TNT Revilution: Final release now on ID Games!

[Devalaous]

Just popping in to ask that you credit me in the text file as Ragnor "Devalaous" Berntsen, given my username change to what I use everywhere else (Same name im credited as in Terraria too), instead of simply "Ragnor" (which is my first name, I screwed up on Doomworld when I registered)

[Jaws In Space]

delete.

Edited March 30, 2017 by Jaws In Space

[Steve D]

Map04 Revisions are -- I hope -- done!

 

Grab it here; http://www.mediafire.com/file/9fckdcw47nx1cx0/TNTRevMap4x.wad

 

Changes:

1. Removed the sneakier blood-pool Archie from the exit fight on HMP

2. Changed some of the PEs to Cacos on lower difficulties at the exit fight

3. Added 4 stimpacks to the exit fight and 2 stimpacks + 12 armor bonuses at the start

4. Added 4 overhead light columns to the final pump room

5. Added rockets going up the stairs to the exit (both sides) to prevent ammo starvation

6. Placed both medikits in the exit room in front of the exit switch so continuers can't miss them if they make a run for it

7. Added a switch that opens access from the exit area to a teleporter in the huge outdoor area that was formerly inaccessible. This allows players to go for a max if they missed any secrets or monsters before the exit. Also gives a nice view of the killer E1 sky. I thought for sure I'd get an HOM in that area but not even close

8. Added a bunch of barrels to the Imp ledges so it's less tedious to kill them

9. Changed the location of the switch on the Blue Armor platform so players don't have to go around the front of it. This also makes it easier to see the barrier lowering in front of the door leading to the Manc/Caco Room

 

I found a seg overflow in the big Soulsphere secret cavern on CRL, but it didn't show up in Choco Doom. If anyone wants to try teasing it out, stand at the meeting point of Linedefs 1222 and 1956 and look towards the Soulsphere.

 

Sorry it took so long to get this done. Been sick the last couple of weeks and had a ton of IRL work, too.

 

I'll get Map14 in before midnight, Central Time. ;)

 

[Steve D]

I did it! Both maps finished under the deadline.

 

First, a small revision to Map04, which fixes a terrible texture misalignment; http://www.mediafire.com/file/3624e10hc7a949z/TNTRevMap4y.wad

 

And now, Map14; http://www.mediafire.com/file/c58weh0h9om28e8/TNTRev14j.wad

 

Map14 had a game-killing VPO on the platform above the secret Plasma Gun. It appears that the crate and the light above it caused the problem. I had to move the Plasma Gun onto the high platform itself, meaning many players will not see it up there and may not go for that secret. It's not necessary to beat the map, so we'll see. I had to get this revision done in a hurry, so if anyone else wants to see if they can coax out that VPO, please go for it.

 

Other than that, I found no errors on Chocolate Doom.

 

Other changes;

1. Added a blue key in the secret port area and rebuilt the exit switch kiosk. It is now possible to finish the map through the secret port area and bypass the YK leg entirely.

2. Added a second trigger line on the secret rocket launcher crate, to serve as a back-up in case someone strafe-runs over the first line and fails to trigger the trap and the entrance to the secret port area, as in the Keleher FDA.

3. Added a switch to open the YK  bars from the outside, for players approaching from the secret port area. YK not necessary to operate the outside switch. The bars will shut behind the player as they enter, and they will need to get the YK to open the bars from the inside, at which point they stay open.

4. The switch in Sector 373 now lowers the YK column directly -- instead of lowering a wall to reveal another switch to lower the column as before -- as suggested by Magnus.

5. Added a deaf Manc beyond the bars and around the corner in the Backpack Trap Area, as I felt the trap was a bit too nerfed after the last revision.

6. Added some ammo here and there, plus border textures and alignments where needed,

 

I haven't actually played these revisions, so I hope to do that within a couple days.

 

It is now 11:22PM Central Time, so up goes the post. :)

[riderr3]

Did you guys removed Europa in latest version? What a bummer :(

[Jaws In Space]

So I've got all of the updates compiled except for one map. Shouldn't be too much longer of a wait, so sit tight.

[bioshockfan90]

Can't wait for the project to be done! This has been on my list of upcoming WADs for a long time.

[Average]

I wonder, would you consider releasing the textures as a texture replacement pack for the original TNT levels?  Playing through Revilution with the new graphics really makes it feel like its own thing.  It'd be nice to give the original TNT the same identity. :)

[FearTheReaper]

^so much this although not sure if it's easy to do, but makes sense for continuity sake, one after another^ ;-p

[Devalaous]

3 hours ago, Average said:

I wonder, would you consider releasing the textures as a texture replacement pack for the original TNT levels?  Playing through Revilution with the new graphics really makes it feel like its own thing.  It'd be nice to give the original TNT the same identity. :)

I actually talked to Kyka about this, since so many textures were touch-ups or replacements of TNT's worse textures. I wonder how possible it is. Would certainly be nice to have a Evilution add-on wad that updates its "bad textures" in full

[NecrumWarrior]

Can't wait for the final version! I don't really like TNT all that much but maybe I'll enjoy this more.

[dobu gabu maru]

Hey Jaws, what's going on with the map list order? Devil's Den has been slotted for 32 and Anubis seems to be missing completely, two changes I'm kinda not cool with.

[Tristan]

> Atmosphere in text screen slot

 

?!?

Edited April 3, 2017 by Eris Falling : Less inflammatory

[cannonball]

I must admit that there should be a little discussion as the changes Dobu has listed above are pretty controversial, I must admit I would be shocked that Anubis has been axed as the reviews in the DWMC were pretty positive and has generally been seen as a good map. Of could Valkiriforce could have pulled the map last minute I guess. But some some discussion or announcements about some of these things would be nice rather than seeing the map list change every few days or so.

Edited April 3, 2017 by cannonball

[Tristan]

Agreed, Anubis is a great map with no reason to be removed - I don't think it's likely that valk would have pulled it honestly to be honest, given it's come all the way from before the project split. I'm also of the opinion that Devil's Den was one of the most E2-y maps in E2 and chucking it in the super secret slot is not a good move. 

 

Honestly it looks like a bunch of changes are being made with little thought going into them and I'm finding this incredibly frustrating to witness. Also I cannot abide having one of my stronger MIDIs pushed into a text screen slot that no ones spends more than a few seconds on, so if that's supposed to be staying there I'm taking that from the project too and you can reinstate the track that I actually made for that slot.

 

IMO roll back to B3 and start over from there. It was a fine set.

[dobu gabu maru]

51 minutes ago, Eris Falling said:

IMO roll back to B3 and start over from there. It was a fine set.

I think you mean the map & midi list of E3, as quite a few maps have been updated since then :P

 

I also want to voice my opinion Jaws that the B3 beta was ideal in many ways and I wasn't expecting the project outline to stray too far from that—the only thing I thought was going to change was the inclusion of whatever map would replace Europa. Given the disclosure issues this project had back in the heyday, I think it's real important to remember to hash out any kind of changes publicly on the forum.

[AD_79]

I think the most baffling decision is that Lithosphere is still in there, just moved to E1. Wasn't the whole point of Tarns making a map to replace it, not just to shove it into a different slot? Also, I thought the plan for 32 was for Tarnsman to replace Europa with a second map.

 

I agree that the B3 maplist was mostly fine as it was. Anubis was fantastic as well, I don't see why it was removed. It feels to me like Jaws is making rash decisions in an effort to get the project done and out of the way as quickly as possible.

[Devalaous]

Are we really doing another Devilution here.

[dobu gabu maru]

30 minutes ago, Devalaous said:

Are we really doing another Devilution here.

Nah I don't think it's nearly that bad. We're just clarifying our opinions over a handful of maps & midis.

[Jaws In Space]

Yep I'm pulling all my maps to start my own TNT project called Evelkenievelution, each map will require a jump across a canyon.

 

Though seriously the final map should be ready today.

[Tarnsman]

I don't care what slot my map is in as long as it has the E3 sky and the midi that was Map 26's midi when I made it.

[Memfis]

Anubis felt like a map essential to the whole project. It was filled with emotion. Would be very sad to see it go.

[Tristan]

Anubis has been restored, and Devil's Den was put back to its mapslot, so it's all good. Thank you jaws, but posts like the above support these points about making these changes unannounced.

 

On 03/04/2017 at 10:03 PM, dobu gabu maru said:

Given the disclosure issues this project had back in the heyday, I think it's real important to remember to hash out any kind of changes publicly on the forum.

 

On 03/04/2017 at 7:15 PM, cannonball said:

announcements about some of these things would be nice rather than seeing the map list change every few days or so

Not everyone checks the OP on a regular basis, so it only makes these kind of situations more confused, and that CAN lead to Devilution-tier bullshit. Just something to consider.

[Jaws In Space]

Welp here it is pretty much ready to go. There are still a few more minor things that need to be done before the idgames release, but I think it's safe to target a release date of Friday May 5th.

 

Revilution Beta

 

Things to do before final release

- Map 26 needs difficulty settings

- A few E3 maps still need par times

- Coop needs to be tested on maps 18-30

- About 5 maps need DM placement

- Replace the demos

[Angry Saint]

I think Sea Bats by @Viscra Maelstrom is one of the best soundtrack I've ever heard in a Doom pwad. Will it be possible to use it after Revilution is published? 

[gaspe]

I don't agree at all with the change of the midi to my map, Total NoThingness doesn't really fit for it. Aren't there other midis available?

[baja blast rd.]

3 hours ago, Jaws In Space said:

Welp here it is pretty much ready to go. There are still a few more minor things that need to be done before the idgames release, but I think it's safe to target a release date of Friday May 5th.

 

Revilution Beta

 

Things to do before final release

- Map 26 needs difficulty settings

- A few E3 maps still need par times

- Coop needs to be tested on maps 18-30

- About 5 maps need DM placement

- Replace the demos

Map26 has a bunch of monsters stuck to one another. Not in the ZDoom way of monsters being too close together, but in that they are literally occupying the same map coordinate. A pair of shellboxes and a medkit are duplicated too. Some teleport closet sectors got decoupled, so a bunch of monsters don't appear in the later stages. I was wondering why it was so quiet. Linedef 161 which raises the pit with the soulsphere secret has a change texture property, which also changes effects too; that makes the sector non-secret when it becomes accessible, unable to be registered.  

[dobu gabu maru]

MAP26 is neat—it feels like a nice, cozy addition to our set. I really like the idea of a small arena that's infested with PEs—that's usually not an enemy one sees as the premier foe. The layout promotes fluid gameplay, which is nice too.

 

Besides the issues rdwpa pointed out (speaking of, he'd be a great one to test MAP30 Jaws), there's three things I need to grumble about. The first is that ammo balance doesn't seem to be seriously considered—at the bottom right of the map you have 132 shells within walking distance of each other, well after most of the monsters are dead. The second is that the progression through the map is a bit... redundant? Loop around and jump to the red key, then go through the RK door to hit a switch, then loop around and jump to the blue key, then go back to the RK door to go through the BK door, then loop back around and jump to the exit. Honestly, the BK should probably just get the ax (have the player pick up the plasma gun after grabbing the RK) and then make the BK door a normal door. It keeps the map tight and fun without exhausting the player on its layout.

 

Lastly, the texturing. I want to clarify I haven't played Devilution, but uh, TMD, this isn't Devilution. The DGPIPES at sectors 38 & 39 look a bit out of place/ghastly, the bricks need to be vertically aligned, and I feel like you need to apply more SUPPORT3 or gray SUPPORT2 bordering wherever textures spontaneously change into another type. While visual taste is subject & all that, Revilution has clearly gone for a more modern look that throws classic TNT texturing by the wayside, trying to capture the feel of the gameplay without focusing on the look. It's not something that'd bring down the megawad as a whole, but it sticks out enough that I needed to address it.

[NecrumWarrior]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/miq9buehik7bh55/Test01_Necrum.lmp?dl=0 Recorded in PrBoom+ complevel 2, Hurt Me Plenty. FDA

Played through Map01 to completion and Map02 until death. I am rather enjoying this much more than Evilution, which I pretty much despise. I'll try to finish this before the month is up but I'm pretty sure you have cleaned up pretty much anything that I might have found. Map02 seemed somewhat easier than Map01 but I think that's mostly the latter's encouraging use of Berserk against all those hitscanners.

[General Rainbow Bacon]

Final Beta huh?

 

So where's map 30?