The DWmegawad Club plays: THT: Threnody & No Rest for the Living

[Steve D]

Cynical said:

Sometimes "unrealism" is what you need to complete an illusion.

Those fake walls in "The Spirit World" are a great example. You're in a weird, unworldly, hellish place called "the SPIRIT world", and then monsters start phasing through some of the walls. It's great.

Well, the smartass answer would be, "This map isn't The Spirit World." ;D But you make a great point, too. Then again, there's things you can get away with in an IWAD because it's the official game and you have to put up with it in order to finish, as Tarnsman has observed. PWADs work by somewhat different rules, which includes mappers abusing privileges and doing stuff like having Chaingunners shoot through fake walls. I remember when I first encountered that one. I was not amused.

Personally, I'd like to see this trope fade away unless the set-up really sells it, like The Spirit World did.

[Spectre01]

Map 05: Nukevil

Never played a Doomkid map before either but found this to be easily the best in the set so far. There's a high monster count, but lots of ammo, and every weapon is provided, including the BFG(!), so there's a lot of fun to be had blasting away at the opposition. I'm not a big fan of nukage-style maps but I enjoyed basically everything here. Great visuals, intuitive secrets, freedom of movement and some verticality that lets you loop around the map, like when grabbing the blue key above the spawn.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP05: Nukevil
32:49 | 99% Kills | 92% Items | 85% Secrets

This was a lot of fun, though I honestly couldn't remember a thing about it until I pulled it up a second ago. (Even though it's been only a few hours since I played, I blitzed through 2 whole episodes of DWITD:LE in the meantime.) Anyway, yeah, good map. Lots of incidental combat, my favorite kind. And some interesting progression, like the switch that lowers the bars in front of the yellow door. The secrets were fun, though I missed one (a locked door I couldn't get opened) as well as that elevated soulsphere.

[Tristan]

MAP05: Nukevil - Doomkid
Time: 13:00 (44:47) | Deaths: 0

I feel like a lot of megawads nowadays are too much about small maps than medium to large-sized ones, and while it's more understandable with one-man megawads, it's a shame to see a lack of adventure with some of them. Thanks a lot, Plutonia? With Threnody being, at its heart, a TNT-inspired megawad, I don't think anyone expected the majority of the maps to be short romps, but the question is whether this emphasis on larger-scale maps would work? Doomkid brings us another moderately sized techbase, the third consecutive map of such a description, and despite MAP04 being a slight dip in quality, this brings things back up to par. So far, yes, it's working. It's working damn well.

Approximately 250 monsters on HMP (269 by the time I finished) makes this the most populated map of the set so far, and much of this is made up of dense clusters of low-tier monsters, with usually no more than a few mid-tiers nearby as backup, and even those are mostly cacodemons and revenants, neither of which are monsters famed for their durability.
By the end of the map I had all 7 weapons, not all of which were of much use here (didn't bring the BFG out at all), but I'm sure they will be later on. For the most part, SSG and rocket launcher were kings here, though mowing down hitscanners with the chaingun is also something I'll never tire of, and the plasma gun definitely got out of a couple of tight spots near the end of the map.
Overall it's not a particularly challenging map, despite the large monster density, as even with all these hitscanners, there's lots of cover avaliable, and health is given out plentifully, and if you can get the secret soulsphere and megaarmour, it's almost plain sailing unless a bull throws its shit at you later, which it did for me. Freaking arch-viles. Oh well, didn't die so I wasn't too annoyed by it, but I ended the map with less health than I would have liked.

Got 5 secrets, and I thought most of these were pretty easy to find, in fact some felt very obvious, like the blursphere which you seemed to get by pressing a switch on the side of its platform, which I wouldn't say qualifies it at all as a secret, but eh, free blursphere :P

Visually it's got a pretty classic feel to it, a very standard looking techbase with nukage and crates everywhere. It's kind of in the middle of the scale, it's far from being a beautifully detailed aesthetic masterpiece (and we'll certainly see some of those later), yet also very far from being an ugly map (which we probably won't be seeing later, but your opinions may vary!). Despite the slight lack in visual fidelity, I definitely remembered this map from previous playthroughs, and it was a blast to play again. Great stuff.

9/10

[The_SloVinator]

Map 1 - Eirene

A quite decently made map. Love the architecture. Looks like some waste processing map located on the mountains. The sky fits the atmosphere of the map just right. For the first map, difficulty was easy which makes sense.

Not a fan of having a chain gun as a secret in the first level and the secret wasn't that hard to discover. (or maybe I'm quite experienced at finding these kind of secrets)

Map 2 - Rockage

The sadness in the music... and medieval feel to it. I like it.
Anyways, another simple map with sweet design of both the outdoor area & caverns with machinery. I like the idea of the red key to lower to a lower level into an area with a surprise.

My favorite secret is the one where you have to walk on the edges near the wall in outdoors. Clever idea.

Though I think that chainsaw was kind of useless for those who love to play every level pistol-start, that is.

Oh & lost souls sneaking upon you near the waterfall. Good for a little surprise.

Map 3 - Chemical Facility

The actions starts to ramp up with this one. Loads of secrets, connected rooms with keys scattered around & traps with tons of low tier enemies. Detailed architecture with great atmosphere.

[baja blast rd.]

Map 05: Nukevil

I don't like the start of this map at all. Playing aggressively in any capacity is hitscanner roulette, but there is no incentive at all to do so, because you can just boringly hide out behind crates. That is the definition of rewarding camping. A green armor would make the start more entertaining. After you get the keys, you have a choice of whether to enter the storage area gated off by the yellow key door or the nukage processing area behind the blue key doors. The plasma rifle isn't really a weapon fit for clearing out lots of mid-tier meat except in 'panic' scenarios, so I much prefer the rummaging through all the crates and stuff, where you can find additional ammo (and enough backpacks to stock a classroom) and the secret BFG. The BFG makes the blue key section a lot more fun. The secret invul is best reserved for the last area, which becomes a suitably entertaining spamfest. The bridge in the last area could have used some monster-blocking lines.

[baja blast rd.]

I fear map08 already. :( I might just have to record a video where I end up lost for a decent amount of it.

[cannonball]

MAP05 - “Nukevil” by Doomkid
I really enjoyed this one, though it is a little light on the health side so I had to play cautiously at times, it would be nice to have a little more health or some armour to have a better chance later on. A really decent old school map, perfect for this project in fact.

[rehelekretep]

map05 - fda here

fun little map. my only complaint is its a little front-loaded, with the start and the first two rooms accounting for my deaths. once you're past that you get a BFG & an invuln which make the rest of it quite easy. i also had a total brain fart, trying the door between the first room and the BK-anteroom about 20 times even though it was obviously never going to open from one side! :|

[baja blast rd.]

The rest of the map is easy because basically every monster placement in the map is direct, which when paired with layouts like this, often results in the area that branches out in some way being the only one with multi-directional combat, the rest being completely frontal. The BFG/invul just make it faster and more fun, which is a good thing imo.

[Capellan]

I'm going to try to get to THT this month, but I need to finish complaining about SteveD's maps first :)

[rehelekretep]

rdwpa said:

The rest of the map is easy because basically every monster placement in the map is direct, which when paired with layouts like this, often results in the area that branches out in some way being the only one with multi-directional combat, the rest being completely frontal. The BFG/invul just make it faster and more fun, which is a good thing imo.

yes it was definitely fun :D good point about if youre going to make a frontal combat/linear arena then holding the player up with the sg and/or meaty enemies is a BAD idea. *ahem* Bloodstain...

[Steve D]

Map03 – Chemical Facility by Paul Corfiatis

There are a few things I always expect from a pcorf map; it's going to look fantastic, it might very well have a cool pcorf midi, and it will feature relatively easy but engaging gameplay. This map hits on all those elements.

I really enjoyed this one. I love techbases and this one's a beauty featuring clean design with moderate detail and fantastic lighting. Unlike other players, I didn't find the start more difficult than the end, quite the opposite, in fact. It was fun, though, with attacks coming from multiple angles and heights. The lightweight enemies of the early encounters are joined by heavier foes and nastier traps as you get deeper into the complex. The red key fight was especially fun.

Another thing you can always expect from a pcorf map is a lot of secret-hunting, and I've been known to opine over the years that he designs some of the most obtuse secrets of any mapper. Not so much in this map, however, where at least 3 of the 6 secrets I found were basically gimmes. I'm happy that I found the Rocket Launcher and Plasma Gun, disappointed in myself for not figuring out the Soulsphere.

I used to wag my finger at Paul for gameplay a little on the easy side, but since I realized that BTSX E1 is my all-time favorite megawad, I've changed my mind about about always wanting to face the nastiest possible combat. In terms of difficulty, Chemical Facility would fit in perfectly with BTSX E1, and it's the kind of map I can see myself replaying. And that midi is sweet.

[Steve D]

Capellan said:

I'm going to try to get to THT this month, but I need to finish complaining about SteveD's maps first :)

Keep complaining, Adam, it's doing the mapset a lot of good. ;)

[Demon of the Well]

Map 03 -- Chemical Facility - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
I do believe this is one of the better PCorf maps I've seen in the past few years, continuing his string of displaying his strongest work in focused iterations for team/community projects (just the way I see it, of course). Being much larger than the first two maps probably helped to endear it to my personal tastes as well, as I do tend to prefer dishes that could be called a 'meal' rather than merely a 'snack.' This one is quite nicely presented, at that, something of a playful fusion of well-known and long-established PCorfian tropes with a loose KDiTD feel, couched in a Doom II/TNT 'fluorescent bunker' techbase theme--lots of personality, a wide mix of obvious influences with none being overbearing enough to dominate the proceedings.

Very much a PCorf map at heart, naturally, here we see a couple of his layout/progression predilections come to the fore. The first of these is the penchant for hub/spoke layout design, as is evident from the starting chamber. The cool thing here, though, is the map doesn't just have one hub with self-contained spokes that radiate off of it (a convenient/intuitive style of floorplanning that runs of the risk of becoming very predictable and disjointed rather quickly); rather, the whole damn thing is made of hubs, some of which are nested inside of one another. The blue keycard is teased from the outset, but acquiring it requires a detour into the chamber with the nukage pool and rising bridge next door (which is itself another hub); the route to the yellow keycard via the blue door twirls and twines through the large silver room with collapsible stairs (another hub, this one criss-crossed at two levels and with some secrets to boot) before visually teasing the player with the exit--still a ways off at that point--just as s/he acquires the yellow key from its perch in yet another interstitial hub. Not actually a particularly nonlinear map beyond the microcosm of the red key area, the highly circuitous path, weaving through the network of hubs as it does, with almost every area visited more than once but seldom creating the impression of actual 'backtracking', lends a lot of depth and a certain credibility to what is a highly Doom-abstract environment. The other PCorfianism on prominent display here is the offbeat progression convention where key-stripe textures around a switch or object denote not that you need the matching key to activate said object, but rather that activating it is in some way involved with eventually reaching said key. This is a minor thing, and something that Paul has been doing for years and years (not that he's at all the the only one, mind you, though almost certainly the most prolific mapper to regularly take this particular design tack), but its heavy use here in the red key switch-scavenging area in particular (built around another hub setup, incidentally!) strikes me as something playfully self-aware that the author had fun making, which I felt carried over into the map's feel.

This is an easy map, with the long early stint with the basic shotgun (perhaps coupled with the E1M3/2002ADO E1 references around the exit proper) lending a sort of early Phobos flavor before transitioning to more conventional SSG-oriented Doom II fare in the second half, with a secret RL and secret PG to spice up the menu a bit for those able to locate them. Easy is fine in this case, I think, and Paul usually does better with the lighter fare than when trying for a sterner challenge (again, IMO)--the monster composition is mostly lightweights that fill out the gameplay while taking a backseat to the clever layout, with the odd trap or reveal to periodically heighten the pace for a minute or two to keep things pacey. The red key area was my favorite bit, its self-contained mazey aspect and even carpeting of free-roam monsters being highly amenable to wild, unplanned rushes into the fray. A liberal sprinkling of secrets to search for using a smattering of conceits both time-worn and modern (e.g. the whole "put a small switch in plain sight and then camouflage it with texturing" thing which is so prominent these days) rounds out what is a pleasant 'classic' Doom experience where the classic impression seems more organic/incidental than contrived or actively designed for.

[Salt-Man Z]

MAP06: Cut Throat
28:31 | 100% Everything

Another rollicking techbase with a fantastic MIDI. Layout loops nicely back on itself a number of times. The number of archvile ambushes surprised me, but otherwise the combat didn't give me too much trouble. (Any deaths were either via vile, or due to single-digit health from surviving an archie hit.) Not a big fan of that four-sided switch that lowered goodies all around the room on each wall; in fact, the last item I missed ended up being one of the armor bonuses in an alcove under an imp corpse that I had missed on the first pass. Super fun map.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 04 -- Manly Hatred - 105% Kills / 100% Secrets
This one's a ton of fun, really nailing what I want out of an 'early game' sort of map--not necessarily so much something that's a quaint Sunday drive preoccupied with meticulously drip-feeding out monster X or weapon Y or classic progression trope Z, but rather a dense, multi-vantaged battlefield stuffed to the gills with weaklings to decimate/show off against, where the kills come so quickly you can all but smell the clouds of cordite and taste the mist of wanton arterial spray. Played through either of its initial routes, the action here is a fast-paced twitch-shooter with squads of gun-toting zombies positioned high and low, to and fro, near and far, with beefier foes rattling around in the dank interiors waiting to corner you if you get too cocky, striking a nice contrast between reckless gung-ho machismo and more deliberate maneuvering in what is really a rather small playspace. Compact in scale but richly featured, the layout makes mostly excellent usage of height variation and open spaces with many different vantages/angles of fire into and out of them, and lots of possible routes to take to the various goodies--on my playthrough I picked up the SSG only near the end of the map and so spent a lot of quality time with the chaingun, rocket launcher, and secret plasma rifle, but it could just as easily have gone in just the opposite order. Barrels and ledge-hopping corpses and cluster-kills abound, with a tricksy snare or two to keep you on your toes, ala the false bridge to the switch that opens the path to the exit, or the arch-vile who slithers out of your blind side at point-blank range when you drop back into that area later. As aforesaid, the undead are the marquee foe here, but gasbags also make a strong showing with their ability to use their power of flight to head you off through windows or otherwise follow you into some uncanny locations (e.g. straight down the well serving as one of access routes to the southern quadrant), particularly if you let those two pain elementals near the RL get a mite out of hand.

The potential degree of variation in how the map plays is perhaps most tellingly enshrined in its use of two divergent routes at the outset to launch you into the thick of things at different points--the normal/standard path leads you post-haste to the SSG but also to a somewhat tactically inferior position down in the half-flooded central space where you can be struck from countless different angles (and likely with a 'porting squad of commandos appearing at your heels to chase you out into the crossfire), whereas an intuitive secret route ("just use the 'ol grey matter") features an exclusive subterranean encounter apparently taking place directly under the main building (an illusion of 3D space executed via a rather well-done 'hide in plain sight' silent teleportation trick found just a few steps away from mapstart) before leading you out onto the upper levels, sans SSG but potentially just a stone's throw away from the RL and the various secret prizes found in the easterly brace of warehouse modulars. As aforesaid, I played this level very aggressively, but its careful planning and wealth of possibilities probably make it just as amenable and enjoyable for someone more inclined towards a methodical sniper's approach.

Apart from the strange misfiring of the first timed gate if you first take the secret route and then approach it from the other side (almost entirely a cinematic issue rather than a gameplay one, incidentally), the only real oversight I encountered was that the small hatch which seals you into the southerly brownstone chamber where the elevated exit booth is found once the arch-vile appears is apparently not openable from outside should you circle around again--I nope'd out of there when the vile first appeared via the newly-revealed elevator on the other side, but when I later came returned to kill him (and eventually to exit) I found the only way was to drop back into the lower room at the start of the gap left by the collapsing bridge, and he and his necromantically-animated buttbuddies had decisively infinitely-tall'd me out of the area, leaving me little recourse but to cheese them with infinitely-tall rocket splash.

Excellent little map.

[Demon of the Well]

Map 05 -- Nukevil - 102% Kills / 85% Secrets
This is quite something. Unabashedly old-fasioned in aesthetic and structural design sensibilities, and carrying with it a very pronounced difficulty spike, Doomkid's first map in the set is some sort of crumbling old cement/wood dike or aqueduct system, flooded with highly radioactive toxic waste and hellspawn. Consisting of a handful of open-sky yards and precarious footways over vats of ooze connected by a long, doglegging corridor or two and textured/lit in what seemed to me a self-consciously 90s sort of way, it's not really the layout or structure that makes this map, but rather the thing placement. The various areas are positively packed with monsters of all shapes and sizes, many of which are 'deaf' but also given hairtrigger sightlines that draw them out in what feel like long sustained pulls as each area is first breached, creating the impression of being pursued by an angry demonic mob that seems to be coming right out of the woodwork. The highly heterogeneous composition and nigh constant presence of some hitscanner element in concert with the piles of heavy weaponry the player is eventually/theoretically able to amass (many rockets and tons of cells scattered here and there) make for a riotous chaos of howls and infighting and explosions and plasma-spamming that at first seems to have little real method to its madness, though a few particular placements here and there (particularly of arch-viles) belie a design that is, in fact, striving to outwit you where you least expect it.

Mapstart in particular is disarmingly hostile, with hitscanners emerging to fire from all sorts of strange/inconvenient angles from positions all around and in the initial yard, perhaps prompting you to flee into the enclosure to the north, to be promptly jumped by a pair of wall-hugging revenants, if not to run smack into the hilariously huge clump of sergeants and other miscreants congregated around the otherwise casually-placed yellow keycard. The sense of early fragility is quite pronounced here, but if you can survive the first couple of minutes and start to amass some weaponry you'll find that you gain momentum so rapidly that soon enough you'll be howling and slavering and spraying lead haphazardly everywhere right along with the milling damned. I wouldn't say the balance swings completely to be trivial by the end, though--you really need some firepower and some measure of durability to carve through the throngs of enemies amassed around the pair of elevated walkway segments, particularly the one closing the map. It's incredibly crass, really, but it's also fun!

That being said, some of this crucial escape velocity is predicated on locating at least a few of the secrets (the map is presumably still very doable but MUCH slower if you're constantly having to simply 'make due'), and it also struck me that the layout/progression itself really doesn't actually flow very well at all--i.e. you're led towards the walkway out to the red key by both enemy placement and general lay of the land early on, but that area plays vastly better if you wander off into a different part of the complex (itself a dead end) to gather the rocket launcher (or better) before returning. There are a couple of obnoxious one-way or switch-operated gates/doors that further interrupt pacing in the later stages of the proceedings as well. Comparatively small 'quality of life' issues, I suppose, and the sort of thing that could probably be conveniently rationalized as being part and parcel for what is obviously a proudly oldschool design sensibility, but still worth mentioning, I feel--this sort of stuff gets in the way of allowing you to just let the reptilian brain take over entirely, and doing that would appear to be more or less the one and only thing by which this particular map lives and dies.

Nevertheless, while perhaps a bit crude in some ways, it's still genuinely entertaining, and to reiterate I'm generally a lot happier to see something paced like this in the early game (especially of a mapset that's not a whole 32-map package) than the much more cute/conventional fare of maps 01 and 02.

[Memfis]

06 - FDA. The arcadey music didn't fit the atmospheric image of TNT and quickly made me type IDMUS25. The map has some pretty areas (I like the use of white wall with vines) but the straightforward monster placement makes it so tedious to play. All these masses and typical revenants/arch-viles hiding in corners bored me, and unlike in the previous map, this time I didn't have that much stuff to kill them with (SSG please?). In particular, I didn't understand the HK/baron horde at all: was there some secret stash with many rockets and cells that I missed? The most annoying level so far, sorry...

About sounds again. Does anyone else hear some stuff clicking when the crushers move? It is unpleasant for my ears.

[The_SloVinator]

Map 4 - Manly Hatred

My favorite part of DooM was always blowing up barrels near demons & see them turn into minced meat, so this level does a great job with that. Secrets were fun to discover as well & I can see the challenge ramp up in this one.

Love the music & again, the atmosphere in the level is quite amazing.

[Steve D]

Map04 – Manly Hatred by Chris "The Axe-Murderer" Hansen

I felt every bit of that hatred as Chris hauled out his battleaxe and served me my first deaths of the megawad.

I tested this months ago and on that occasion took the standard path, which I think worked out better for me than the secret path I took this time, which I found later on that occasion.

This is a really well-designed, hardnosed map with many tricks and traps plus nice Boom effects. And I really loved those water towers! So cool.

In terms of architecture, this is genuine oldschool Doom by a master of the style. The layout is deceptively simple and allows for fun things like jumping into that area by the exit way ahead of time. It didn’t work out so well for me on this occasion. ;D One complaint I could make is that he could have made the unplayable area larger by pulling it out more. Right now it's too close and you can see the environment come to a very defined end at the sky texture. It breaks immersion a bit.

Much more effective is the use of silent teleporters and duplicate areas to create a room-over-room effect near the Rocket Launcher. Sweet work!

In gameplay, I took too much damage early when I emerged from the secret path and encountered quite a few hitscanners and Cacos. I had to play a bit cautiously after that as health is scarce, but I managed to survive until I foolishly leaped into the exit area and died to a sniping Chaingunner while fighting the Baron. I'm pretty sure that happened last time, too, so I'll pat myself on the back for making the same mistake twice. ;)

The Lost Soul trap above the exit area was nicely constructed with Losties going behind you and up the stairs, so in case you decide to flee they'll be waiting to take a bite out of you. I ultimately had to quit this path and went for the Blue Armor, Plasma Gun, Rocket Launcher and Soulsphere before I attacked again. This time I prevailed, but that was quite the trap when the Revvies were released, and I took some damage there.

I managed to find 6 of the devious secrets, died 4 times, and had a blast all the way through. Props for the electronic cabinets in the secret path and the serpentine floor cable connecting them. That was an excellent detail. All around kickass map!

[Spectre01]

Map 06: Cutthroat

Another excellent map with a great midi. Digging the aesthetics too with how much variety is present in the base. We've got a complete package here with a natural outdoor areas, storage crates, regular tech + a high tech blue computer area, which I'm a big fan of. Also like the use of windows to observe locations later visited in the map. Great pacing too with some good, balanced combat and a few nasty Archvile surprises. The one after the drop ended up getting me. It's also nice to get the full arsenal again, including the BFG which recent mapsets tend to be very stingy with. Great map.

[The_SloVinator]

Map 5 - Nukevil

A decently balanced level with decent architecture. Secrets are ok. No further comment.

[The_SloVinator]

Map 6 - Cutthroat

I like the new music & the yellow door area had quite sweet traps & more barrel chain-kill fun!

Good level design. There is one area that reminds me of TNT's map 17. When you're inside the building looking at the outdoor part.

[baja blast rd.]

Map 06: Cutthroat

Your experience on this map as a pistol-starter will depend a bit on whether you find the secret SSG. It's a good example of a SSG that should not be secret. Given the ample rocket and cell balance you don't really need buckshot (to use a DotW word :D) outside of cleanup duty and lower-pressure scenarios, so it mostly serves to prolong these sections. It's not a huge problem -- you might have to chip away at a dozen or so extra mid-tiers -- but it's an easily avoidable one.

That said, if you do find the SSG, it's a fun and dynamic map. I do agree that the BFG is underused in many maps. Casual BFG use is quite fun, especially when you get the hang of manipulating tracers. I kind of like the unnecessary partial invisibilites, too. I found the second one annoying until I realized that you could use it to get highly improbable infighting started in the quad-switch area. The only thing keeping me from truly enjoying combat with partial invisibility against projectile monsters other than revenants and fucking arachnotrons is that the translucent weapon sprite compromises aim.

One more note: I think if you are going to use doors, they should be open-only unless you have a good reason for them to close again. The closing mechanism tends to interfere with smooth flow.

[cannonball]

MAP06 - “Cut Throat” by Doomkid
Not as hard as map05 in my opinion with a lot less open space which meant you could duck for cover a lot more easily here, but on the other hand I spent a lot of time corner or door camping to dispose of the enemies here. In the end another old scholl looking level but not as fun as Doomkid's previous effort for this. This map just didn't flow as well.

[Doomkid]

I'm finding it very interesting and entertaining reading all your thoughts on my maps, funny to see that some of my design sensibilities really click with some Doomers while turning off others! I think this might be because, other than taking inspiration from some of the oldie classic mapsets, the stuff I make has very little to do with what's current/common in terms of mapping trends. My particular bag of tricks is "so old it's new again" which some players like, while seemingly reminding other players of their least favorite "not this shit!" mapping tropes. The various reactions are great and will be super helpful in shaping my future maps too.

It's a good thing Chris lightened up the difficulty in my maps, they were notably less forgiving at certain spots when this set was still in beta!

[Tristan]

Yeah I saw MAP09 recently in multiplayer and it's nothing like I remembered from beta, I can save my scathing remarks for other maps! :P It used to be one of my least favourites, but things may well be different this time around. That will be an interesting play for sure, as will the maps either side of it.

[Memfis]

07 - FDA. Dunno. The author shows a cool sense of style in design. I like the careful texturing in many places and it's somehow cool how even the rocks are neatly shaped: unnatural but it works in a gamey sort of way. However, the gameplay is very uneventful and full of filler and, well, 30 minutes of mostly filler fights is too much for me I think. Nice idea with key marks telling you which key you will need in the area. When the conveyor belt started working as I was standing on it, I felt like for a while the objects had higher speed than me. It looked strange. Music was a bit annoying in some parts but overall very cool.

Btw there is a kinda faulty expectation that the player will cross this line. When I pressed the switch there and it opened the way back to the starting area, I immediately turned around to explore and see if I missed something important (like "what, I did all that just to get back to where I came from?"). So I found some secret, went back to the start via stairs and completely missed that unmarked teleporter. This caused some confusion.

It's maybe a bit worrying that so far I haven't encountered a single map with, like, truly cool gameplay. But it's a community project so there is always hope. Or maybe I can just choose to not play further? Hmm... I IDCLEVed a bit, and it seems like most later maps are complex, highly detailed, and have fights mostly in large areas rather than small ones. Yeah, I'll probably stop here. I'm too old-fashioned for these 5000 sector maps with hunderds of enemies, this is not how I see Doom, or TNT, or Ty Halderman's style.

[Doomkid]

Oh, I almost forgot - When the time comes to start on NERVE.wad, I recommend using it with NERVEMUS.wad. After having beaten it several times on the console, playing it on PC felt wrong with the generic unchanged order of the tracks. Even though it's all stock music, it gives the mapset more of it's own identity.