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Salahmander2

If Doom monsters were to have secondary attacks...

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I'd make the Pain Elemental bite the player at close range.

rdwpa said:

Baron of Hell

"Very very nice": The baron dons an Elvis Presley suit and some rad sideburns and starts dancing. Music changes obv. Immediately kills the player.

Even in God Mode? :P

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Pain Elemental

"Slapfight": Rapidfire melee attack that does 1x8 damage.

Cyberdemon

"Kick": Spawns a soccerball and kicks it. It doesn't do any damage, but soccer commentators are spawned and shout "GOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAL" incessantly as a global sound, eventually prompting the player to willingly seek out a rocket and die.

Baron of Hell

"Very very nice": The baron dons an Elvis Presley suit and some rad sideburns and starts dancing. Music changes obv. Immediately kills the player.

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I'd like all the monsters to have a close range melee attack. It's feels odd that the pain elemental doesn't bite you or the cyberdemon chooses not to scratch you in favor blowing himself up.

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I'm absolutely fine with the fact that every monster has no more than one melee attack and no more than one ranged attack - but like others said, I agree that monsters with ranged attack who lack melee attack would benefit from getting the melee attack added. Either biting (Zombies), punching (Mancubus), stomping (Cyberdemon, Spider Mastermind), kicking (Arachnotron), or some close-range supernatural attack (Archvile, Pain Elemental).

Also, when a monster's melee attack failed because the player had stepped back, but then he immediately stepped forward again so that the monster would try to melee him again, the monster should decide to attack him by its ranged attack this time instead. Not that bottlenecking as a gameplay tactic isn't fun, but it's stupid when it can be abused too much and too easily.

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The Revenant should have two attacks.

two rockets in a space of 250ms that DO NOT TRACK

and a "brace and shoot" mode where the rocket tracks (as it is now).

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Revenant, goes berserk when it's health is 25% or lower, faster, fires rockets faster and always homing, also his punches would deal more dmg, making close-range combat even more dangerous.

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I always thought it would be cool to see the Pain Elemental have an attack outside of his usual Lost Soul spitting. Having him charge and then bite you would be awesome and prevent him from being totally useless up close.

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I'm gonna go ahead and be that BD fanboy and say it includes some interesting secondary attacks to some monsters.

The Cyberdemon Stomps you can close range
The Mancubus shoots a flame thrower at close range
I think the Spidermastermind has a cheap instant kill when walking on you
Sadly I believe the Pain Elemental has nothing new going on, I agree it could use a bite

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It would be cool if Barons and Hellknights could charge and tackle you if they were close enough. That way they would be more than just a beefed up imp.

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Zombiemen could smack you with their weapons.
Demons could have a leap attack to catch players that just go backwards.
Noble punching could leave you stunned, they have beefy arms.
Pain Elementals could fist your face, they have arms for a reason.
Cacodemons could do Lost Soul charge if they are too far.
Cyberdemons need a melee.
Revenant and Mastermind could have a close range damaging roar.
Archvile could have a forwarding fire pillar attack.
Mancubus could eat you, or just lunge at you with their fat.

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Technician said:

I'd like all the monsters to have a close range melee attack. It's feels odd that the pain elemental doesn't bite you or the cyberdemon chooses not to scratch you in favor blowing himself up.

DRLA rectifies that by giving the PE a nasty bite if you decide to "block" its spawn, and the Cyberdemon giving you a nasty stomp that can easily catch you off guard and gib you.

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I'd give the Vile the ability to teleport monsters that it resurrects to your location if it can see you.

Have arachnotrons be able to put up deflective shields and your attacks destroy shields before doing health damage.

Pain elementals do 'area of effect' damage when exploding and the floor where they died becomes coated in crap that is hurtful to walk on for a short period of time.

Imps can throw a faster fireball after 4 or 5 normal balls.

Cyberdemons can clench their arse cheeks causing a seismic tremor that damages anything in it's wake. Ok maybe not that. Cyberdemons can force choke you... no wait. Cyberdemons can throw out spider mines that stick to architecture or something.

J.B.R said:

Revenant, goes berserk when it's health is 25% or lower, faster, fires rockets faster and always homing, also his punches would deal more dmg, making close-range combat even more dangerous.


and no pain chance at 25% or lower.

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I'd like to see Archvilles doing their hands in the air routine and the nearest body getting drag towards them and resurrected!

Or maybe when they do it the nearest corpse explodes into gibs and a Lost Soul comes out of it.

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scifista42 said:

Also, when a monster's melee attack failed because the player had stepped back, but then he immediately stepped forward again so that the monster would try to melee him again, the monster should decide to attack him by its ranged attack this time instead. Not that bottlenecking as a gameplay tactic isn't fun, but it's stupid when it can be abused too much and too easily.

afaik this is the case only with revenants, since every other monster decide to shoot or scratch by range and only in the last moment. So, if baron raises his arm to punch you and you stepped back he will throw a fireball at you

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the Lost Soul should have a random chance to silently teleport into either the same sector or one adjacent to the one Doomguy's in, if there's room and at the maximum height possible. That'll teach you just to zip on by merely because I'm not worth a kill =P

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ABRACADABRA said:

afaik this is the case only with revenants,

Correct. I used generalization because I also meant to apply this principle to those purely hypothetical melee attacks added to Doom monsters who don't have them.

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VGA said:

Or maybe when they do it the nearest corpse explodes into gibs and a Lost Soul comes out of it.

Wasn't this his original function?

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Almost every monster should have a melee attack. E.g. Zombies biting or using the butt of their rifles/shotguns, Mancs clobbering with their arms, Arachnotrons and SMs kicking with their robotic legs, PE biting or punching up close, Cyberdemons stomping or clobbering with their RL etc. Those could have been part of the original game with relatively little extra effort.

Now, adding third and fourth alternate attacks, e.g. giving Cyberdemons, Barons and HKs some sort of powerful backwards "mule kick", activated only in retaliation for being struck from behind would be interesting, but the work required is more like Brutal Doom material.

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Not really a secondary attack but, getting near the cyber, the spider and the arachnotron could automatically damage you each time they stomp without it being an attack but just the regular walk-standing stomping cycle most monsters have.

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I think the Baron needs a slow attack in which he releases something like multiple homing fireballs or multiple regular fireballs. To make him more deadly as a sub-boss monster.

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^ I wouldn't think of him as "based on cacos" in this regard. They invented a new behavior for him from scratch and apparently coded it from scratch as well. Pain Elemental's melee attack was probably not removed on purpose as much as it was never included at all because it didn't seem needed or because they forgot about it.

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Technician said:

the cyberdemon chooses not to scratch you in favor blowing himself up.

Well they fixed that in SNES Doom but meh.

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How did they "fix" that? If you mean something along the lines that in SNES Doom he still shoots you up close but the explosions don't deal any damage to him, that's how it always was since the original Doom 1. Or does he really not spawn a rocket and instead deal melee damage up close in SNES?

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I thought I remember reading somewhere that it had a melee damage dealing attack if you got close.

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