Post Your Opinions About Doom (Whether Controversial or Not)

[Magnusblitz]

ABRACADABRA said:

final bosses usually done in a last minute, when you don't have time to do it properly. many games suffers from this

I still think the king example of this is id's own RAGE - in that they basically forgot to actually make a final boss, and instead it's just a final battle against a bunch of low-level troops that feels like the appetizer to the boss rather than the end fight itself.

[Fonze]

Omg yes, I was so confused when the game ended. Never mind that disc 1 was at least 3 times as large as disc 2... The whole thing made the ending just not feel real, if that makes sense when talking about a video game.

[Maes]

Doom is actually a symbolism for class warfare, in particular Communism vs Capitalism. Doomguy represents the power of the Free Market, of Personal Enterprise and Initiative: he's faster, smarter, more mobile and more versatile than the monsters, which rely on a rigid set of predictable rules, sheer numbers and brute strength, symbolizing the inefficient Communist bureaucracy and lack of praise for individual achievement or merit.

[DoomzRules]

Maes said:

Doom is actually a symbolism for class warfare, in particular Communism vs Capitalism. Doomguy represents the power of the Free Market, of Personal Enterprise and Initiative: he's faster, smarter, more mobile and more versatile than the monsters, which rely on a rigid set of predictable rules, sheer numbers and brute strength, symbolizing the inefficient Communist bureaucracy and lack of praise for individual achievement or merit.

What about if it's the other way around?

What if Doom is actually a symbolism for class warfare, in particular Capitalism vs Communism. Doomguy represents the power of the Working-Class, of Wealth Redistribution and Morals: he's faster, smarter, more mobile and more versatile than the monsters, which rely on a rigid set of predictable rules, sheer numbers and brute strength, symbolizing the inefficient Capitalist corporatist fascist bureaucracy and lack of praise for individual achievement or merit.

[RaphaelMode]

DoomzRules said:

What about if it's the other way around?

What if Doom is actually a symbolism for class warfare, in particular Capitalism vs Communism. Doomguy represents the power of the Working-Class, of Wealth Redistribution and Morals: he's faster, smarter, more mobile and more versatile than the monsters, which rely on a rigid set of predictable rules, sheer numbers and brute strength, symbolizing the inefficient Capitalist corporatist fascist bureaucracy and lack of praise for individual achievement or merit.

This post is the critical opposite of trying too hard. And then DoomzRules was a Bitterpainful scooterzombie.

[DoomzRules]

RaphaelMode said:

This post is the critical opposite of trying too hard. And then DoomzRules was a Bitterpainful scooterzombie.

LOLZ

That was the point though, it was supposed to be an inverse post. =3

I prefer Sweet Painless Motorcycle Demon.

Thanks though! =)

[Jaxxoon R]

I'm siding with RaphaelMode on this one, if only because he didn't use "lolz."

[jazzmaster9]

There needs to be more ZDoom community projects.

The community likes to stereotype ZDoom maps as over detailed and gameplay less products, but thats because the mappers who are usually well versed in mapping dont bother with the format due to said stereotypes.


Also, Im annoyed at the "you only used one *insert zdoom feature*, shouldnt you just make this Boom instead?"

[Varis Alpha]

i don't recall seeing a lot of hate against ZDoom projects, and the Cacowards of the years have always had at least one ZDoom project on the list of awards. rather, i think the problem is there just isn't enough ZDoom projects that focuses on creating levels and whatnot. most of the current ZDoom mods are gameplay mods with no levels attached to them, with things like DoomRL Arsenal, Demonsteele, Brutal Doom (though that one has a level pack now it seems) etc.

[Angry Saint]

I agree with both Doomhuntress and jazzmaster9.

Zdoom features can add so much to Doom gameplay and design, I always wondere why few people maps for it.

[baja blast rd.]

jazzmaster9 said:

There needs to be more ZDoom community projects.

The community likes to stereotype ZDoom maps as over detailed and gameplay less products, but thats because the mappers who are usually well versed in mapping dont bother with the format due to said stereotypes.


Also, Im annoyed at the "you only used one *insert zdoom feature*, shouldnt you just make this Boom instead?"

The biggest problem is ZDoom's demo compat. It also changes the gameplay in ways that might turn off Vanilla/PrBoom/etc. players.

Anyway, that community project is going to end up 80% full of bad maps with obtrusive scripts and tacky 3D floors in simple box-hallway-box layouts with patches of microdetail here and there. Unless you have very strict quality control. Like, say upfront that you're going to reject any maps that aren't up to snuff and be willing to accept 3-5 out of 30 submissions or something as people throw tomatoes at you and call you a Hitler-fucking Hitler or whatever.

It's not like Vanilla/Boom community projects can't or don't end up being terrible, but (G)ZDoom is just harder to map well for, and there are so many more potential sources of tackiness, so the avg. project will surely be worse in the absence of above-and-beyond quality control. Even then, there are going to be more variables -- visual features like slopes + 3D floors, exactly how scripts are used in the context of a level -- so there are more ways for even a set of good maps to clash with one another.

Wrt that last sentence, it depends on what single ZDoom feature you use. If it's DECORATE with some new monsters, okay that's fine. But if you just want to use a few decorative 3D floors here and there or one script in an otherwise Boomy level, then you're sacrificing 2/3rds+ of your potential audience for something that hardly matters gameplay-wise. It's not like you can't stage pretty complex encounters with Boom voodoo dolls or use mid-texture structures to create "3D" architecture here and there.

That said, I'd be interested in seeing such a community project happen, especially if the DECORATE work that creates additional monsters as good as the rev/manc/PE/archvile/chaingunner (that aren't just copies w slight variations ofc).

[Spectre01]

I was really impressed with the urban levels in the BD Starter Pack and the fact that the megawad was created with jumping and crouching as core mechanics. It would be really nice to see more big projects made for GZDoom/Zandronum. For some reason I can't get GLBoom+ to feel right. Something about the movement and responsiveness just feels off to me.

[jazzmaster9]

rdwpa said:

it depends on what single ZDoom feature you use. If it's DECORATE with some new monsters, okay that's fine. But if you just want to use a few decorative 3D floors here and there or one script in an otherwise Boomy level, then you're sacrificing 2/3rds+ of your potential audience for something that hardly matters gameplay-wise. It's not like you can't stage pretty complex encounters with Boom voodoo dolls or use mid-texture structures to create "3D" architecture here and there.

if the level looks Boomy is really besides the point.
every mapper has a vision of what his maps are like. if he wants to use 1 Zdoom feature, if the mapper is getting what he wants from his maps, then I think its fine.
but if the features is the only thing holding the map together (i.e. if the gameplay is suffering because of said zdoomisms) then not using them is the best advise.

with that said I'm not oppose to Vanilla tricks since they do add to the experience despite the limitations.

[DoomzRules]

I prefer Doom 1 to Doom 2.

Let me clarify why, I feel as if Doom 1 was carefully crafted with every single enemy placement though out, and the atmosphere was solid, building up slowly until you got to Hell itself.

Doom 2 on the other hand, was a mess (maybe because of the lack of an episode structure? IDK), and there were so many moments where there was a crap-ton of enemies and it kinda felt like slaughter-lite at times.

Which by the way I'm not very fond of.

I prefer more tactical thought-out map design; or if you are going to have a theme at least stick to it.

Yeah Scythe 2 is guilty of having a lot of enemies, but the Gothic Diabloesque style and awesome levels more than make up for it! I still prefer Scythe 2 and Doom 1 to Doom 2. =3

(At least in terms of map design.)

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Liking Doom 2 seems like the controversial opinion not Doom1\plutonia though. At least what this thread and others show.

[DoomzRules]

Pegg said:

Liking Doom 2 seems like the controversial opinion not Doom1\plutonia though. At least what this thread and others show.

Don't get me wrong I like Doom 2, I just feel atmospherically Doom 1 is superior. Otherwise, I like Doom 2. It's just atmosphere-wise and thematically it's all over the place.

Doom 1 built itself up. Which is what I enjoy a lot about Doom 1.

Ironically I usually start up every single mod on Doom 2, but I haven't started any on Doom 1. =P

[june gloom]

Doomhuntress said:

i don't recall seeing a lot of hate against ZDoom projects

I still remember the collective meltdown over KDIZD though... :/

[Face23785]

I think people who complain about revanants are pussies. I consider myself a mediocre player and I've never felt it was an unfair monster. People who talk like revs ruin maps must really suck at games.

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Revenants are ok. Just the way random damage works makes their damage extremely irritating to some. Getting killed by 2 projectiles then winning next attempt because they did 40 combined isn't funny.

[Spectre01]

Random damage in an FPS is stupid to begin with. I have no idea what id were smoking when they thought up the BFG mechanic with the plasma ball doing 100-800. Would be nice if modern source ports had a random damage on/off option.

[Yousuf Anik]

Pegg said:

Revenants are ok. Just the way random damage works makes their damage extremely irritating to some. Getting killed by 2 projectiles then winning next attempt because they did 40 combined isn't funny.

revenants are cool, they can fry your ass in no time ;D

[Yousuf Anik]

rileymartin said:

I have no idea what id were smoking when they thought up the BFG mechanic with the plasma ball doing 100-800.

no doubt id were in drugs

[Koko Ricky]

There's a pretty hilarious of a 20-something John Romero looking blazed as fuck so I'm not surprised.

[MegaSphere]

I just realised Doom promotes toxic masculinity, tries to scare atheists with hell and is incredibly sexist as it features no female characters.

[gaspe]

Oh please, at least try harder with these poor trolling attempts.

[MegaSphere]

gaspe said:

Oh please, at least try harder with these poor trolling attempts.

''If the truth is uncomfortable then it must trolling'' this is exactly why people think school shootings and ISIS are good things population really needs some culling.

[40oz]

MegaSphere said:

the truth

MegaSphere said:

people think

[DoomzRules]

GoatLord said:

There's a pretty hilarious of a 20-something John Romero looking blazed as fuck so I'm not surprised.

It wouldn't surprise me if id Software did smoke some weed and try out some LSD. I mean all the great tech companies did dabble in psychedelics.... Apple, id Software, Nintendo (that one is kind of obvious... it sure as hell explains a lot of what made up Pikmin....), and Sony (because well, I'm sure they also did some weed too.)

I mean when I start up my game company (which I can hopefully start up soon, after I graduate high school and graduate college, still in 10th grade at the moment), then I can be a game designer and well... I'll probably start it up in Colorado so I can have access to legal weed. *chuckles*

Anyway, I feel like the PSX Final Doom is better than the PC Final Doom, as it cuts it down to the essential maps.

[Azuruish]

DoomzRules said:

It wouldn't surprise me if id Software did smoke some weed and try out some LSD.

(''--‿‿--) Are you sure that necessary to use drugs for creating such ideas? I can create some freakin stuff without this.
As i know Id Software were inspired by films like 'Evil Dead 2' and 'Alien'. There are no influence of drugs.
What can i say about randomness that it's testing you luckiness. You know, it's shocking when you have 100% health and 100% green armor, you gets direct rocket hit and still alive after this.

[DoomzRules]

Azuruish said:

(''--‿‿--) Are you sure that necessary to use drugs for creating such ideas? I can create some freakin stuff without this.
As i know Id Software were inspired by films like 'Evil Dead 2' and 'Alien'. There are no influence of drugs.
What can i say about randomness that it's testing you luckiness. You know, it's shocking when you have 100% health and 100% green armor, you gets direct rocket hit and still alive after this.

Yeah that's true. It's not necessary, but it does enhance the creative process.

Actually id Software was inspired by The Thing (1980 something movie), Aliens, Evil Dead II, Army of Darkness, Alien, Dungeons and Dragons Advanced 2nd Edition, heavy metal music, and other stuff! =D