TNT Revilution: Final release now on ID Games!

[StalkerZHS]

So I made this hires music + UI pack for revilution.
Like, literally everyone should download at least the music mods
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ooy5pxugozpy6s/TNT%20REVILUTION%20HIRES-1.zip?dl=1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9nnx4dh7jouknei/TNT%20REVILUTION%20HIRES-2.zip?dl=1


Also, TNT Revilution and TNT 2 Devilution are still two completely separate things right?

[Jaws In Space]

Tarnsman said:

Hey Jaws I need to know if you want that map or not, otherwise I'm going to stick it into TNT2.

I'll find a spot for it here.

[Tristan]

My two pence: I would probably be inclined to keep Lithosphere and put Tarnsman's map in MAP27.

[Pinchy]

I've noticed that in the final room of my map with the rocket, you can see the sky repeat in zdoom and gzdoom when turning left or right against the glass.

Is it possible to use the zmapinfo to adjust the sky to fit here (stretchshortskies) rather than changing the map?

[Gez]

I've just finished all 31 maps.

Two demons (who have got to teleport for the final ambush on the green side) are stuck within each other in MAP29. Move thing #284 to fix.




Now let's go back to MAP21: Bloody Garden. A few odd-looking things:

The holding cells should be hidden from the automap, because it's weird that you see them once you find the computer map.
https://i.imgur.com/0JpdFlG.png

When you open the way to this secret, the bridge looks weird. Now I know it moves back down afterward, but actions with texture changes would look better.
https://i.imgur.com/T9uhYRG.png

Same comment here:
https://i.imgur.com/khI36B4.png

And in MAP31, I want to suggest changing the offsets to these risers so that they don't tile this way because it's very visible IMO.
https://i.imgur.com/SeLDRGu.png

[baja blast rd.]

It's possible to skip half of map09 with an SR50 to the teleporter pad behind the fireblu.

Demo

I'd Leave It In™ though. It's easy enough for speedruns not to be one of those annoying tricks like guideless glides, and in casual play it just removes an opportunity to find the secrets.

SteveD said:

I honestly thought that fight was too easy on UV

More archies! :D Having walls slowly lower and release two additional archies would be cool, but I guess it's too late for that.

[Jaws In Space]

rdwpa said:

It's possible to skip half of map09 with an SR50 to the teleporter pad behind the fireblu.

Demo

I'd Leave It In™ though. It's easy enough for speedruns not to be one of those annoying tricks like guideless glides, and in casual play it just removes an opportunity to find the secrets.

More archies! :D Having walls slowly lower and release two additional archies would be cool, but I guess it's too late for that.

Nobody is "fixing" any speedrun tricks. Also there's a pretty obvious skip in map 32 to get the red key that I completely overlooked.

[Jaws In Space]

Tarnsman gave us a map that we are going to use in Revilution.

dobu gabu maru said:

I played Tarns' map and I really like it--I feel there should be a smidge more rockets because I don't particularly like chainsawing floating cacodemons, but it's waaay better than Lithosphere. It also has a nice focus on tight, enclosed encounters that I think E3 is missing for the most part.

Eris Falling said:

My two pence: I would probably be inclined to keep Lithosphere and put Tarnsman's map in MAP27.

Pinchy said:

I've noticed that in the final room of my map with the rocket, you can see the sky repeat in zdoom and gzdoom when turning left or right against the glass.

Is it possible to use the zmapinfo to adjust the sky to fit here (stretchshortskies) rather than changing the map?

Were not removing map 27, also there are so many sky issues throughout the wad that it would be insane for us to try & fix them all. It's pretty damned sloppy, but people are just going to have to deal with it.

Now comes for the hard choices, I no longer feel that there are any bad maps in Revilution so whatever decision I make is likely going to leave someone disappointed or upset, including myself. With the club reacting negatively to maps like Communications Relay for being very hodgepodge & lacking a cohesiveness due to multiple authors Lithosphere is number one for most likely map to be removed from Revilution. In addition I'm getting some pretty stacked feedback from play testers against Lithosphere as being the weakest of the E3 entries. It's pretty damned annoying for me as I spent a good 36 hours over a 5 day period getting that map to the state that it is in now, but if the majority of people are telling me the map is bad then the map is bad & it needs to go.

Don't worry I get to annoy you as well Dobu :D map 16 is going to be a very divisive map when the club gets around to playing it. Being a guy who bows to popular demand, I'm going to force some changes to be made to this map before final release. The best concepts of this map are the Arch-Vile room & the exit. The whole start room & caves section before the Arch-Vile room are in need of major reworking or outright removal. The problem with this map is that everything is just so cramped causing the player to constantly be bumping into walls, & I'm not just talking about the caves at the start. Almost the entire map suffers from this problem except for the Arch-Vile room, & even in the Arch-Vile room the player doesn't exactly have the freedom to run around at all.

Here is what I want to propose. There are some great concepts in Lithosphere, like the building that collapses into lava that is an optional part of the map & I'm a big fan of the overall lava caves theme. I would like to see the start & mossy caves section of Devil's Den removed & instead replaced with some lava caves where the collapsing building concept is used throughout. I would like to see the the lave caves concept expanded across the entire map as well, I'm sure dobu would love to put one of those protective walls in a pool of lava :) The only rooms that will be cramped for the final version of Devil's Den will be the Red Key Room & exit room.

The area in red need to go. It looks cool, but it's not a fun place to play around in because there is no freedom of movement.


Tarnsmans map will be moved to the map 16 slot Devils Den or Spider Colony will be moved to E3. I know this is giving a lot of work for Dobu to do, but in the end it will only improve peoples reception of Devil's Den & improve the reception of Revilution as a whole.

[Tarnsman]

I did sort of make the map specifically with the E3 sky in mind (the directional lighting cast by the sky's 'sun' for example) and I made it blue like that to break up the flow of the E3 maps that are all aggressively red. Just for your consideration.

Also I was under the impression that Map 26 was a complete placeholder you guys were trying to replace. (So sorry to bump a map if you like it :<)

[Jaws In Space]

Tarnsman said:

Also I was under the impression that Map 26 was a complete placeholder you guys were trying to replace. (So sorry to bump a map if you like it :<)

I was kinda hoping that Ribbiks would show up and bump the map anyways, so it's not the end of the world. Plus with the amount of negative feedback I've got on that map so far it's for the best.

[Tristan]

Spider colony belongs in E2 and tarnsmans map belongs in E3. 27 doesn't even look finished let alone adhering to any of the themes tbh...

[baja blast rd.]

I played map16, finishing with only 1/6 secrets. Was tense but not as scary as I feared. This is a cool map. I think removing the red section would be worse than simply removing the map from the project altogether and using it elsewhere or releasing it as a standalone.

[Tarnsman]

I do agree with Jaws about the caves at the start, but I don't think they should be completely removed, preferably just reworked.

[dobu gabu maru]

Okay, so first:

Eris Falling said:

27 doesn't even look finished let alone adhering to any of the themes tbh...

27 is finished and even if it doesn't adhere to the themes, I think its somewhat random presence is in line with TNT's hodgepodge ordering. Like Jaws brought up, I think the maps most liable for getting cut are all the kyka monsters, so 27 is probably here to stay.

Second:

Jaws In Space said:

Tarnsmans map will be moved to the map 16 slot Devils Den or Spider Colony will be moved to E3.

Tarns' map is 100% an E3 map in difficulty just as Spider Colony is 100% an E2 map; plus like Tarns said, the dam theme provides a nice break in a predominantly metal & blood episode.

And third:

Jaws In Space said:

Don't worry I get to annoy you as well Dobu [...]

I've been mulling this over in my head because there's a lot of different directions to take this map. My gut feeling on this whole matter is a pretty simple one—I don't want to do a lot of additional work. That map took a good solid month of effort to put together so highlighting nearly half of it and saying "something needs to be done about this" doesn't sit well with me. I'm down to make some changes to try and make the cave feel more accomodating, but I'm not going to go through with a reimagining; as neat as your lava cave concept is, that's an idea that should be constructed from the ground up rather than shoe-horned in here (plus the AV cave is already pushing some limits so changing anything there is a big no-no).

So while I'm open to reorganize the dark cave with the blinking lights, my main problem with doing this is that it feels like ineffectually applying a band-aid to a massive cut. IMO the whole map suffers from claustrophobia by design, and simply getting rid of one part doesn't negate that—all of the ancillary tunnels are tight, the exit battle is extremely constrictive & frustrating for first time players, and like you said, the AV room itself discourages free movement. I feel like redesigning the starting caves will only make the map minimally more fun to play, because it's generally not a comfortable map to move around in.

And furthermore, some of my hesitation comes from the fact that I like how that area plays, and have no idea what changes I'd make to it, outside of increasing the size of the tunnels by 33-50%. Like, should I ditch the baron and rev? Give the player more ammo? Reduce the number of tunnels? Brighten the whole thing up? Maybe I'll wait on the club's feedback before making any decisions, but this is one of those instances where it'd be easier to make edits if I agreed with you, but I simply don't.

[Tristan]

Right fine, keep 27. I liked Lithosphere but I think just scrap it completely and put Tarns' map in 26 instead and leave it at that. Good map replaces good map, but please none of this frankensteining and reshuffling nonsense D:

[Gez]

Jaws In Space said:

The area in red need to go. It looks cool, but it's not a fun place to play around in because there is no freedom of movement.
http://i.imgur.com/khiyblr.png

I liked that part; it was an interesting change of pace and the secret puzzle in these spirally parts was fun.

Also: put the removed map in MAP33 slot.

[Jaws In Space]

Updated Startan Complex based on rdwpa suggestions, thoughts?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/194f7ho9bedbit2/Startan%20Complex.wad?dl=1

[baja blast rd.]

^ I like that.

Bug report: map12, the sector tagged 45 isn't attached to any trigger so the five monsters behind it never teleport in.

[baja blast rd.]

Serious problem with map11: the spectres t.126 and t.131 are easily awoken from above (that is, by simple traversal of the spoon-shaped thing with the GA, not anything fancy), where they can block + kill you with infinitely tall bites if you try to get down into the secret. :/

[rhinoduck]

rdwpa said:

Serious problem with map11: the spectres t.126 and t.131 are easily awoken from above (that is, by simple traversal of the spoon-shaped thing with the GA, not anything fancy), where they can block + kill you with infinitely tall bites if you try to get down into the secret. :/

"Infinitely tall bites", lol. Sometimes I wonder how ridiculous must some of the concepts and names we got so accustomed to sound to outsiders. Sorry for being OT, I just couldn't help laughing. The joys of Doom...

[Kurashiki]

I don't check if anyone already mentioned that, but I met 10 stucking zombies at map08's exit while streaming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qjIQ08oGn8
Here's the clip for checking. (I'm sorry for mod play and not English.)

[baja blast rd.]

That one is intentional. :D

[StalkerZHS]

Kurashiki's here? I just gotta say: BEST doom fanart I have EVER seen.

Also I have an update on that music pack: it's half the size now so yay.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1s6jr4fnlhuit2a/TNTR%20dual%20music.zip?dl=1

[Kurashiki]

@rdwpa Oh, I was upset　because a room suddenly became full of unmovable zombies.
I thought that author slipped the mouse... I'm sorry :o

[pcorf]

Had a peek at the beta. It is brilliant for sure.

The final release of TNT Revilution is going to be worth the wait for sure. Fantastic maps, SUPERB original music and remixes of TNT songs! (not the usual Blood, Duke, ROTT music, etc we hear) .... some megawads never make it to the finish line and just lose momentum and die, but I salute all the mappers who contributed to this one.

[pcorf]

StalkerZHS said:

Kurashiki's here? I just gotta say: BEST doom fanart I have EVER seen.

She's a very talented artist for sure!

[Gothic]

I hope we're still allowed to update our maps



List of changes:

-Texture changes on the first area, and minor changes in others.
-The Berserk and Backpack secrets were switched.
-Major chanes to the cave area:
*The Lost Souls were replaced by Spectres.
*A mayor number of monsters plus a Cyberdemon now guard the red key.
*More rocket ammunition.
-The Archvile at the end is no longer stuck.

Download

[Pinchy]

I noticed a few minor mistakes with balancing and visuals so I tweaked them.

V0.98

[cannonball]

I few changes to no mans station
http://www.mediafire.com/file/b1zw5x3zxx9ers2/nmsv5.wad

Tweaked a few areas and added a little extra inter-connectivity. I also added a couple more monsters with an extra AV near the end which chases the player towards the exit which should spice up the final fight. I also fixed a couple of bugs spotted by the DWMC.

[Jaws In Space]

Okay since the DWMC is through E1 I'm going to give a basic rundown on what was brought up by the club, or elsewhere, for maps 1-11. For any of the fixes below, if you don't want to make the changes yourself I can update the map for you. I'd actually prefer this as it would save me the hassle of downloading a whole bunch of updates.

Map 3: sending you a PM as requested

Map 6: Outside of general lack of interest for the map, which there can't be too much done about that, the only issue people had was the Arch-Vile in one of the exterior environments. Personally I think that he's fine, but if anyone else thinks he should be removed or stay as is let me know.

Map 8:
-Flag the Stone6 in the starting area as impassible
-Players can get stuck in sector 154
-replace blue key exit door textures with something else
-Then Demon of the Well made the suggestion to Replace the Demons in the Berserk & Green Armor rooms at the start with barrels & troopers, I'll let you decide on whether to do that or not

Map 10: I'm fine with most of the changes, but I don't want the Cyberdemon appearing in E1 & I do not like having to wait for those pillars to go down in the caves. Please remove these entirely.

Map 11: In addition to whatever updates you may be making based on the reviews thus far, can you add several Multiplayer Rad Suits for those playing coop.