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Nevander

[v1.5] Doom 64: Retribution

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2 hours ago, ArcturusRA64 said:

I found a lil quirk with the animations, apparently the Super Shotgun fires a bit faster with classic animations than with modern animations.

How much is "a bit"? Because I'm sure I made each animation have the same tics between firing codepointers. It felt identical for me as I did the animations the first time. If it was *just* noticed, it may be a problem with the current GZDoom version and not the code. Even if there actually is a difference, it can't be more than a couple tics.

 

59 minutes ago, ReaperAA said:

Funny thing is that I just noticed the same thing today. Also Plasma gun refires instantly with classic animations but not with modern animations (though in plasma's case it is obvious why).

That was on purpose because the modern set has the extra frames, as you have said. However, those frames were sped up considerably from PC Doom so that the refire is almost as quick as classic so it's not a big disadvantage to use modern.

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1 hour ago, Nevander said:

That was on purpose because the modern set has the extra frames, as you have said. However, those frames were sped up considerably from PC Doom so that the refire is almost as quick as classic so it's not a big disadvantage to use modern.

 

Yeah I understand. I personally don't mind it.

 

1 hour ago, Nevander said:

How much is "a bit"? Because I'm sure I made each animation have the same tics between firing codepointers. It felt identical for me as I did the animations the first time. If it was *just* noticed, it may be a problem with the current GZDoom version and not the code. Even if there actually is a difference, it can't be more than a couple tics.

 

Well I think it might be only a single-ish tic slower. What I did is I took a stopwatch and measured the time it took for SSG to empty the ammo from 100 to 0.

 

For modern animation, it took 67.47 seconds.

For classic animation, it took 65.13 seconds. (2.34 seconds less)

 

Of course there could be a slight human error in those values so I would say it is somewhere between 1.8 to 2.8 seconds difference (assuming a 0.5 sec human error).

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Okay, I just saw the weapon definitions in the DECORATE file. I noticed that there is indeed difference in the number of tics assigned for modern fire and classic fire for some of the weapons.

 

For Pistol, ClassicFire has 16 tics assigned to it while Fire (which is regular/modern fire) has 14 tics.

For SSG, ClassicFire has 46 tics assigned to it while Fire has 48 tics.

For BFG, ClassicFire has 63 tics assigned to it while Fire has 68 tics.

Edited by ReaperAA

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So when I load this up I get this texture in the sky in the first area. I loaded everything in the normal order but I don't know what causes this, It's a missing texture bug but I can't say I ever seen it in this spot.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/290378105355370499/620356314027261969/Screenshot_249.png

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Looks like a bug with LZDoom and the Line_Horizon line special specifically. I know nothing about LZDoom so if I were you I'd report it to the port maintainer(s).

 

If it's happening here, it will likely be happening in ALL maps which have a sky.

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On 7/27/2019 at 11:21 PM, Nevander said:

Hey guys, if Doom 64 is actually being re-released or officially ported, it's possible I may be given a C&D. I certainly hope not though.

 

I don't know if they would also go after Absolution TC, Brutal Doom 64, GZDoom64, or GEC Master Edition as well. Mine and BD64 are certainly the most well known so there's no doubt we would be targeted first (and possibly only us).

 

EX is most likely safe, since you need the ROM anyway. It's literally only an executable. No data is included with EX.

 

I hope they will view my project and others as "fan recreations" or something similar, instead of as an actual "remake." The former may allow them to stay up, since they are not really the original game in that sense.

 

Regardless, I would advise you download it now while you still can. I love my work and I hope I can continue to make updates.

If anything happens, i'll try to spread the .pk3 in as many, many pages i can get it so at least your work is preserved. I would hate to see this only be played by the people who got the chance of getting it before it got taken down.

 

Also, i'm making a Zandronum version (yeah i always say this on many projects and a lot of the time nothing happens) but is it fine if i release it on this thread? It would be pretty cool to see Retribution being played online. EDIT: Nevermind this was already done.

 

Another question that had me curious for a while, how were Breakdown's sliding doors done in the original?

Edited by -TDRR-

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On 9/9/2019 at 4:49 AM, Nevander said:

Looks like a bug with LZDoom and the Line_Horizon line special specifically. I know nothing about LZDoom so if I were you I'd report it to the port maintainer(s).

 

If it's happening here, it will likely be happening in ALL maps which have a sky.

I load Doom 64 Retribution v1.5 with LZDoom v3.82 for x64 in software and hardware mode and it to works fine for my part, it weird.

software.PNG

hardware.PNG

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22 hours ago, KOF_Guy said:

I load Doom 64 Retribution v1.5 with LZDoom v3.82 for x64 in software and hardware mode and it to works fine for my part, it weird.

Weird indeed. Well, whatever is going on it's just that one report so far. It must not be for everyone on LZDoom so that's good.

 

23 hours ago, -TDRR- said:

Another question that had me curious for a while, how were Breakdown's sliding doors done in the original?

In the original, the doors are actually a set of sectors, where each door side is a few sectors each. Then with a macro, they are lowered instantly from the middle outwards, which gave the illusion it was sliding back.

 

Since GZDoom supports polyobjects, it felt like an obvious improvement to make.

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On 9/12/2019 at 7:58 AM, Nevander said:

Weird indeed. Well, whatever is going on it's just that one report so far. It must not be for everyone on LZDoom so that's good.

 

In the original, the doors are actually a set of sectors, where each door side is a few sectors each. Then with a macro, they are lowered instantly from the middle outwards, which gave the illusion it was sliding back.

 

Since GZDoom supports polyobjects, it felt like an obvious improvement to make.

On the technical side of things. Easily an improvement. Might be me but I actually prefer the original because the choppiness actually makes the doors creepier. 

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Doom 64 Retribution AI HD

https://www.moddb.com/mods/doom-64-retribution/addons/doom-64-retribution-ai-hd

 

I would like to ask for your request because I do not have professional knowledge.
The texture of the door looks big and doesn't look right during the game.
I used to see the same thing in Doom Neural Upscale 0.95.
Can anyone help me with this?
I can't work because I don't have professional knowledge.
I would like someone to complete this work for me.

Screenshot_Doom_20190218_161735.jpg

Edited by sweety80

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The problem is that each texture here is scaled up separately and then those combined textures are being used to build the switch texture, which doesn't seem to be correctly scaled. Basically, this switch texture consists of two other textures (the bar and the switch). The offsets are still right, but they are not scaled back down correctly.

 

What needs to be done is the resulting finalized texture needs to be scaled up as it's own texture instead, then it would probably look fine. There are probably more that have this problem. This is something the mod author will need to do.

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6 hours ago, Nevander said:

The problem is that each texture here is scaled up separately and then those combined textures are being used to build the switch texture, which doesn't seem to be correctly scaled. Basically, this switch texture consists of two other textures (the bar and the switch). The offsets are still right, but they are not scaled back down correctly.

 

What needs to be done is the resulting finalized texture needs to be scaled up as it's own texture instead, then it would probably look fine. There are probably more that have this problem. This is something the mod author will need to do.

Thank you for your reply.

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2 hours ago, dd93 said:

I can't get ambient sounds to work. I have it turned on in the options.

Are you sure it isn't working? There are not many areas which use them yet, as this was a test feature for 1.5. Start up the bonus fun maps episode, do you hear wind and fire on the hub map? If so, it's working.

Edited by Nevander

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Okay, I thought the original music was the ambiance. So yes ambient sounds do work, but the original music isn't included?

 

Edit: nevermind, i read the instructions and got it working.

Edited by dd93

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I finished the main campaign this week, and man, what an underrated game Doom 64 is, now I see why it got a cult following over the years. It has a rather different vibe than Doom 1, 2 and its various expansions. I loved the level design, new weapons and monster sprites, dark ambience music, the sound effects and the overall mood of the game, probably the best classic Doom title.

 

I've never played the original game to judge the accuracy of this port, but it feels just right to me. I played a couple of levels on Doom64 EX, and while it might be the most accurate port available, it didn't have the smoothness provided by our good ol' GZDoom. All I can say is thanks a lot to Nevander for this mod and well done on the recreation effort, I give this mod a solid 10/10. I'm very eager for the PC port next year, let's hope it will be even better than this mod.

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On 7/27/2019 at 10:21 PM, Nevander said:

Hey guys, if Doom 64 is actually being re-released or officially ported, it's possible I may be given a C&D. I certainly hope not though.

 

I don't know if they would also go after Absolution TC, Brutal Doom 64, GZDoom64, or GEC Master Edition as well. Mine and BD64 are certainly the most well known so there's no doubt we would be targeted first (and possibly only us).

 

EX is most likely safe, since you need the ROM anyway. It's literally only an executable. No data is included with EX.

 

I hope they will view my project and others as "fan recreations" or something similar, instead of as an actual "remake." The former may allow them to stay up, since they are not really the original game in that sense.

 

Regardless, I would advise you download it now while you still can. I love my work and I hope I can continue to make updates.

Time to back up my copy on my Google Drive.

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I was playing co-op today with a friend, and during MAP13 I got a message that said "Thanks for playing!". Well, you're welcome heh! I don't remember doing anything particular to trigger that message, though. 

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5 hours ago, CoTeCiO said:

I don't remember doing anything particular to trigger that message, though. 

Were you dead when it appeared? I added a script that runs on death to show the hidden messages from the original game that would taunt you or whatever, along with some new ones. They appear after a minute but only if you're still dead.

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9 hours ago, Nevander said:

Were you dead when it appeared? I added a script that runs on death to show the hidden messages from the original game that would taunt you or whatever, along with some new ones. They appear after a minute but only if you're still dead.

No, I was alive. I recorded a demo of the whole thing, but it takes a while to get to Dark Citadel when it happened. I will edit this post once I can get a screenshot of that.

 

We also got locked out in MAP06 because the room you enter from the room with the lift in the middle is impossible to open from the outside once its door closes. I'm aware the maps in Doom 64 never considered multiplayer into them and a lot of the traps depend on locking you inside rooms, in this particular case you have to press a one time switch to open the door, and once it closes it gets impossible to open from the outside again. Apart from that, it all worked fine, we got locked out in another level but we were lucky enough that the monsters we needed to kill to open the bars again were visible and shootable from the outside.

 

EDIT: I managed to get some screenshots of the message. None of the two were dead at the time the message appeared, but it did appear closely after I died and respawned. Unfortunately, the game was opening the menu every time I tried to take a screenshot and I tried to open the console to bind a key to screenshot inside the game, but that stopped the demo and I had been watching this thing for an hour and a half to get to that point, so I don't really have much more time to rewatch the entire thing.

gzdoom 2019-12-20 18-21-50-91.png

gzdoom 2019-12-20 18-21-55-20.png

 

EDIT 2: Keys that are spawned with scripts disappear after being picked up in co-op, unlike the ones placed in the map that stay so everyone can pick it. This creates the problem of locking people out, and if someone picked a key and then left the game, he would leave the rest locked out too since there are no more keys to pick up and progress, although I guess that's more of a design flaw in GZDoom than a bug in the wad.

Edited by CoTeCiO : Added screenshots and added a co-op key problem

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6 hours ago, CoTeCiO said:

We also got locked out in MAP06 because the room you enter from the room with the lift in the middle is impossible to open from the outside once its door closes.

I know where you're referring to. That's easily fixed with ACS. There is one place I anticipated on MAP21 where the stairs close back up at the beginning. They should never close in co-op mode. I will fix this for 1.6.

 

6 hours ago, CoTeCiO said:

we got locked out in another level

Which one? I might can fix this for co-op too.

 

6 hours ago, CoTeCiO said:

None of the two were dead at the time the message appeared, but it did appear closely after I died and respawned.

Yea that's definitely from the DEATH script for the death messages. I'm guessing there's some type of issue with that script when it's ran in co-op following a death and respawn.

 

If you don't mind, could you test something for me. It may also be a bug in GZDoom itself. Start any map and have your player die, wait to see the message. Then do the resurrect console command and wait for the next message. If the script is working correctly, the second message should not run, since the player is now alive.

 

I'm guessing somehow respawning fudges up the script in some way. I may just insta-terminate the script if it's co-op since it's likely a co-op only bug.

 

6 hours ago, CoTeCiO said:

Keys that are spawned with scripts disappear after being picked up in co-op, unlike the ones placed in the map that stay so everyone can pick it. This creates the problem of locking people out

Yes, I'm aware of this one. It's definitely a flaw in GZDoom multiplayer design. I'm not sure how I could fix it for Retribution right off. If anyone has any ideas they are much appreciated.

 

Thanks @CoTeCiO for playing this in co-op. As stated in the readme, I had no way of testing co-op so I'm not surprised of some nasty co-op only bugs existing. Hopefully we can find all the problem areas and I can fix them.

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14 hours ago, Nevander said:

Yes, I'm aware of this one. It's definitely a flaw in GZDoom multiplayer design. I'm not sure how I could fix it for Retribution right off. If anyone has any ideas they are much appreciated.

Well, if you can detect it's co-op, perhaps once the puzzle or whatever is completed, it's spawned with +INVENTORY.ALWAYSRESPAWN, so that when picked up, it will at least respawn? Then you can use INVENTORY.RESPAWNTICS and just set it to 1 tic (or 35 if you want that nice one-second pause) so that it pretty much instantly respawns.

 

Ugly, but it might work. 

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One thing to consider... I wonder if Thing_Move also moves the position the thing respawns at?

 

In many maps, I place the real key outside of the playable area and simply move it instantly and fade it in when it's time to grab it. If the original location is where it's respawning, that would be one cause for a problem since the player can't get there.

 

The reason I did this was to be able to attach a script to an existing key object and simply move it to reduce the possibility for errors with SetThingSpecial and taking items too early.

 

I did not replace or edit key actors with DECORATE, so if keys respawn by default then that would be the issue.

 

If so, I'd still call it a design flaw. It needs to respawn where its's moved to.

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On 12/20/2019 at 11:14 PM, Nevander said:

Which one? I might can fix this for co-op too.

In MAP11 at this point

597183413_gzdoom2019-12-2919-27-17-34.jpg.71f8b0c71c2920ee584eafcbef523482.jpg

 

There's also this area in MAP07, but is far easier to resolve since you get locked in with just one Hell Knight and it's not that hard to kill it from the outside 

943063178_gzdoom2019-12-2919-38-24-83.jpg.0c46cf223eb2d4ab12b79c49ded506dc.jpg

 

There might be several more of these that we didn't encounter during our playthrough, considering how much those traps were abused in Doom 64

On 12/20/2019 at 11:14 PM, Nevander said:

If you don't mind, could you test something for me. It may also be a bug in GZDoom itself. Start any map and have your player die, wait to see the message. Then do the resurrect console command and wait for the next message. If the script is working correctly, the second message should not run, since the player is now alive.

Nothing happened. It might be that whatever the script uses to count to display a message never resets between deaths, so every time you die and respawn, the counter counts a little bit more until you finally get a message.

 

There is a potential way to test some of these things even without having to play with someone else. You can just spawn a bot to trigger the co-op respawning mechanic and check the traps to see if you can return to them properly or not.

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Hi. I am trying to play versions 1.4 and 1.5 on gzdoom 2.2.0. You claim they were developed on/for gzdoom 2.2.0 but I am still getting that menu error "line 25 addoptionmenu". What's wrong? Does it work on gzdoom 2.2.0 ? Thanks a lot

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3 hours ago, roboticmehdi2 said:

Hi. I am trying to play versions 1.4 and 1.5 on gzdoom 2.2.0. You claim they were developed on/for gzdoom 2.2.0 but I am still getting that menu error "line 25 addoptionmenu". What's wrong? Does it work on gzdoom 2.2.0 ? Thanks a lot

It works on 2.2.0 if the MENUDEF is edited to disable the AddOptionMenu block. This feature did not exist until later and for some reason was made to halt the entire mod. Don't ask me why a menu should halt it from running.

 

Opening the WAD in SLADE and viewing MENUDEF or the readme will explain how to change the menu code so that error goes away. Make the edit and save the WAD.

 

I still develop and test with 2.2.0 for now. When I'm ready for an update release, I change MENUDEF to use the new way so features menu correctly appears for everyone using newer versions. Then I change it back for myself.

 

It's a pain in the ass but I made it easy to fix.

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Thanks, it works now.

 

Another question if you have time please:

 

"Think of this mod as being a remastered or updated version of Doom 64
for GZDoom. We have Doom 64 EX, Doom 64 Absolution TC, GZDoom64, and Brutal Doom 64. Why you ask? I
was personally dissatisfied with the quality of the GZDoom64 project, and Brutal Doom 64 (while it
is a great improvement) is along the same lines but changes too much and deviates from the original
Doom 64 experience. And thus, this project was born."

 

Ok, but you did not explain Doom 64 EX and Absolution TC. Why make Retribution mod while we have those?

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I know Doom 64 EX doesn't run in GZDoom, and I dont think Absolution TC does either right? It's nice to have things in GZDoom for certain amounts of customizability and modding too. A few of my buddies are even talking about using Doom 64: Retribution to make a mapset honoring the 25th anniversary of Doom 64 since they can use GZDoom builder, as that is what they are used to using.

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