TNT Revilution: Final release now on ID Games!

[Pure Hellspawn]

Jaws In Space said:

TNT REVILUTION BETA

Here it is guys. After nearly 7 and a half years of development, 4 project leaders, blood, sweat, & tears. I present to you the first of 2 TNT sequels ready for beta testing. IWAD is Doom 2, vanilla compatible. Let us know what you think here, or you can play along with the Doomworld Megawad Club.

*Map 30 will not be included until final release.

just curious, why is there no map 30?

[mrthejoshmon]

Pure Hellspawn said:

just curious, why is there no map 30?

Probably making it epic as fuck.

-

I have been waiting very, very long for this and I'm gonna grab this and smash through it when I have time.

[Tristan]

I had concerns when I dropped project lead. Occasionally looking in, I see I had nothing to worry about, Jaws has done an excellent job of making sure the original themes for the project were preserved. Kyka's best work is still in even if we booted more of it (and I bet TNT2 has zero Kyka stuff now they replaced maps like a million times :P). MAP32 doesn't sit well with me, and that's actually my fault really, but on the whole, I really like what I'm seeing.
Of course I've played some maps already, including some of the newer ones added after my tenure as leader, but I'm very excited to play the rest of the WAD in DWMC and TNS.

So all in all, Jaws, congratulations on the release, and thank you.
Oh and special mention to dobu, haven't played any of your other work on this project aside from 12, but seeing that again in Tarnsman's stream last night reminded me how great a job you did there - as I said before, that's a special map to me :P

Fanboy out o/

[dobu gabu maru]

Hey Jaws, sorry if I'm overstepping my bounds, but I did some hotfixes to the beta and have uploaded it here. If you want to download it and host it on dropbox that's cool with me. I removed all the visual mode things, fixed over 100 missing textures on MAP26, and put the ZZZ faces back in since Malignata needs them. Might speed through the wad later to ensure all triggers work for vanilla too

Pure Hellspawn said:

just curious, why is there no map 30?

1) Not finished quite yet, & 2) To keep it a surprise ;)

[Tarnsman]

Eris Falling said:

(and I bet TNT2 has zero Kyka stuff now they replaced maps like a million times :P)

Nah it still has Kyka work.

[Steve D]

Congrats, Jaws. Great job bringing this project over the finish line. And not just finished, but it's obviously going to be a good CP megawad. Special shout-out to Dobu for all the extra work he did on so many maps. After watching the Tarns stream post-facto, I still wish mine had gotten the Dobu treatment, because you seriously improved some of the maps I'd already played. Ah, maybe someday. ;)

Edit: Special thanks to Jaws for changing the CWILVs from STEVED to STEVE D. I should remember to mention that every time I join a CP. :D

[Veinen]

Playing with glboom+ 2.5.1.3: I can't seem to finish map05 on -complevel 2 as the action on linedef 736 doesn't work as intended. Also texture on linedef 317 looks misaligned, no?

[dobu gabu maru]

Well shit I thought stuff like this might pop up. I'll be streaming a brief -nomonsters runthrough in choco doom to look for any compatibility issues if anyone wants to chat.

[baja blast rd.]

If I play some maps I might just comment in this thread too, because the DWMC schedule bores me when I'm actually into a wad, tbh. One map a day, psst.

map32: I went in expecting to like this one because it has a lot of monsters and stuff, but it feels like a misfire. I thought it was going to be a carefree run and gun romp, but it wasn't really, for a few reasons:

- Even with finding all the secrets, ammo gets kind of tight unless you make things infight. There were countless times where I thought, "ooh this group of monsters would be fun to blow up with rockets or a BFG shot" but I either didn't have that ammo or decided to save it for an actual threat.

- There are a number of monsters that aren't fun to kill and mostly just slow down the pace (the ever common ledge snipers in the snowy areas, the pit spectres around the red key that don't really need to exit).

- The ubiquitous barrels are a constant nuisance, deeper into the map. Keeping them around while fighting is risky (meaning wasting time clearing out barrels in every other room), especially with all the hitscanners around, and they don't actually help you kill monsters too well because they are in ones scattered around the room, and lots of monsters are mid-tiers, and that would be kind of slow. I think clustering barrels in threes and fours is a lot better in this sort of map, which addresses both issues.

- There were numerous spots with entrenchments of hitscanners and snipers, making it a really good idea to camp. I found the map very far from hard, but I quickly realized that playing at a desirably fast pace would probably be unpleasant. A lot of this is related to relatively low amount of cells, too; there aren't enough to subsidize aggressive sweeps with the plasma rifle if you want to use the BFG against groups of mid-tiers.

[Jaws In Space]

Another Tarnsman stream, this time maps 18-24 are covered. Check it out here for possible feedback wile the video is still around. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/118597401


OP has been updated with Dobu Gabu Marus hot fix.

[Dime]

twitch.tv/kingdime

Going to check out TNT revilution!

[Gez]

Typo in first intermission text screen: "lacation" instead of "location"
Typo in CWILV08: "STARTN COMPLEX" instead of "STARTAN COMPLEX"
Missing trigger in MAP12: nothing opens tag 45 to free up to three imps and two zombies in the area where the player returns to the base after the videotrip to Hell.

[Tarnsman]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1fh1m657vch536i/Tarns-TNTR-Map26.wad?dl=0

Breezeep agreed to make a TNT2 map if I made a Map 26 for this in a day. So I did. Still rough. Do what you want with it Jaws.

Map Name: The Forgotten Visage of a Time Long Past Sitting Where The Water Meets The Lands of Hell (Alfonzo and The Once-Ler Open a Small Business Together)

[Gez]

MAP15: the westernmost archvile cell (sectors #54 & #458, tag 21) is never triggered.
The switch on line #1308 (23: S1 Floor lower to lowest adjacent) has tag 0. Was it replaced with the walkover lines around the teleporter pad in the big nukage lake (sectors #216 & #325)?
Line #1303 has an SR action, but it should be an S1 action since hitting it repeatedly has no further effect.

[valkiriforce]

I noticed my MAP31 has a couple small errors in it: lines 4308 and 4065 should both be checked with action 60, "SR Floor Lower To Lowest Floor" as line 3994 conflicts with the sector 476, being a WR line action thus making other co-op players get stuck in that battle arena.

[Memfis]

Also the sky is glitching on the sides of the pyramids at the start.

[Steve D]

Gez said:

MAP15: the westernmost archvile cell (sectors #54 & #458, tag 21) is never triggered.
The switch on line #1308 (23: S1 Floor lower to lowest adjacent) has tag 0. Was it replaced with the walkover lines around the teleporter pad in the big nukage lake (sectors #216 & #325)?
Line #1303 has an SR action, but it should be an S1 action since hitting it repeatedly has no further effect.

Thanks, Gez!

The Archvile cell was a trap sprung when you grabbed the red key. We eliminated the red key and thus the triggering walkover lines on the red key platform. I had forgotten by then that grabbing the key sprung a trap, so probably these monsters and their teleport closets should be eliminated.

The switch on line 1308 is my brain fart. That switch once lowered barriers around the nukage pit, which have since been eliminated. I got rid of the switch texture and rebuilt that little techwall, but I forgot to remove the switch action from the linedef. D'oh! As for the Tag 37 lines at Sector 216, they still open up the secret Plasma Gun container.

Line 1303. You're right! We'll correct that. At least it's an original mistake. ;)

Thanks again for finding these errors. I'll ask Jaws how he wants to handle this, since he might have a more advanced beta than I do, or might have seen your post and fixed it already.

[hawkwind]

map 01 ...

a) MIDBRS1A at lines 1417 and 1648 bleeds into the floor in software ports. One easy fix is to give sector 180 a brightness of 127.

b) Line 834 could have been flagged secret.

c) Line 822 could have been flagged secret and sector 3 should have been flagged secret, since it leads to the "secret" pickup at sector 151.

d) T380 ( hanging one legged body ) in some software ports bleeds into the ceiling, and will appear to "slide around" when looking at it when the player is moving. Also with some opengl ports renders half into the ceiling. Is this sprite used in other levels ? Can be fixed via DeHacked.

map 02 ...

a) BUG - switch texture on line 1454 does not animate . Remove upper and lower textures to fix.

b) T84 and T307 has their heads rendering into the ceiling in opengl ports.

map 03 ...

a) Line 486 wrong X offset. Crate.

b) T60 renders into the crate.

c) The switch texture on line 729 does not animate due to the fact that D1 is used. Linetype 135 could be used instead.

d) Line 3734 could be flagged secret.

map 04 ...

a) I thought it a bit strange that line 312 has GBRAYP3 whereas line 336 has GBRAYP2.

b) Lines 1078, 2141, 2164 could be flagged secret.

c) T17 stuck in T413

map 06 ...

a) Lines 1919, 775, 351, 1674, 2385, 1726, 1670, 1690, 1668, 1400, 2040, 1994, 915, 914, 913, 2153 could be flagged secret.

b) Could the upper unpeg flag be removed from line 351 ?Note effect when sector 72 rises.

c) Lines 1864, 1865, 2041, 272, 2039 could be flagged hidden.

[40oz]

I played up to MAP17, Devils Den (I think that's the mapnumber)

I got confused after I raised the third archvile wall. The constant fire in my face made it difficult to figure out where to look to go next, and it was late at night and I got tired of dying a lot.

After playing this much of it, I can see why my map wasn't very fitting for the project. It seems people remember much more rusty metal and red lighting than I do. It seems like a new take on what the evolution of what TNT Evilution is. Its not very faithful in places but I do like it.

I think the project suffers in places, especially towards the beginning with the usual mandatory megawad filler maps. I'm sure with a project that took this long to develop, it must have been a real struggle to keep people motivated to make their maps as strong as some others.

One thing that TNT revilution definitely gets right is the hitscan hell aspect of it. Good lord. You get shot a fucking lot!

The ones Jaws in Space made and the ones Kyka worked on especially were very cool. And if anyone is on the fence about trying this, definitely try it for MAP12, at least. Holy shit, was that map awesome! Very vivid "show; dont tell" storytelling in that map. Im hopeful there are more maps like that elsewhere in the project.

Its saddening that Kyka and Whoo aren't here to see the release of this. Kyka especially is a pretty remarkable mapper and im very pleased to play his stuff.

I'm halfway through the wad and I think it suffers a pretty rough start (MAP01 was good though) but its starting to pick up now that were getting into the magical phenenomena section of the megawad, so I'm optimistic that its going to get even better.

[Chris Hansen]

Congrats on the beta release! Doom isn't a priority of mine at the moment, but I'm still following this project on the sideline, so if there are any changes that need to made to my level then I can find the time for it. Just let me know in a PM.

[AD_79]

40oz said:

I think the project suffers in places, especially towards the beginning with the usual mandatory megawad filler maps. I'm sure with a project that took this long to develop, it must have been a real struggle to keep people motivated to make their maps as strong as some others.

Here's my thoughts on the matter: It's impossible to make every map stand out in a project like this. If each individual map was equally memorable on its own, sure you'd have a bunch of cool maps, but when put together, one after another? It would still be hard for each one to stand out in my mind.

You need those shorter, more standard, less memorable maps (especially early on) to be there to make the ones that do have strong concepts going for them stand out more. This is why pretty much every megawad ever does this. And hey, there's nothing wrong with making a """"""filler"""""" map. It just needs to be fun, and most of the time they are!

[Jaws In Space]

Hey Steve, just want to give you a few notes on the maps you are working on after watching a few streams. The end of map 4 on HMP is way too difficult, it's by far and away the most difficult encounter from maps 1-13. On map 15 almost everyone is finding the secret exit before the normal exit. Might be simple enough to just swap the actions around, but I'll leave that up to you to decide.

[dobu gabu maru]

Jaws In Space said:

The end of map 4 on HMP is way too difficult, it's by far and away the most difficult encounter from maps 1-13.

lol I just finished writing about this. Also I saw you mention changing the fake exit door on MAP08 in mouldy's stream Jaws--will do.

[Tarnsman]

Hey Jaws I need to know if you want that map or not, otherwise I'm going to stick it into TNT2.

[dobu gabu maru]

I played Tarns' map and I really like it--I feel there should be a smidge more rockets because I don't particularly like chainsawing floating cacodemons, but it's waaay better than Lithosphere. It also has a nice focus on tight, enclosed encounters that I think E3 is missing for the most part.

[Tarnsman]

Added more rockets for you.

[Gez]

More typos in C3TEXT: RETURN RO ITS POINT and TGE DEMONS HAVE USED.

[WH-Wilou84]

I've played the third beta over the last couple days ( with ZDoom on UV ), and I'm at map 28, "Across the Blood Sea".
So far I'm having a great time with this wad, and there's a lot of good stuff in there. Some authors were unknown to me, like SFoZ911, SteveD, Eradrop and gaspe, and their work is remarkable. Among the others, dobu, cannonball and tourniquet never disappoint.

On the other hand, some maps felt a bit weak - particularly after the 01 to 03 cluster which is a rock-solid introduction, but as said before that's a standard issue with community projects - not to mention this one's a TNT Evilution tribute ( why the deuce doesn't it run with TNT.wad instead though ? ).

The disparity in author styles also helps in recreating that TNT feel.
Valkiriforce's map 24, with all its switches and hidden lifts and general valkiri sector trickery, as well as Pinchy's map 27 with its large-scale rooms and theme variety, really succeed on that regard.

The OST is also quite a treat :)
Nods to the classic TNT tunes are all very well done. Props to the composers.

Here's a potential bug for co-op players on map 28, in case it hasn't been reported yet : if a player crosses lines 228, 229 and 3099 and is then killed by the Hell Knight, there's no way back in this room and thus linedef 1777 can't be activated. If this happens, there will be HOMs all over the place since sector 449's floor will be at the highest level.
Also, while we're on the topic of linedef 1777 - please don't put items / ammo right in front of mandatory switches. Fortunately I could activate the switch without grabbing the second Cell pack, but come on.

So yeah, a great wad so far, certainly worth the 7+ year dev time :)
Thanks to Jaws In Space and team.
I'll complete the few remaining maps later and I'm curious to see what you guys have in mind for map 30.

[Steve D]

Jaws In Space said:

Hey Steve, just want to give you a few notes on the maps you are working on after watching a few streams. The end of map 4 on HMP is way too difficult, it's by far and away the most difficult encounter from maps 1-13. On map 15 almost everyone is finding the secret exit before the normal exit. Might be simple enough to just swap the actions around, but I'll leave that up to you to decide.

I honestly thought that fight was too easy on UV since it's nerfed by infighting, but I see some things that can be changed on HMP -- perhaps turning the last 2 PEs into Cacos, or maybe eliminating 1 of the blood Archies and putting it in the exit, or leaving it out completely. There's no Archies on HNTR, so I suppose I wouldn't be too butthurt if there's only 1 on HMP. ;)

Not a bad idea to switch the exits around on Map15. The non-secret exit is of course by far the most dramatic, since you have to fight your way there, whereas the secret exit is kind of wimpy. It's funny that people are finding the secret exit since that's just a closed door, whereas the normal exit has a highly visible exit sign in front of it, which is one of the first things you see in the map. However, the map is so big and non-linear that I reckon it's easy to forget about that sign as you puzzle out your pathways.

Do you want that change put in before the DWMC gets to Map15, or between the end of the beta and the final release?

Which reminds me, on Map04 I plan on using my new knowledge of CRL to put lighting detail back in, and maybe structural detail, so it looks a bit better. I plan to finish that after the beta phase, rather than immediately, if that's alright. Right now I'm busy playing the maps. ;)

[cannonball]

Tarnsman said:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1fh1m657vch536i/Tarns-TNTR-Map26.wad?dl=0

Breezeep agreed to make a TNT2 map if I made a Map 26 for this in a day. So I did. Still rough. Do what you want with it Jaws.

Map Name: The Forgotten Visage of a Time Long Past Sitting Where The Water Meets The Lands of Hell (Alfonzo and The Once-Ler Open a Small Business Together)

Of course Jaws will have the final say here, but I will certainly give this one a thumbs up, difficult and very fun to play. Lithosphere the current map 26 is a bit of a slow burner whilst this one is on you from the start with tonnes of great traps and well positioned monsters.
Might have to find a shorter map name though :P