Can You Make Monsters Ignore You?

[Da Eediot]

Let me explain. I want to have a specific area that when the player steps in it, monsters will ignore him/her and walk away. Is there any way to do this? And if there is, can I do it in Doom Builder 2?

[Fuzzball]

Vanilla? Boom? Zdoom based? What are you mapping for?

[Da Eediot]

FuzzballFox said:

Vanilla? Boom? Zdoom based? What are you mapping for?

Are you asking what kind of WAD I'm making? I'm making a WAD that's going to have stealth elements. I'm using Boom. I don't know what Vanilla is.

[Linguica]

You can set a reject map to make monsters ignore you when you are inside certain sectors, but they will follow you around.

[Da Eediot]

Linguica said:

You can set a reject map to make monsters ignore you when you are inside certain sectors, but they will follow you around.

They will follow me inside the sectors?

[Linguica]

Da Eediot said:

They will follow me inside the sectors?

Sure, if you don't set monster block lines or whatever. With a special reject map it basically just makes the monsters "blind" when you are within certain sectors, so they never actually think they can see you and attack. But if they are awake they will always still walk towards you as usual, because that's the only thing Doom monsters know how to do. There's no way to do anything approximating "real" stealth elements in Boom.

[Gez]

Da Eediot said:

I don't know what Vanilla is.

http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Doom_engine#Vanilla_Doom

[Da Eediot]

Linguica said:

Sure, if you don't set monster block lines or whatever. With a special reject map it basically just makes the monsters "blind" when you are within certain sectors, so they never actually think they can see you and attack. But if they are awake they will always still walk towards you as usual, because that's the only thing Doom monsters know how to do. There's no way to do anything approximating "real" stealth elements in Boom.

Do you have a link to a tutorial on how to do that?

[Chezza]

You can try setting monsters as friendly if its available in your editor. They will not even move at the sight of you. However if there are any unfriendly monsters nearby they will attack them on sight.

So if you have a closed sector with nothing but friendly monsters then they will just stand still. I think they even take any hits of yours and won't resist. Different sourceports may cause different results.

There is a dormant flag you can tick. It will make them invincible and non-interactive unless you have a linedef special or script to Thing_Activate them. But using Zandronum myself, it makes most lower tier monsters invisible.

**Edit**

Seeing that you want them to back off once you enter the sector perhaps you can mess around with Thing_Hate scripts. Do you have scripts available? If you do, you can have hidden monsters around the map and tag them. Set the linedef to 80 (execute script) and they can be set to Hate another monster. *Maybe* they will end pursuit of you and move to the other target if you haven't harmed them. Maybe.

[Da Eediot]

Thanks. I'll try that and see if it works.

[scifista42]

Chezza said:

You can try setting monsters as friendly if its available in your editor.
[...]
Do you have scripts available?

Just to make this clear, the "availability" of these features doesn't depend on your choice of map editor, but rather your choice of its "game configuration", which in turn determines target compatibility of your wad (usually). For example, scripts are only available in "Hexen format" and "UDMF" map formats, typically with "(G)ZDoom" in the name of the configuration, and the map using them will work in (G)ZDoom only (or in Hexen, if Hexen-only script features were used, but that's not so common). Or if you're using "Boom" game configuration, you will have Boom's linedef and sector actions and flags "available", which merely means that the editor supports you to make maps that will be playable in Boom-compatible ports in the end.

Boom absolutely doesn't support ACS scripts. It merely supports "improvised scripts" implemented by a "voodoo doll" in a dummy sector outside the map's main area, placed on a moving floor and triggering linedef actions which then take effect on sectors in the map.

Boom also doesn't support a "friendly" flag. MBF does, though behavior of friendly monsters in MBF isn't identical to ZDoom's friendly monsters. http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Friendly_monster

[Chezza]

I must tip my map to any vanilla doom purist who manages to include many unique triggers without scripts.

Other than the intimidating process for noobs like myself learning basic scripting it makes doom mapping so much easier. You can surprise even veteran Doomers when you manipulate the power of scripts.

[Da Eediot]

There aren't any settings in Doom to make a monster friendly. And I'm really bad at using scripts. Is there another way? I also don't know how to use MBF.

[scifista42]

Da Eediot said:

There aren't any settings in Doom to make a monster friendly.

Which "Game Configuration" are you using in your map editor? Find it out in Map Options or when opening a map / creating new one. Only the "MBF" or "(G)ZDoom" ones will contain the Friendly flag.

[Da Eediot]

scifista42 said:

Which "Game Configuration" are you using in your map editor? Find it out in Map Options or when opening a map / creating new one. Only the "MBF" or "(G)ZDoom" ones will contain the Friendly flag.

I'm using Boom. I'll change my Game Configuration to ZDoom and see if I find the setting.

Is "Deaf" the setting that makes monsters friendly?

[scifista42]

No, "Deaf" really not. It should be "Friendly".

Just keep in mind that the Game Configuration doesn't "enable" the feature. It merely makes the feature visible for your convenience when mapping for a port than supports this feature. As I told you, Boom doesn't support the Friendly flag, so your map will no longer be purely Boom compatible if you use it. MBF is relatively closely "above" Boom in regards to compatibility and available features, though.

[Da Eediot]

scifista42 said:

No, "Deaf" really not. It should be "Friendly".

Just keep in mind that the Game Configuration doesn't "enable" the feature. It merely makes the feature visible for your convenience when mapping for a port than supports this feature. As I told you, Boom doesn't support the Friendly flag, so your map will no longer be purely Boom compatible if you use it. MBF is relatively closely "above" Boom in regards to compatibility and available features, though.

What does "Deaf" do, then? And how do I set my WAD to (G)ZDoom? I set my WAD to ZDoom, but it doesn't have a "Friendly" setting.

[scifista42]

Da Eediot said:

What does "Deaf" do, then?

Read this paragraph: Monster behavior / Initial state and alertness.

Da Eediot said:

And how do I set my WAD to (G)ZDoom? I set my WAD to ZDoom, but it doesn't have a "Friendly" setting.

I've found the friendly flag in the following Game Configurations in Doom Builder 2:
-Eternity
-ZDoom: Doom in Hexen format (!)
-ZDoom: Doom in UDMF format (!)

(!) Beware, the last 2 mentioned ones use a different map format from Doom's standard one, so if you already have a Doom-format map in progress, you shouldn't just change its format in your Map Options, but you should use a proper converter utility to convert it.

[Da Eediot]

scifista42 said:

Read this paragraph: Monster behavior / Initial state and alertness.
I've found the friendly flag in the following Game Configurations in Doom Builder 2:
-Eternity
-ZDoom: Doom in Hexen format (!)
-ZDoom: Doom in UDMF format (!)

(!) Beware, the last 2 mentioned ones use a different map format from Doom's standard one, so if you already have a Doom-format map in progress, you shouldn't just change its format in your Map Options, but you should use a proper converter utility to convert it.

Thanks. I'll try using Eternity and see if it works.

The setting is here, but can I use it to make the monsters ignore the player when he goes into a specific area?

[scifista42]

The flag permanently turns the monsters on the player's side, so that they won't ever be hostile to him anymore. Unless you change that via scripting at runtime.

[Kappes Buur]

Setting the deaf flag and how sound propagates through a map can confuse even veteran mappers.
Linguica has written some excellent tutorials, among them:

USING DEAF MONSTERS

SOUND PROPAGATION

in Lesson 12: Populating Your Doom World.
Read them.
It may save your life. :)

[Da Eediot]

So, there's no way to make a monster change its setting when it enters a specific area?

[scifista42]

First decide target source port / compatibility of your wad (Boom or MBF or Eternity Engine or ZDoom or GZDoom or something else), then we speak about ways how it's possible or not.

[Da Eediot]

scifista42 said:

First decide target source port / compatibility of your wad (Boom or MBF or Eternity Engine or ZDoom or GZDoom or something else), then we speak about ways how it's possible or not.

I'm currently using Eternity for my WAD.

[scifista42]

Your editor's Game Configuration is not what I asked you for. I asked you for the actual source port which you intend your wad to be playable with. Respectively the category of such ports - for example all Boom-compatible ports, or whatever you wish.

[AD_79]

uhhhhhh I'm assuming he's using Eternity for the source port???

[scifista42]

@AD_79: You'd know better if you read the whole thread. This guy apparently disregards the problematique of using different source ports and he thinks that choosing the proper game configuration in his editor will solve all his problems.

[Gez]

I'll point out once again that there is no such thing as a deaf flag. It does not exist.

There is an ambush flag, however. It's for monsters who set up an ambush, so they wait until they have line of sight with the player before they act; instead of reacting as soon as they hear the player.

[Da Eediot]

scifista42 said:

@AD_79: You'd know better if you read the whole thread. This guy apparently disregards the problematique of using different source ports and he thinks that choosing the proper game configuration in his editor will solve all his problems.

I don't know what a source port is. And you said earlier that different game configurations had more options, so yes, I did think that changing the game configuration would solve all my problems. You telling me to do specific stuff without saying what it is or where it is. I've only been making WADs for a few months. I'm new to this stuff.

[Zed]

A source port lets you play the game (Doom in this case) in modern systems (remember that Doom is a DOS game).

When you choose a game configuration in your level editor (DoomBuilder 2 for example), you are telling your editor you are mapping for said source port, and it will show you the options availabe just for that source port (so, if you choose Doom in Doom format, you won't be shown the Boom, MBF, UDMF... options, just "vanilla" options).

For what you want to do, you should choose one of the configurations scifista42 told you.

I hope that helps.

http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Source_port

EDIT