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Cynicism

The Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 which maps would you say is the most difficult

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I'd have to say e4m1
It's just ridiculous how tight on ammo that map is probably the hardest in the franchise
I never understood why people say e4m2 is hard I never got much trouble on that one
Doom 2 and Plutonia maps aren't that hard all in all

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Outrageous Videos said:

I never understood why people say e4m2 is hard I never got much trouble on that one


E4M2 is hard if you enter it battered and bruised, coming from E4M1. It's probably the only map in the entire game that's easier from a pistol start than from normal progression.

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Graf Zahl said:

E4M2 is hard if you enter it battered and bruised, coming from E4M1. It's probably the only map in the entire game that's easier from a pistol start than from normal progression.

Speak for yourself; I really had to decide which is better: 100% health or rocket launcher power.

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Graf Zahl said:

E4M2 is hard if you enter it battered and bruised, coming from E4M1. It's probably the only map in the entire game that's easier from a pistol start than from normal progression.


If you're locked and loaded but short on health, just shoot the initial shotgun sargents and then hop into the lava, quickly grab the radiation suit and make a dash for the soul sphere. It's there if you need it. The only thing you have to face for it is some imps on the way back up.

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Ultimate DOOM: definitely E4M2. Also E4M1 with 100% secrets, but usually I do NOT get the NIN secret to save ammo and health.

DOOM 2: none :-D.

TNT and Plutonia: MAP32 (especially Plutonia MAP32 with its cyberdemons).

Just for fun, Heretic: E4M1 and E5M1.

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I used to always get my shit rocked every time I played Perfect Hatred in Ultimate Doom, and in Doom II I'd say for me Refueling Base was always the hardest one for me. I remember when I did my UV run of Doom II for XBLA, I was getting my ass kicked there. I blame the controller. On PC these days though, you realize how easy the original games are even on UV with enough experience.

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e4m2 and e4m6 for me. I have a harder time pistol starting the latter. With e4m2, I think if you're good at finding routes and exploiting the layout it helps a lot. If you're like me and often play more casually, the level can close in on you. I like how it almost never leaves you feeling safe with different factors like height and barons and lava keeping you off balance (unless you're an automap pro).

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For me, the first couple of maps of Episodes 2-4 are harder than most of the Doom 2 maps just because ammo is scarce, or enemies are constantly ambushing you. I found a lot of Doom 2 maps tend to make use more of open spaces, giving you more room to run around.

 

I'd probably agree with most that E4M1 and E4M2 are probably the toughest maps between Doom and Doom 2. In the first game, I remember having trouble towards the end of Episode 1. I died to those barons many times! In the second game, even to this day, Tricks & Traps still usually brings me down a couple of times. The Pit usually is hard for me because a lot of enemies are thrown at you in close quarters, and even Barrels O' Fun can be tough for me if I can't outrun the enemies at the very beginning.

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e4m2 is much easier than e4m1 because i know where to grab the bfg through wall, and i can take ~1050 damage without dying, and ammo is sufficient for killing all monsters 3 times without using berserk fist.

e4m1 on the other hand, is guaranteed to die after taking 163 damage, and i can only kill all monsters for ~1.2 times before running out of ammo.

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As said before, for Doom 1, it is definitely E4M1. If you are not a coward and plan on killing the barons (as you should), the map requires extremely careful ammo management to be able to do it, as well as getting the most amount of splash damage from the few rockets you get. Really like this tight situation where you are ammo starved for once.

 

For Doom 2, it would be harder to pick one. No maps stand out much in difficulty for me. Two maps that come closest to being difficult are Factory and Bloodfalls IMHO. Factory has many dangerous areas (teleport between 4 imps at melee range, dark area with Heavy Weapon Dudes, last area with Cacos etc.). Bloodfalls just feels uncomfortable to play and conquering the first courtyard with the revenant on a pillar and lots of HWDs on the ledges above while there is a damaging floor behind you is quite difficult in Doom 2 standards. Other maps simply don't offer such precarious situations.

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In Ultimate Doom the hardest is, as everyone said, E4M1, but that depends on your skills and intentions, if you just want to find the exit and not caring about 100% everything, it's not that hard, but if you want to UV-max or 100% everything in whatever difficulty, that takes a lot of practice, and it's not recommendable due to the beginning of the next map.

 

In Doom 2, map29 or map30, I have never beaten the Icon of Sin without cheating, it's really stressful.

 

Also for TNT: Evilution it would be Mount Pain (27) and for The Plutonia Experiment would be map15 or map32 depending on your skills. 

 

 

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On 5/3/2017 at 8:52 AM, galileo31dos01 said:

In Doom 2, map29 or map30, I have never beaten the Icon of Sin without cheating, it's really stressful.

It's actually really easy on source ports with mouselook, you can just stand right where you get teleported in, launch rockets, and be done in a few seconds. But doing it the "proper" way is really frustrating, especially since you have to launch the rockets just before the elevator reaches its max height.

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On 2017/2/17 at 4:18 AM, Outrageous Videos said:

I'd have to say e4m1
It's just ridiculous how tight on ammo that map is probably the hardest in the franchise
I never understood why people say e4m2 is hard I never got much trouble on that one
Doom 2 and Plutonia maps aren't that hard all in all

e4m2 is still a bit hard if you don't know where to run out of the start which is full of cacos with only a shotgun and limited ammo. but yeah, i know where to grab the bfg through wall so its no match for e4m1.

 

for doom2, map24 is pretty hard for me. its not the combat but that i was never able to remember the map well, and the catwalk before exit is not forgiving.

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1 hour ago, Piper Maru said:

I'd also add E3M2: Slough of Despair, it can punish you quite a bit.

but its often done without firing a single shot...

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I don't think cheesing map30 and 29 with mouse look should count in their difficulty, They weren't designed with them in mind. Not that map30 is hard to begin with. I've been replaying stuff from pistol start so might as well talk about each one: (Based on rushing the map, I don't like 100% runs)

 

E2M1 - The zombies at start can ruin a run if many of them hit you. Otherwise an easy map.

E2M2 - In all honesty I hate this map and just cheese it to exit without even shooting an imp.

E2M3 - Plasma and blue armor are enough to blitz it. Very easy map!

E2M4 - Very easy map. Nothing more.

E2M5 - Only needed to kill an imp. But got lost once because this map is a clusterfuck. Easy.

E2M6 - This map can get very brutal if you mess up even for a second. Still scared of it from all the nightmare runs it ended, Hate it the most!

E2M7 - Second hardest map in e2. But still easy (even though I wasted all the time punching stuff cuz why not)

E2M8 - Baby mode map. Didn't even bother replaying it.

E2M9 - Easy map. Doesn't take long even if you go for a max.

 

E3M1 - Very easy map, Just don't forget to get the shotgun.

E3M2 - Very easy map if you respect our caco overlords yoga session and never shoot even once in the map, otherwise RIP.

E3M3 - Got lost and found BFG, IDDQD and other stuff I had no idea that they existed, easy map.

E3M4 - Easy map. Had to tyson so much shit though, Killed myself first punching all the zombies and barons as well.

E3M5 - Skipped. I know it is easy but I have no patience for this crap anymore.

E3M6 - Easy or hard, depending on your luck!

E3M7 - Very hard and irritating if you don't know where to go to reach the exit otherwise easy. Needless to say I forgot where to go and swam in shit\10.

E3M8 - Another baby mode map.

E3M9 - See E3M1.

 

E4M1 - Like E2M1 but to the extreme. If shotgunners don't handicap you at start easy, otherwise hard.. Rocket launcher can carry you HARD here though.

E4M2 - Hard map. Requires way more strategy and cheesing than most maps. I cheesed the yellow key switch from above and telefragged the blue key baron. Way harder than E4M1 can ever hope to be.

E4M3 - Fuck this in pistol start. Sometimes you lose 80% of your hp before even starting to move and then you get rewarded with more shitscan and barons. I don't know if everyone knows a secret that makes this piece of shit more tolerable. Extra points for the blur sphere where the baron will 90% shoot you for most of your health.

E4M4 - Suddenly a very easy map, filler? No idea why does it give an iddqd soul sphere as well.

E4M5 - Very easy if you corner camp all the boring stupidly placed zombies and lost souls, hard if you try t rush -god forbid-.

E4M6 - Hard map. I swear the entrance of the lava blocked by cacos and spectres has to be the lamest shit in the entire Iwad. No way this shit is designed for pistol start.

E4M7 - Easy map although kinda fun and plays like the maps in E3. 

E4M8 - Baby mode map. Why is there so much ammo and resources, Romero really thinks that mastermind fight needs soul spheres and blue armors? The shotgunners somehow don't deal damage here since they are FINALLY placed with cover around them.

E4M9 - Very easy map.

 

Got very bored by now (I don't really like the gameplay in e4. Shotgunners chipping my health everywhere forcing me to slow the fuck down is boring as shit, And it doesn't feel like it is designed with pistol start in mind because of shit like e4m6 and e4m3). So I won't do Doom2 but I know all those maps like the back of my hand so I can't rate them fairly (all would get very easy rating :p).

 

I found e4m3 and e4m6 the most obnoxious maps to play. E4m2 feels fair compared to these 2 stupid maps.

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Ultimate Doom - E4M6: Against Thee Wickedly (This is even tougher than E4M1 and E4M2)

Doom 2 - Map20: Gotcha! (This one can really screw you over if you don't attempt to get the spiderdemon and cyberdemon infight with each other)

TNT - Map27: Mount Pain (It's the hardest map in the set, but for all the wrong reasons. Atrocious level design and enemy placement combined with little to no health)

Plutonia - All of them (From start to finish, this set is hard and never lets up. Map32: Go 2 It may be brutal, but it's a secret map and offers its own kind of challenge)

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The cyberdemon vs Mastermind is optional on Gotcha. Can be skipped even on pistol start.

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13 hours ago, T-Rex said:

Doom 2 - Map20: Gotcha! (This one can really screw you over if you don't attempt to get the spiderdemon and cyberdemon infight with each other)

In the same way how MAP08 can screw you over if you don't pick up the Invulnerability and don't attempt to get the Cyberdemon and Barons infight. You're clearly supposed to take advantage of the infighting rather than making the abovementioned "if" situation happen.

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Think about starting a new game in Doom 2 and going straight to MAP32 using idclev, without finding any secrets and fighting the cyberdemon!!

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On 2017/5/12 at 3:23 PM, AbhinandAnilDoomguy said:

Think about starting a new game in Doom 2 and going straight to MAP32 using idclev, without finding any secrets and fighting the cyberdemon!!

you still have rocket launcher and berserk, which is sufficient for most of those who know the idclev code.

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That map has IDDQD sphere, Megasphere and BFG9000.. Not to mention all the other stuff you don't even need to overkill the map.

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On ‎11‎/‎05‎/‎2017 at 3:47 AM, scifista42 said:

In the same way how MAP08 can screw you over if you don't pick up the Invulnerability and don't attempt to get the Cyberdemon and Barons infight. You're clearly supposed to take advantage of the infighting rather than making the abovementioned "if" situation happen.

True that, though with Map08, the number of Barons in the room can be able to kill the cyberdemon, while in Gotcha, it's all up to chance on who goes down first, and if the cyberdemon wins, you're going to have to be careful when attempting to finish him, cause you'll eat a rocket if you're not lucky.

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It would be hard to answer before, but trying to do pistol start UV of every map (something I didn't do ever before, I prefer to play a megawad in a row and keep my weapons) the one that I suffered through is MAP23 barrels of fun. Now, I like this one map normally, but from pistol start I had to die many times, because ammo was scarce and I ended up in the main area before going outside, blocked by pain elementals spawning more lost souls and demons on the stairs, with very few ammo. Definitely, if played with pistol start, MAP23 shows. I had an easier time even with Plutonia maps pistol start.

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