brutes than brains, so why would they need a spaceship? They're not even from space!

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