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Jeffo2448

Former sergeants/Zombiemen

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It seems like the shotgunners, zombiemen, and chain gunners aren't really being incorporated into the game as much as I thought. There were hoards of them in the originals and now they seem sorta like filler material in the new Doom. Chaingunners were always a challenge, especially in numbers. I hope they use these guys effectively in the new game

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I imagine they don't really want hitscan fodder, because they're putting a lot of emphasis on being able to avoid all damage with movement and hitscans that aren't incredibly telegraphed doesn't really fit that.

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I hope they didn't reveal every single monster at this point, and that there is an enemy based on the chaingun commando from Doom 3.

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To be fair, the original zombiemen were effectively the Goombas of the original Doom, often killed in hordes on Ultra-Violence with a Chaingun or Shotgun blasts. The Shotgunners and Chaingunners were a real terror if they got the opportunity, but they were only slightly more endurant at best. Here it seems like alongside the Imp, these guys are now fight-populating means to quickly kill for health/supply drops, or to serve as extra damaging means in terms of the Engineers who are walking bombs. There's also the Shield Shotgunners and those dudes with the energy guns to note, as well as the Hell Razers who fire laser streams but with a laser sight as pre-warning. They might as well be "Possessed" super variants.

I don't mind the game making changes to the dichotomy of the enemy forces, but I do admit that it's weird seeing zombies that blur the line between Doom 3's shamblers and Z-Sec. Not to mention what looks like no hitscan at all, except maybe for the Shotgunners.

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It kinda looks like:

Zombieman turned into the guy shooting red bolts
Shotgunner turned into the guy with the blue shield and shotgun
Heavy weapon dude turned into the Hell Razer, shooting the red energy beam

at least kinda (from easiest to hardest to fight against)

I am unsure about the dozens of unarmed zombies trodding around (Unwilling/Possessed). They seem like true filler material to me.

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tuo said:

Shotgunner turned into the guy with the blue shield and shotgun

How can you tell ? Doom 3 also had a shielded guy and at same time there were shotgun zombies there.

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DMGUYDZ64 said:

How can you tell ? Doom 3 also had a shielded guy and at same time there were shotgun zombies there.


Because it seems like there are only three armed zombies, and he is the only one wielding a shotgun. I haven't seen one in the trailers/streams without the shield yet.

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DMGUYDZ64 said:

How can you tell ? Doom 3 also had a shielded guy and at same time there were shotgun zombies there.

The shielded Z-Sec only had pistols and were very sparse (albeit mostly relegated to Delta Labs). Considering we've not seen any shotgunners outside of these shielders, it's a safe assumption to make that they're the old-school Shotgunner equivalent.

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Tetzlaff said:

I hope they didn't reveal every single monster at this point, and that there is an enemy based on the chaingun commando from Doom 3.


Hopefully Wraiths, "Cyberbaron" and "Cyber Knight" Variants, Arachnotrons, and Pain Elementals make they're way in Doom 2016.

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At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!

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XLightningStormL said:

Hopefully Wraiths, "Cyberbaron" and "Cyber Knight" Variants, Arachnotrons, and Pain Elementals make they're way in Doom 2016.


Yeah, Wraiths could work very well in this game as stealth monster if they would increase the speed of the cloak/uncloak effect.

id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!


I think they wanted to create something like the FPS version of a bullet hell shooter. They want the player to keep in motion to avoid the flying projectiles. Instant hit weapons encourage hiding behind cover. Though personally I would like to see some instant hit enemies added to the mix as well.

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id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!


Is that you, Donald Trump?

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The possessed seem more interesting to me than the former humans of previous incarnations, although Doom 3's take on them was memorable.

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Otus said:

Is that you, Donald Trump?

I'd rather be Donald Trump than some average stupid brianwashed politically-correct idiot.

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Tetzlaff said:

I hope they didn't reveal every single monster at this point, and that there is an enemy based on the chaingun commando from Doom 3.

I really like the d3 commando, though I feel they serve a different role then the original. I would be cool to see him again but I don't see how he would fit with the current monster theme.

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id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!

Ok

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MrGlide said:

I really like the d3 commando, though I feel they serve a different role then the original. I would be cool to see him again but I don't see how he would fit with the current monster theme.


I can imagine the Doom3 Commando redesigned in a style similar to that Strogg-like zombie soldier that is in the new game.

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id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!


Hah, that made me laugh:). You're an good storyteller.

MrGlide said:

I really like the d3 commando, though I feel they serve a different role then the original.


I like D3 commando too, he reminds me of Arnold Schwarzenegger from a film.. Commando.. yea, i also like how in Doom 3 he's like one of the strongest enemies in the game and pretty fairly balanced, not like in D2, where he's a glass cannon. And i don't really like glass cannons..

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Tetzlaff said:

I hope they didn't reveal every single monster at this point, and that there is an enemy based on the chaingun commando from Doom 3.

In one of the singleplayer streams Hugo Martin found the corpse of a UAC "Elite Guard" soldier, who was wearing red armour (Codex Entry on "Elite Guard" showed similar dude in red armour).
This could very strongly hint at there being "Possessed Elite Guards" who may very well be Chaingunners (because those guys wore red in Doom 2).

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dsm said:

In one of the singleplayer streams Hugo Martin found the corpse of a UAC "Elite Guard" soldier, who was wearing red armour (Codex Entry on "Elite Guard" showed similar dude in red armour).
This could very strongly hint at there being "Possessed Elite Guards" who may very well be Chaingunners (because those guys wore red in Doom 2).


You mean that dead soldier from whom he loots the upgrade chip?
Yeah, a possessed chaingun soldier with remains of red armor would be also cool.

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To answer your question OP. The player seems to be a lot squishier since the pinata health system is in place. If the game had hitscan enemies the gun would probably be worse off overall

id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!


id.dav said:

I'd rather be Donald Trump than some average stupid brianwashed politically-correct idiot.

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id.dav said:

At id office somewhere around mid 2013:
Marty - "Hey guys so we need to add pistol guys, shooty guys, chaingunners!"
Dev team - "Will be done!"
Next week testing with controllers started - "Ohh shit I can't avoid thier attaks....cos I'm a fucking gamepad retard....it's too difficult for meeeeeeeeeeee...I die all the time! That's BS! Remove it ASAP!" Someone among amasing PC guys said - "Hah I delt with those motherfuckers with no problem by using K/m!"
Zeimax suit dude - " You are fucking fired! Fired! Fired! Fired! Fireeeeeeeeeed!"
And that's how we didn't get those enemies in a Doom game! Yeah!

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Tetzlaff said:

You mean that dead soldier from whom he loots the upgrade chip?
Yeah, a possessed chaingun soldier with remains of red armor would be also cool.

Ah, so you saw the stream - yes, that was the one with the Praetor Suit upgrade chip :)

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I find the new enemies to be more Interesting, but every time I see the one monster shooting plasma, I figure they were Inspired by Quake 2 as well.

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I wont miss the hitscanners, I don't need to be clipped by a shotgunner from 37 miles away.

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I like that they are mostly projectile attacks now. It gives people who have real skill a chance. You should technically be able to play without getting hit once, with this new system.

But just imagine being in a room surrounded by these fuckers, and a few bigger enemies up in your face, you're going to be dodging all these projectiles while trying to fight them, it's going to be hard. Marty said nobody has beat the game in Ultra-Nightmare yet.

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I think former humans and their variants should still be around but instead of hitscan they should follow the Brutal Doom method. Hear me out.

Although in BD the former human tracer bullets are still way too fast to dodge effectively there is a pattern in their sprites to reveal when they are about to point and shoot. That very moment provides the right message and time for the player to react, either fight or flight. Seeing how the new Doom heavily relies fluid animations to indicate the monster actions I can see this fitting in well.

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