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Mechadon

Doom 64 for Doom II - /idgames link is up

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"Watch Your Step" is structurally as good as complete now.

I had to cut more elaborate shading from the starting area since I sunk into 170+ visplanes... highly annoying as it would have looked so much more atmospheric. Also other tids and pieces had to be removed... sigh.

On a more positive note - I added another secret area. There's way more to explore now in the map. Since a "shot door open/close" function is not available I had to change the way the main secrets' doors are triggered.

Gameplay is not complete as of yet - the teleport "on thing action" stuff is kinda hard to replicate.

 

 

DOOM00.png

DOOM02.png

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58 minutes ago, _bruce_ said:

Since a "shot door open/close" function is not available I had to change the way the main secrets' doors are triggered.

Gotta love how id only made specials when they needed them, instead of making a list of all possible combinations like with Boom.

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Guys, I need your assistance, please. In the "Dark Citadel" we can see this:

3UrAHWHm.jpg

 

I did the same decorative fire by using burning barrels (like in TNT Evilution):

nIlOsCUm.jpg

 

But in the Chocolate (and DOS) Doom burning barrel is the blocking obstacle and player can't go through it (like in (G)ZDoom, for example).

So, could we change this in dehacked? Or somebody uses those burning barrels in maps? Or we can...I don't know. That's why I'm asking.

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I don't know much about DeHackEd but I want to say I doubt it can change something like whether or not something is blocking. This may be one of the many places where something will need to be substituted in, like a lava pool or lava rock texture instead of fire.

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As far as I know DeHackEd can copy and paste some abilities from one item to another. So there are A LOT of obstacles which player can pass through in Vanilla Doom. Dead corpses or small candles, for example. Copy their "no blocking" ability to the burning barrel and it will work.

 

But if this burning barrel is spawned somewhere else in this PWAD...we'll get problems. That's why I'm asking for help.

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Dehacked can change blocking flags on objects actually (I tend to do that when making Boom maps so all of the hanging body objects are non-blocking, just to make my life a bit easier).

 

The only issue in this instance is I'm sure the burning barrels are being used in other maps somewhere, so I don't think it would be a good idea to make it unblocking without removing them from all of the other maps.  I could make a custom, non-blocking barrel object for this particular instance though (maybe replacing the dead lost soul object or something).  I'll have to check with Obsidian at some point to make sure there are enough usable frames to do that.

 

In the mean time DeXiaZ, just leave out the flames until I can see if there's a way to do this in the Dehacked.  You may want to think of a different way to represent the fire just in case its not feasible.

 

 

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It would be awesome to get the "Dead_Lost-Soul-fire" for this. But ok, if things will go bad I'll do the alternate version of this area.

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Is there any specific thing you want done to The Spiral? Running through it I saw no problems other than the monster placement feeling a bit over-zealous. 
 

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I most need an active mapper to be on standby when/if the map needs updates made to it (same goes for all of BaronOfStuff's maps).  This includes anything from fixing bugs to revamping the entire map (if need be).  I think those maps do need COOP placements, so that much could be done.  Smoothing out the gameplay probably wouldn't be a bad idea either, even though my idea of 'smooth' is a bit subjective.

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Off topic but why does Doom have a dead Lost Soul thing? What purpose does that serve?

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My guess is that its just a left over from development.  The Lost Soul must have had a corpse sprite at some point, or maybe one was planned.

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Ok, HERE WE GO. This archive includes 3 maps. Finished Map16 (changelog in the end of this post), Map16 without burning barrels and Map25 "Pitfalls" with small but important fix. Please update Map25 and Map16 in...the next build.

 

Changelog:

Map25:

- fixed non-gameplay areas for monsters who will "spawn" after some events - now it's totally non shown on automap (unless you'll use the "IDDT" cheat). I just forgot to include "show line as 1-sided on map" for joint-lines.

 

Map16:

-Fixed visplane overflow problem (from 189/128 to ~80/128)

-Fixed spawning events for monsters. For example, after you'll take the red key you will get the new horde of monsters like in the original Doom 64. Also you will spawn 2 pain elementals (1 monster for 1 line) when you'll pass through the "arrow-trap" lines (but only once).

-Fixed texture alignment, especially in the start area.

-Added revenants into library section and for red-key horde section (too many barons of hell, also you can easily use the colums to avoid revenant's fireballs).

-Library area uses the blocking sound system. So you'll never alert the whole area by 1 shot. But possibly need small rework but I suck at "blocking sound" events.

 

VXlvux1l.jpg

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15 hours ago, Mechadon said:

The only issue in this instance is I'm sure the burning barrels are being used in other maps somewhere, so I don't think it would be a good idea to make it unblocking without removing them from all of the other maps.  I could make a custom, non-blocking barrel object for this particular instance though (maybe replacing the dead lost soul object or something).  I'll have to check with Obsidian at some point to make sure there are enough usable frames to do that.

You don't need to worry about frames, just give it the same states as the burning barrel and ta-da, you have a non-blocking burning barrel.

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3 minutes ago, DeXiaZ said:

Ok, HERE WE GO. This archive includes 3 maps. Finished Map16 (changelog in the end of this post), Map16 without burning barrels and Map25 "Pitfalls" with small but important fix. Please update Map25 and Map16 in...the next build.

 

Changelog:

Map25:

- fixed non-gameplay areas for monsters who will "spawn" after some events - now it's totally non shown on automap (unless you'll use the "IDDT" cheat). I just forgot to include "show line as 1-sided on map" for joint-lines.

 

Map16:

-Fixed visplane overflow problem (from 189/128 to ~80/128)

-Fixed spawning events for monsters. For example, after you'll take the red key you will get the new horde of monsters like in the original Doom 64. Also you will spawn 2 pain elementals (1 monster for 1 line) when you'll pass through the "arrow-trap" lines (but only once).

-Added revenants into library section and for red-key horde section (too many barons of hell, also you can easily use the colums to avoid revenant's fireballs).

-Library area uses the blocking sound system. So you'll never alert the whole area by 1 shot. But possibly need small rework but I suck at "blocking sound" events.

 

VXlvux1l.jpg

You've got some margin, so what happens if you put the ceiling holes back? That room looks really bare without them; those ceiling lamps don't cut it.

 

I'd suggest using the grass floor instead of the marble floor, too, would tile better.

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29 minutes ago, Gez said:

You've got some margin, so what happens if you put the ceiling holes back?

You'll get the visplane overflow problem, obvious. Because every this hole cause the overheat. I've tried to bring those "holes" back and get overflow again. So for me it doesn't work.

 

Grass and sky in this edited area looks really weird. It's better to make it looks like a Cathedral. Also the secret place with sky and grass makes the effect that this area is the building. So that's why I've used marble textures for floor and ceiling.

Edited by DeXiaZ

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On 5/7/2017 at 5:04 AM, Gez said:

You don't need to worry about frames, just give it the same states as the burning barrel and ta-da, you have a non-blocking burning barrel.

That's true.  For some reason I was thinking it might be easier to make a custom sprite by using just the fire cropped from the top of the burning barrel.  But it would be easier to just replicate it and sink them into the ground.  That's probably what we'll do.

 

On 5/7/2017 at 5:26 AM, DeXiaZ said:

You'll get the visplane overflow problem, obvious. Because every this hole cause the overheat. I've tried to bring those "holes" back and get overflow again. So for me it doesn't work.

 

Grass and sky in this edited area looks really weird. It's better to make it looks like a Cathedral. Also the secret place with sky and grass makes the effect that this area is the building. So that's why I've used marble textures for floor and ceiling.

Hmmm, I think I ultimately have to agree with Gez here.  The before looked much better, and it seems like you could get away with doing something to preserve the sky and keep it under the limit.  That courtyard with the beams overhead is really iconic, I'd hate to see them removed.  If your not able to get it under the limit, maybe I can take a look at it later.

 

Thanks for the map updated by the way DeXiaZ!  I'll let you know once we get your custom burning barrels in the dehacked.

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Why does the sky affect visplanes? Please excuse my poor knowledge of vanilla engine workings.

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7 minutes ago, Nevander said:

Why does the sky affect visplanes? Please excuse my poor knowledge of vanilla engine workings.

Sky sectors are just regular sectors with the F_SKY1 flat. In the game it renders the sky, but the engine still treats it like a plain sector, which can push the engine over the limits. It all depends how the engine splits the sectors into planes.

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They aren't exactly regular - the engine can still collapse them into one even if the heights are different, but different light levels screw that up.

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I just meant that a sky sector can basically be treated like any other sector. Visplanes still apply. I'm only knowledgeable of the surface workings of the Doom engine.

 

In this particular case, the area isn't all that detailed, so I can't suggest anything offhand. Reshaping some of the sectors might help. Worst case, get rid of the skull indentations on the pillars. They look nice, but they bump the planes up.

 

Edit: To be more specific, the open sky ceilings add more to the overall look and atmosphere than the indentations on the pillars in my opinion.

Edited by Megalyth

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5 hours ago, DeXiaZ said:

Ok, as you all wish

 

L6hdHxjl.png

 

Also I've changed burning barrels into "dead lost souls".

It's still not the same without the iconic beams in the original. I'm going with what Megalyth said - remove the skull indentations on the pillars and add the beams back.

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1 hour ago, Impboy4 said:

It's still not the same without the iconic beams in the original. I'm going with what Megalyth said - remove the skull indentations on the pillars and add the beams back.

Do it. Let's see your result.

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Does a floating midtexture affect visplanes? YOu could put a line in front of each spot where there was the indentation and use the same texture and put it 1px in front of each spot, then raise the midtexture up until it is where it was in the original. Messy, but possibly a good solution.

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10 hours ago, Nevander said:

Does a floating midtexture affect visplanes? YOu could put a line in front of each spot where there was the indentation and use the same texture and put it 1px in front of each spot, then raise the midtexture up until it is where it was in the original. Messy, but possibly a good solution.

As far as I know visplanes affect only sectors. Textures and item-monster spawn doesn't affect visplanes (or affect on really small value)

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I wasn't expecting to rediscover Doom 64 for Doom II again. Last year, when the former project died for the third time, I expect it to be dead for good. Now I see dozens of new contributions. Great to see people were able to "respawn" it!

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No word on a new build yet.  I've been a bit too busy to do much with it.  But I have map updates ready and those will be easy enough to get in.  The big thing that I'm looking to do for the next release is the dehacked work, and that could take a little time.

 

Just keep working on your maps everyone, and I'll try to make some time to get a release out soon :)

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Nice work.

If any of you guys want to convert my EX maps to this engine then feel free.
I got quite a few DM maps and one finished single player map... which you can see here.
Check out my channel description for links to wads.

ULTIMATE BOSS FIGHT 

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