Star Wars The Force Awakens

[esselfortium]

I think episodes 2 and 3 are honestly even worse than episode 1, which is saying something. Just because Jake Lloyd wasn't in them doesn't mean they're not still full of hilariously nonsensical writing and direction at every turn.

[Tarnsman]

Episode 1 was aggressively stupid and annoying but it occasionally had moments that felt like Star Wars. So despite it being annoying, nonsensical, and probably one of the worst edited blockbuster films it still at least had some attempt at Star Wars. E2 and E3 manage to be even dumber plot wise (not as in your face) while also being BORING AS SHIT. Walking and talking. Even E3 (the "good" one) is 90% walking and talking. Plus the only time lightsabers were used for anything even remotely interesting in the prequels was the intro to the final battle with Darth Maul (the battle was garbage but that door opening shot was pretty damn good).

I think because E1 dropped the bar so low people weren't as soul crushingly disappointed with E2 and E3 so they get more praise than they deserve.

[Linguica]

esselfortium said:

I think episodes 2 and 3 are honestly even worse than episode 1, which is saying something.

Finally someone who agrees with me!!

[FireFish]

esselfortium said:

I think episodes 2 and 3 are honestly even worse than episode 1, which is saying something. Just because Jake Lloyd wasn't in them doesn't mean they're not still full of hilariously nonsensical writing and direction at every turn.

Episode 3 destroyed Star Wars in my mind... And episode 2 was a boring attempt to explain the clones and practically nothing more while being portrayed as a damn ugly feast of severely failed CGI in a time where they could have done so much better.

i even like Episode 1 because it is the only one of the prequels with an actual Star Wars feeling, or rather a hint of the Star Wars atmosphere to it if one ignores the ugly weird sabers.

[Dragonsbrethren]

This was pretty great, way more Star Wars than the prequels ever were. My only real complaint is that it retreads the originals a little too much, but meh, it was still good in spite of it.

[fraggle]

Linguica said:

Finally someone who agrees with me!!

Yeah, I'd tend to agree too.

As I see it, the one overarching failure of the prequel films is that the overall, large scale story is really, really terrible and makes no sense at all. Absolutely none of the main plot arcs are convincing or make any sense, including: Anakin's fall to the dark side, the "romance" between him and Padme, the Emperor's rise to power, the "clone wars", etc.

Episode 1 is a bad film but it can at least stand on its own as a cute nod to the original films (albeit inferior to them). By contrast, the further you go into the trilogy the more important these larger-scale plot arcs become, and the more unbearable the whole mess becomes.

People remember Episode 1 for how annoying Jar Jar Binks was, but there are a ton of scenes in Episode 3 that are absolutely cringeworthy to watch. I'd much rather watch Jar Jar Binks bouncing around like an idiot for two hours than watch Hayden Christensen's wooden attempts to appear evil. Although really, I don't blame Christensen - the prequel films had plenty of strong actors and it's bad direction that is the real problem.

About the only thing that stands as memorable from those films is the Yoda/Dooku lightsaber battle just because Christopher Lee is such a strong actor that he can hold the scene together single-handed, and it's vaguely awesome to see Yoda use his powers in battle. Apart from that, the rest is garbage.

[pritch]

^^^ Thirded.

As for ep7, I finally saw it last night.

(Protip for some others re: Darknation's post - do not look in thread before seeing the film in future)

I thought it was very good overall. Sure you can poke holes in it if you go looking, but it's a Star Wars movie, and it did the job of Star Wars movie well overall. It's a lean film with few wasted moments, and sets up well for the trilogy.

[Bucket]

If there's one thing we've learned from JJ movies, it's that brainless shooty space operas riding on nostalgia and "Remember this?" moments works GREAT for Star Wars, not so much for Star Trek.

[Tarnsman]

fraggle said:

and it's vaguely awesome to see Yoda use his powers in battle. Apart from that, the rest is garbage.

Watching Yoda bounce around like a monkey on speed was one of the least enjoyable parts of the prequels.

[Annunakitty]

Finally saw it last night, though thanks to my job I got slammed with all of the major spoilers the day before it even released. Despite this, it was a fun movie and I enjoyed it thoroughly. 9/10

[hardcore_gamer]

The more time I spend thinking about the movie, the more negative I feel about it.

I am going to make a very bold statement: I think the force awakens is almost as bad as the star wars prequels. I would argue that episode 1 is worse, but I honestly think episode 2 and 3 (or at least 3) are actually better movies.

There are just so many distracting and stupid moments in the film that I can't see how it's a good movie. I think people are just saying it's good only because it's star wars and only because it's not the prequels. Once enough time has passed and people look back the film I think they won't think anywhere near as highly of it.

[fraggle]

Tarnsman said:

Watching Yoda bounce around like a monkey on speed was one of the least enjoyable parts of the prequels.

I found it a nice novelty the first time I saw it (the Episode 3 Yoda/Sidious battle was far less interesting). I dunno, just trying to find something vaguely positive to say about those films that I enjoyed, to be honest.

[printz]

Sodaholic said:

Also, the darth whatever guy is a fucking joke, whiny and unimposing, flailing his lightsaber in a fit like a toddler.

Maybe that was all deliberate, no? We're seeing yet another scary Doom-like masked dude with good command of the force, but it turns out he really is a weak and contemptible person? Or he wants us to think he is, just like how he did with Solo. We already see other competent villains in action, namely that general and Kylo's master.

[Dragonsbrethren]

It certainly seemed deliberate to me. He's portrayed as a weaker, flawed character any time he has the mask off.

Spoiler

Speaking of his tantrums, that bit where two stormtroopers are walking down the corridor, hear him flipping out, and just nope out was hilarious.

[Ralphis]

Kylo Ren idolizes Vader, but he is the opposite of Anakin. Anakin was a super-skilled jedi that wanted to be good, but was bad at his core. Kylo Ren, who wants to be like Vader, is a whiny brat who has shitty skills and is not truly committed to the dark side (yet).

He never paid his dues, so he could never truly be a bad ass sith. Now, he got jacked up by Rey and got some scars, so he'll probably begin his path towards being full evil and actually getting some skills so a random storm trooper can't hang with him in a light saber battle.

He's supposed to be a worthless joke of a bad guy - for now.

[dew]

Yes, absolutely. Kylo Ren is supposed to be a bitch and a tesco value vader. Despite certain plotholes, the story actually does set up a bunch of proto-plot nicely.

Also fuck Yoda with lightsaber. It's only superficially cool, but it actually robs you of all illusion that force might be about spirituality and the mind.

[Clonehunter]

I agree with Ralphis about Kylo. This seems to be start of his journey as he attempts to prove himself as a capable member of this First Order thing. He's close to being there, as he seems to be pretty good with the force, but as an actual fighter he seems to be a tad weak, for now.

I don't think he's really supposed to be a Sith, though he may be striving to be one instead of being a member of this Knights of Ren thing.

Spoiler

I found it rather interesting in how he he kept punching the wound Chewie inflicted on his leg/body(?) as if trying to invigorate himself, trying to get angry. This seemed like a very Dark Side thing to do imo.

I also thought the saber battle was interesting in itself because we have Finn, who was proven to not be the best with the Saber, but giving it a try. Meanwhile, it seems like Kylo is rusty and hasn't had an actual fight in a long time. Rey, who was already proven to be adept in melee combat (Seen on Jakku against the thugs) as such stood a slightly better chance, and once she focused managed to kick Kylo's ass.

I actually thought Finn and Kylo were both killed when they initially went down, especially Finn who basically got spine-slashed. Seeing that Han died only moments ago, I figured it was "anything could happen" at this point, and figured that Finn getting the axe wasn't too much of a stretch. I kind if applaud it for that.

Much of this film, though, seemed to be setting up the next two. Note this is what the Phantom Menace tried and failed to do. It gives us boy Anakin, Padme, and Obi-Wan, but then kills or dismisses any other character by the time of the second film. By the time of the second film, there was no time to build up anything before having to rush the conclusion of the trilogy with the third prequel. I mean, AotC had to give us an entire War, but then we never get to see Anakin develop into the supposed hero he was during the films, and we only see the beginning of his career and then the fall. We never see the actual heroism, for the most part.

Thankfully, there was other material to fill in the gaps, such as the two Clone Wars cartoons and various books and comics (Most non-canon as of now), but a lot of that should have been seen in the films. TPM is fine as a standalone film, really, but as part of a larger saga it fails miserably. The Force Awakens seems to be correcting these past mistakes by not wasting too much time and giving us our teams, the conflict, and the characters we now need to pay attention too.

[printz]

I wonder if Kylo Ren was meant to be a mockery of the Inquisitor from Star Wars Rebels, who is also Vader-like, also by Disney, but with a more predictably menacing look. I haven't watched Rebels yet, but both villains when I saw them in trailers looked the same to me, as Vader wannabes.

I liked Rey as someone who lacks "character development". She was pretty much like a video game protagonist, like Doomguy: very little personality because you control him/her, but tough and skilled in all areas because the game will be hard.

[Breezeep]

Just saw The Force Awakens, I thought the movie and its visuals were cool. I also liked seeing that BB-8 droid. He's a nice touch of a character for the movie.

[FireFish]

I have not seen this movie yet... but that BB8 droid realy gets on my nerves... It looks like some kind of childish soccer-ball replacement mix between and for JarJar or C3PO...

[dew]

FireFish said:

I have not seen this movie yet... but that BB8 droid realy gets on my nerves... It looks like some kind of childish soccer-ball replacement mix between and for JarJar or C3PO...

Nope, the droid is nowhere near as annoying as you may think. It's actually much less prominent in the story than the droids in ep4. Find something else to bitch about based on your trailer knowledge.

[FireFish]

dew said:

Nope, the droid is nowhere near as annoying as you may think. It's actually much less prominent in the story than the droids in ep4. Find something else to bitch about based on your trailer knowledge.

I will watch it when i can, i might enjoy it, it might be fantastic as a stand-alone movie... But If it (bb8) annoys me that much in fragments and trailers then it will in the movie. Another sad part is that i absolutely can not stand the face of the woman playing Rey so thats one problem of the many.

Star Wars is one of the end all, be all, movie series in my life but this movie already became problematic to me from the trailer and upwards... up to the fragments shattered around the internet.

[Breezeep]

FireFish said:

Another sad part is that i absolutely can not stand the face of the woman playing Rey so thats one problem of the many.

Uh, what exactly is wrong with the face of Rey? Are you saying this just to start some stupid argument?

[RestlessRodent]

Until I saw this movie, I believed that in order to actually use a light saber you needed the actual force (that is, it only worked with those who have the force).

The big bad in the giant chair though reminds me of Star Trek Enterprise, the guy from the future telling the Suliban terrorists what to do and not actually doing anything himself.

[FireFish]

Breezeep said:

Uh, what exactly is wrong with the face of Rey? Are you saying this just to start some stupid argument?

Nope.
I want to like and enjoy this new Star Wars movie when i get a chance but there are so many things unrelated to Star Wars itself that realy repulse me from that movie at the same time. One of them being the fact that i realy can not stand that actress...

And there are a lot of people who do not watch certain movies because they contain actors which they cant stand based on appearance alone.

[RestlessRodent]

Is this justifiable hatred? Did said actor cause emotional, physical, or monetary damage to you?

[Ralphis]

I understand Firefish's concerns. The repulsive feelings he gets when looking at Rey are probably the same feelings I get when I see his name attached to a post

[Clonehunter]

GhostlyDeath said:

Is this justifiable hatred? Did said actor cause emotional, physical, or monetary damage to you?

Probably stole his candy.

[GreyGhost]

GhostlyDeath said:

Until I saw this movie, I believed that in order to actually use a light saber you needed the actual force (that is, it only worked with those who have the force).

AFAIK - anyone can swing a light sabre, but precognition (a Force power) will give you a defensive advantage.

[chungy]

The Force flows through all living things, including those not honed into listening to it and harness its power.

Even so, Han Solo used Luke's lightsaber to open up a tauntaun on Hoth. There's no rule about lightsabors only being for Jedi/Sith. :P