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Buckshot

idtech 6... or idtech 5.666?

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So it appears officially confirmed via the game informer article that idtech 6 is still idtech 5 at heart. Seems to be a bit of a discussion amongst the pages here:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1167645


Interesting, considering I don't recall seeing any megatexturing going on in pics/official alpha videos/etc. At least not the shabby low-resolution textures we saw in RAGE or Wolf:TNO. Nor the excessive and abysmal texture pop-in (at least not the extent seen in RAGE, per that neogaf thread.)

Though if even these are rectified, that makes me wonder if the problem that prevents SLI from functioning still exist (I believe it was from GPU transcoding).

Needless to say, it's already looking like a huge improvement over the original idtech 5 engine, visually and performance-wise.

If I remember correctly, the original plan for DOOM 4 (prior to the rework) was to be on idtech 5 all along. I guess it's safe to assume while they tossed out the game development progress, engine development continued from idtech 5 source, though modified with a new renderer to fit the current project.

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Buckshot said:

So it appears officially confirmed via the game informer article that idtech 6 is still idtech 5 at heart. Seems to be a bit of a discussion amongst the pages here:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1167645


Interesting, considering I don't recall seeing any megatexturing going on in pics/official alpha videos/etc. At least not the shabby low-resolution textures we saw in RAGE or Wolf:TNO. Nor the excessive and abysmal texture pop-in.

Though if even these are rectified, that makes me wonder if the problem that prevents SLI from functioning still exist (I believe it was from GPU transcoding).

Needless to say, it's already looking like a huge improvement over the original idtech 5 engine, visually and performance-wise.

If I remember correctly, the original plan for DOOM 4 (prior to the rework) was to be on idtech 5 all along. I guess it's safe to assume while they tossed out the game development progress, engine development continued from idtech 5 source, though modified to fit the current project.


From the little I've studied about Id's Tech 5 engine it seems that its texture loading issues were directly related to choice of using Megatextures and their memory streaming solution, instead of conventional textures. If iD ditched the Megatexture technology, it would be a safe bet that those issues will be gone,

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victorboris1 said:

If iD ditched the Megatexture technology, it would be a safe bet that those issues will be gone,


Appears to be the case, as textures look infinitely better, and reused in different areas. Thus, I cannot see where megatextures would even apply here, other than possible larger-scale open area Hell maps.

My major worry, however, if those of us with SLI will still have a second gpu sitting there doing nothing... as was the case for RAGE and Wolf:TNO. Especially for those of us on 4K where that gpu makes or breaks the resolution for us.

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Buckshot said:

Appears to be the case, as textures look infinitely better, and reused in different areas. Thus, I cannot see where megatextures would even apply here, other than possible larger-scale open area Hell maps.

My major worry, however, if those of us with SLI will still have a second gpu sitting there doing nothing... as was the case for RAGE and Wolf:TNO. Especially for those of us on 4K where that gpu makes or breaks the resolution for us.


Let's hope that Thiago Souza has worked his unholy magic to help code SLI and Crossfire support into the engine.

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What was it that I heard a while back when they were discussing the 'new' idtech 6 having some sort of a decal system? Is that for the gore? As for texture pop in, I did notice it somewhat, but nothing and I mean NOTHING like RAGE had. Or even TNO for that matter.

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victorboris1 said:

From the little I've studied about Id's Tech 5 engine it seems that its texture loading issues were directly related to choice of using Megatextures and their memory streaming solution, instead of conventional textures. If iD ditched the Megatexture technology, it would be a safe bet that those issues will be gone,

This.

Decals obviously inherited from id tech 5 stamping thing. Stamping over prebaked megatexture is what actualy made Rage look incredibly unique. In Doom they now can apply decals/stamps in dynamic render...but I'm pretty sure not to the extent of Rage or Wolf where amount of stamps are unlimmited.

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Of course it is. Do you think anyone actually throws away every bit of code and starts over for a new engine? Generally it's more efficient to butcher an existing code and modernize it. Consider that some of the Crytek vets that work on Tech6 have been brought AFTER the QC14 reveal. id guys have already had some of the game working before they started working their magic and rewriting the whole renderer (as Tiago mentioned around E3 2015 that they've made a new renderer in less than a year).

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I can confirm, as someone who has the DOOM Closed Alpha files on my PC, that DOOM does indeed use Megatexture technology. There is a 4 GB virtualtexture file in the game files. And that's for 1 multiplayer map!
I think I might want to replace my 250 GB harddisk.

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No texture pop-up and 60fps will be ONLY on CONSOLES this is the true. PC gamers most likely will have to face the truth that the main market for Doom are console players not PC. Just look in the past and see RAGE. (game worked properly only on consols).

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pro_zealot said:

No texture pop-up and 60fps will be ONLY on CONSOLES this is the true. PC gamers most likely will have to face the truth that the main market for Doom are console players not PC. Just look in the past and see RAGE. (game worked properly only on consols).


Rage ran like a charm on my previous laptop. No texture pop-in issues at all.

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Sure after tweaks like create folder for texture strorage etc.. and some console commands game runs fine, but on my PC on day 1 during release the situation was different.

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RAGE ran perfectly fine for me, beautiful consistent 60fps. I'm certain the texture pop-in was there on consoles, but you can't do lightning fast 180 degree turns on a pad so it's less noticable. But honestly, it never bothered me. Certainly not a deal breaker like a lot of people (whiners) claim. I don't expect DOOM4 to be any different provided you hit the recommended reqs.

In other words, check your facts pro_zealot, because both RAGE and DOOM3 BFG never go below 60fps (and I assume the same is true for TNO but I was below min reqs so I can't tell). BFG will even scale down the resolution just to keep the consistent 60fps so... yeah.

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Rage ran fine for me too back in the day ( i5 760 + gtx 470 )and on me latest build ( i7 4770k + gtx 780 ). Didn't have to tweak any files either, always ran at a smooth 60 fps.

I think a lot of the slating id tech 5 gets is unwarranted most of the time, I seen worse pop in with some unreal engine 3 games in the past. Why would anyone just want to stand on a spot and whiz the mouse around just to see flaws is beyond me. Most of the issues were down to crap ati drivers.

Anyway the alpha ran very well for me, during play there was no pop in to be seen, only when the level loads in on count down. That's all I'm saying about that due NDA.

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hmm wierd i play DOOM 4 alpha on similar PC (i7-4790 4/8 3.6GHz + 16GB DDR3 + 780GTX) and my experience was diffrent thats all i can say due to NDA.

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I experienced no texture pop-in at all and had a smooth 60 fps 99.9% of the time.

(i5-4670K 3.4GHz + 8GB DDR3 + GTX 760)

It's probably just an optimization issue; they'll (hopefully) have it fixed before launch. I think people with GTX 750ti cards couldn't even play with more than 4 fps.

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ArchvileHunter said:

I experienced no texture pop-in at all and had a smooth 60 fps 99.9% of the time.

(i5-4670K 3.4GHz + 8GB DDR3 + GTX 760)

It's probably just an optimization issue; they'll (hopefully) have it fixed before launch. I think people with GTX 750ti cards couldn't even play with more than 4 fps.


Do you have an SSD? I recall that when Rage was launched on consoles, the PS3 had a lot of texture-streaming issues, but almost all of these issues were solved if the player replaced the console's hard-drive with an SSD.

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ArchvileHunter said:

@victorboris1 I have both a 250GB SSD and a 250GB HDD installed, but I was able to run the Alpha on the HDD with no performance problems at all.


An SSD is more for lowering loading times than actual in-game performance, really. The MP Alpha map is also pretty small, I would venture a guess at very much smaller than any given SP level.

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AirRaid said:

An SSD is more for lowering loading times than actual in-game performance, really. The MP Alpha map is also pretty small, I would venture a guess at very much smaller than any given SP level.


Yes, but the access times for SSDs are so good that they drastically improve the performance while streaming the textures from the SSD to the RAM.

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