Turok 2: Seeds of Evil (Now in bundle with Turok1)

All three games are very different, and I've always seen T2 as this deliberately... well, deliberate kind of shooter, where you do headshots, snipe, etc. Making it all play like T1 would be kind of silly. If the original authors wanted it to, they'd just have copied the movement from T1. But it seems that Kaiser&co want to make everything play like doom or something.

And I'm not too optimistic about the "improvements" being toggleable. Frankly with all the liberties these remasters take, I'm almost surprised they thought to make the fog distance toggleable in the original. Still can't believe the unchanged levels weren't included as part of the package right off the bat...

Also yeah, I've read up how to launch T1 mods and levels, but thing is, it still doesn't work. I go through all the motions (subscribe, launch editor, open that last tab, select mod, click run with it, etc) and it still plays the changed level 1 when I select "normal start" or whatever it is, as the author says should work (in the comments to the workshop entry). I would just select the first level from the list but the list doesn't seem to be logically numbered and I've got things I'd rather do than search all 30+ entries for the first level.

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I'm personally looking forward to the increase in speed, Turok 2 is a 90's shooter at heart, why the hell did they make him move around like a wounded duck?

And if the levels retain the themes they were going for I also welcome a certain degree of streamlining. Nothing *too* drastic, just cut out the more copy-paste sections. The only reason they did that to begin with was due to the limitations of the console, and I appreciated it when they stripped that out of the original so I don't waste my time and the level flows nicer.

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12 hours ago, Antroid said:

Also yeah, I've read up how to launch T1 mods and levels, but thing is, it still doesn't work. I go through all the motions (subscribe, launch editor, open that last tab, select mod, click run with it, etc) and it still plays the changed level 1 when I select "normal start" or whatever it is, as the author says should work (in the comments to the workshop entry). I would just select the first level from the list but the list doesn't seem to be logically numbered and I've got things I'd rather do than search all 30+ entries for the first level.

The mod is working as you have the level list. You likely instead have developer mode enabled with external resources being loaded.

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7 hours ago, Edward850 said:

The mod is working as you have the level list. You likely instead have developer mode enabled with external resources being loaded.

Well, uh, that is a bit beyond my understanding of how to operate the editor and play with mods. I'm just doing what the steam thread on launching custom levels says, nothing more. But oh well, project64 works pretty alright with Turok 1 so I can always just play that for a totally authentic experience. Heck, my old PC version of T2 still works perfectly on this win7 PC (with whatever fan patches I've applied, can't remember) so it's nothing critical anyways.

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As a heads up, we release in... uh... 8 hours!? Yikes. Who has been stealing all the time?

Edited by Edward850
MATH

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11 minutes ago, CARRiON said:

Will there be a release discount of some kind?

Stephen announced that any owner of Turok1 on Steam will get a discount on Turok2. Couldn't tell you if there's a release discount in addition at this stage, though, although there was one for Turok1, so...

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Sounds nice, and it wasn't even two weeks ago that it was announced to be on Steam and here we are at 8 hours. The Time Lords stop for nobody.

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5 minutes ago, Edward850 said:

Stephen announced that any owner of Turok1 on Steam will get a discount on Turok2. Couldn't tell you if there's a release discount in addition at this stage, though, although there was one for Turok1, so...

Cool, I own Turok 1 on Steam so maybe I'll pick up Turok 2 early on Steam.

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nice. maybe this'll give me the kick to finally play Turok, since i bought it on Steam and all. :P

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Multiplayer is kind of buggy, but still really fun. Don't use the Firestorm Cannon though or you'll be about as dangerous as a wet fart.

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Got a 25% coupon on top of the one they have on the store as well so i managed to get it at almost half price, definitely worth it as well with the sheer amount of customisable options both visual and otherwise.

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3 hours ago, Doom64hunter said:

Multiplayer is kind of buggy, but still really fun. Don't use the Firestorm Cannon though or you'll be about as dangerous as a wet fart.

Strange, during development that thing was an overpowering menace, but I played it again today and something does seem off. Will investigate.

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So I tried it out. Only got through level 1 on hardcore so far, and nearly got through the riding gun section in level 2 but fell into a pit like a moron and stopped there. (It was totally not my fault either, why the heck would you bind the dino's charge attack to RMB and the little alternate cannon to jump?? I kept mixing those two up).

 

You know what? It plays so damn good that my inner purist almost immediately shut up. Literally, less than a minute into the game I forgot why I didn't want changes to the levels and gameplay. Well, no, maybe not the gameplay, as I do feel that the game lost some of its identity with the main character being so maneuverable, but that's not a big deal. It's still a great game, and much more accomodating to people who wouldn't have been conditioned to love the original as a child like I have, it being my first PC game and only PC FPS for a long time.

 

Now, there's still a lot of things I'd complain about. Though they're not things I expected. For one: IMO not enough graphical options. I would like to lower the contrast, for example, or turn down the sunlight or something, because level 1 is overly bright outside in some places but can be nearly pitch black inside. I would like being able to disable shadows (they produce some fugly artifacts in places, like in the beginning of level 3 there's a shadow of a tree on a cliffside for no reason) and those ugly perfectly round light flashes when someone shoots or bullets hit a wall.

 

Another thing, for all the talk about fixing the levels, almost every goddamn wall in level 1 (and so far many in level 2's beginning) has some broken geometry visible above it, and VERY clearly, too. Usually it's backs of the models from other areas and you can see that they're missing the back side polygons. There's so much of it it almost feels like it was deemed okay because otherwise it would be too much work to fix. And a lot of the architecure has quite prominent shading problems, probably due to a much more contrasted directional light from the sun (why is there a sun in an overcast level like level 1 anyways??).

 

There's also less common error-seeming things. Like there's a column that has its broken off top part not completely attached to its base part, so it kinda floats some centimiters above it. It's somewhere, I think, after that one little courtyard where you come down a slope, can jump on two roofs, one of which has a full health, and there's a respawning ammo/health place beyond some doors that has raptors in it, and there's also a passage to a little girl cage behind some crates. So I think the column in question is in whatever area's right after that. I've made a screenshot, I'll post it when I'm back home. Another weird thing is right at the beginning of level 1, across the bay there's a weird clump of a health pickup, a pistol clip and an arrow quiver all in the same place, inside each other - what's up with that?

 

Also, what's up with most raptors having an alternate, worse looking texture than the original one? It makes them look like asphalt.

 

And I hope enemies are supposed to be tougher on the hardcore difficulty, because as a veteran Turok 2 player, a pistol headshot not killing a dinosoid is just not right. Now you shoot their heads like three times and they explode, where before it was much more satisfying because you could land that one accurate shot and the head would just jerk back really quickly and they'd fall over dead. Maybe it works on lower difficulties?

 

I also couldn't get that death animation on a purr-linn where they get a huge hole in their belly. Props for making the chaingun motherfuckers actually properly vulnerable, though. That was a problem.

 

Some graphical things are really ugly. The blood decals (really flat), the game over graphic (looks out of place), and Joshua's head near the life counter (looks REALLY goofy) for example.

 

Some level alterations so far make no sense to me. That big coutryard where you can shoot down all the gulls and get access to an ultra health. Why is the switch opening the building with the key just down on the ground level now? You used to have to jump off from the top level into a room, it was kind of a babby's first neat jump. Was that breakable with the ledge grab? Surely it couldn't have been deemed too difficult. Or just to remove like 20 seconds of backtracking?

 

There's also some other minor things that kinda bother me. Why can't you skip the level intros? You can disable them, but going into the options and disabling them and then enabling them again just to avoid watching one specific cutscene is really stupid. Not to mention you can't even open a menu or load a game when a cutscene's playing. That's REALLY bad. Also, changing the OST doesn't do anything until you force the music to restart. Maybe restart it automatically when the player changes that option, like the sound device option in zdoom?

 

But anyway, my long and scattered complaints aside, I fucking love this remaster. The ledge-grabbing surprisingly didn't bother me (though it's really inconsistent because some obstacles are infinitely tall despite looking to be the same ledge-grabbable height), the little level alterations didn't bother me for the most part, and I actually really liked the all-new area in level 1 in the boat section (I got hit with this powerful wave of the good old feeling of exploration and immersion, as if I was playing this game for the first time again, and just because of a little new addition! That was a great feeling). Even if it's not as faithful as I would've hoped, it plays too damn well to complain about. Kinda reminds me of Doom 2016 in that regard, which I also thought was nothing like the original but an amazing game in its own right.

Edited by Antroid
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Honestly once I saw the movement wasn't race car speed like in the first game (he really is a bit too fast for his own good) it was already a definite notable improvement over the slog speed of the original. I remember having a helluva time years back when I tried to give it an honest go on Hard after playing the first game on Hard and found myself getting cheesed by the relentless projectiles of Endtrails sniping away at me in open areas, which do a lot of damage on Hard and not affording me the time to snipe, let alone run through as there are enemies obscuring my path as well. Maybe if I was able to actually run and side step properly I could've avoided this artificial difficulty moment but Turok 2 is definitely more challenging on Hard unlike the first game since the enemies are a lot more mobile, so naturally it can come off as being harder than it should be when your character lacks the mobility to put it on even ground. That won't be a problem anymore and playing on Hard will be a nice challenge without feeling like I'm at a disadvantage. What does Hardcore exactly do BTW? I forgot the Turok 1 remaster includes a Hardcore as well, is it just ludicrous HP and damage boosts for the enemies or something more interesting?

As far as a nitpick is concerned outside of some visual anomalies, inconsistent performance, vsync not working correctly (still tearing at times as it goes over 60) and the flashlight being broken (projects no light source) all of which I'm sure will get addressed, I think the new blood decals look out of place and clash with the original blood as they're too bright and flat looking. Otherwise I'm impressed with the new Kex engine and the baked lighting/shading into the levels really adds more depth to the scenes.

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3 minutes ago, cyan0s1s said:

What does Hardcore exactly do BTW? I forgot the Turok 1 remaster includes a Hardcore as well, is it just ludicrous HP and damage boosts for the enemies or something more interesting?

Makes enemies attack more aggressively, gives them twice as much health, gives them a very tiny pain chance, sets lives to 1 (and maximum) and removes all means of getting more lives (so it's the save system or nothing, no death shortcuts), unlocks an unmentioned cheat upon completion, and makes the player take 4 times the damage of normal. It also has its own level spawn flags (all difficulties do) although I'm unsure if Kaiser added anything that uses it.

 

10 minutes ago, cyan0s1s said:

inconsistent performance, vsync not working correctly (still tearing at times as it goes over 60) and the flashlight being broken (projects no light source)

Make sure you are running in Fullscreen for vsync to take any affect. Also, you need to restart for vsync settings to apply. We know of the flashlight issue and it's an issue with AMD as per usual. We think we've found the solution to that.

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13 minutes ago, Edward850 said:

We know of the flashlight issue and it's an issue with AMD as per usual.

Is the issue that there's no light at all? In my game it just puts a very, very small light at the player's location. I don't remember exactly how it was in the original because I rarely even had it working properly in emulators... but the tiny and pretty much useless player-parented light could be called "projects no light" since it doesn't really "project" (the way, say, half-life does). I have a geforce something something 560 ti or whatever if that matters.

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So here's the magical column I mentioned before. Also, this seems weird... And, well, tons of stuff like this.

 

On another note, why are the turrets in the dino riding section so hilariously useless? Some don't even shoot straight at me, and judging by how I pick up items, my hitbox as a dinosaur feels super slim...

 

And please, I beg you, let me remove the hideous spherical dynamic lights!

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I bought it but didn't expect it to need a higher opengl version, oh well, time to refund, fuck this laptop.

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I'm very much enjoying this! Even though I accidentally ran out of VRAM trying to open the map (to be fair, I'd tried cranking most of the graphics settings as high as they'd go, and my video card's only 1 GB), the game runs pretty damn well, and you've managed to create an experience vastly preferable to the N64 original.

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We have uploaded a new patch update today, which is in beta form on Steam for a couple of days: http://steamcommunity.com/app/405830/discussions/0/135512133546942918/

 

Quote

1.5.1 Patch Notes
===========

Single-Player Gameplay
======================
* Actors scheduled to trigger when a level ends will be immediately triggered
* No more crash or multiple teleports when entering Adon's checkpoints
* A clipping error was repaired in River of Souls
* The Tek Bow can now snipe with normal arrows after loading a saved game
* Improved player clipping near bridges
* Sunfire Pods can now set fire to and kill Blind Ones
* Improved behavior when unlocking levels, may fix game-breaking glitch with missing keys
* The Primagen can no longer become stuck in mid-air between phases 2 and 3 of his battle
* An infrequent crash during the Primagen boss fight has been fixed
* Player skin sounds no longer carry over from multiplayer games
* Quicksave slot can now be loaded from the Load Game menu, including from the titlescreen
* Blind One and Queen boss warp cheats are no longer reversed
* It is no longer possible to save the game when dead or when at the game over screen
* Shredder is now treated with higher selection priority than the shotgun
* A crash when re-entering a specific area of Lair of the Blind Ones has been fixed
* Queen Boss mite spawning rate has been limited
* Improved AI leashing behavior - enemies will not return to their idle locations if they 
can currently see the player or their target
* Hidden enemy appearance particle effect will occur less often with partially hidden enemies
* It should no longer be possible to become stuck in the Death Marshes due to missing ammo bunker door locks
* Changing weapons is no longer possible while riding the Styracosaur
* Death animation now fully stops instead of looping. This addresses a bad looping behavior in one of the flesh eater models

Local and Network Multiplayer
=============================
* Stability improvements
* Bandwidth usage improvements
* Local player setup will always be fully completed for splitscreen
* Private lobbies now function properly
* Player radius is properly restored when becoming or ceasing to be the Monkey in Frag Tag
* The nuke weapon will appear more rarely in Rok Mix mode
* Local players in splitscreen can now independently change their ammo types
* A point where the player could get stuck in the Port of Adia MP map has been repaired

==Audio==
* Volume of ambient lava sounds reduced
* Adon now announces the finding of Primagen keys
* Tek arrow wind-up sound is no longer global, and is more consistent
* Unique Raptoid sound effects from the N64 version have been imported
* Turok now has unique pain sounds when taking damage from low oxygen while swimming
* Shredder and shotgun firing sound effects improved
* High-pitched noise eliminated from sound samples

Renderer / Graphics
====================
* Shader language version 4.00 is now properly accepted
* Bloom: Opacity and intensity can now be set by the user
* Optimizations for masked texture rendering and deferred shadow maps
* AMD-specific fix for flashlight, deferred decals, and SAO
* Pipeline synchronization is now an end-user option and is no longer enabled by default
* Actor outlining effects now cooperate properly with resolution scaling

User Interface
==============
* Video resolution setting will be saved without having to exit the game
* Font size increased on Bindings menu
* Clearer distinction between Exit to Title and Quit in English and French languages
* Support for AMD GPU memory queries on the graphics option menu
* Technical graphics options menu added
* Users with ISO European keyboards can now access the console, and can bind two additional 
language-specific keys on the keyboard to actions
* Options added to control all forms of player head bobbing and tilting
* Step values have been tweaked for all slider-type options
* Mouse smoothing is now available from the menus, and no longer crashes the game if set to zero

Misc
====
* "Operation completed successfully" is no longer reported as an error if GL context creation fails
* Lag reduced when messages are added to the console
* Crash in math routine repaired

 

Edited by Edward850

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Well, I'll look forward to the GOG update sometime soon.  Hopefully, my issue will be fixed. :)

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I ran through this on normal and hardcore mode in the past several days. Just like with the first remaster, I am super impressed with this. Turok 2 is such a great game, but trying to play it on the N64 was such a nightmare due to the abysmal framerate, and the original PC version was always very unstable for me. This is definitely the definitive way to play the game now, and I'm super happy that this has finally come out.

 

I've only had a few minor grievances so far, but nothing at all major. Looking at the most recent changelog, I can see a few of them have already been dealt with, so that is good to see. I only had one crash on that Primagen's Lightship, during one of the fan/tunnel sequences. Other than that, no game-breaking issues. It was definitely fun to play through this game again in a much more tightly-controlled manner, and it's absolutely worth it if you have ever played or liked Turok 2 in the past. As per usual, just ignore the incomprehensibly pants-on-head retarded people going "wow this is a ripof its not remastred..." or "its an emulator" or anything like that. There's no hope for those people.

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25 minutes ago, Bashe said:

As per usual, just ignore the incomprehensibly pants-on-head retarded people going "wow this is a ripof its not remastred..." or "its an emulator" or anything like that. There's no hope for those people.

Or the people who don't understand how royalties work and complain about a near 20 year old game being $20.

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Heads up, we've pushed 1.5.1 to main (so all people should have 1.5.1 now), including a few additional changes. This includes an update to the GOG version as well.

Once updated, there's a complete changelog in the main menu. For some free framerate, disable force pipeline sync in the technical graphics options (for real this time).

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Hiya folks, we are still doing patches to Turok2, would you believe? New update in the beta branch:

Quote

Beta Update #2 Patch Notes (KEX Engine 1.5.2)


===========

Single-Player Gameplay
======================
* Show both ammo types in the HUD when weapon has two
* Bug fixes with particle splash damage (non-explosive) setting off event link triggers
* All generators that spawn random ammo now works
* Minor collision fixes in first Death Marsh level
* Fixed situation where player could become trapped in the spider-health trap chamber in River of Souls
* Crash fix when switching levels while enemies are being triggered by an event

Renderer / Graphics
====================
* Major performance gain in the main world deferred shader

Local and Network Multiplayer
=============================
* Improved situations where protocol commands would become over-throttled when sending to latent nodes.
* Experimental multithreaded packet transmission (cl_multithreadpackets)

Audio
====================
* Do not apply cvarVolume to SFX_VOICE effects as they have already been scaled by voice volume

User Interface
==============
* Ability to delete save games

As a side note, If you are noticing performance problems while hosting a server with large player numbers, you can experiment turning cl_multithreadpackets on (cl_multithreadpackets 1 in the console) and see if that improves the situation. This can/has to be done while the game is already running (the value isn't remembered for now and defaults to off). Tell me if everything crashes or not if you try this.

Edited by Edward850
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Oh look more change logs! Up on both Steam and GOG Galaxy.

Quote

 

1.5.2 Patch Notes
===========

Single-Player Gameplay

  • Show both ammo types in the HUD for weapons with alternate ammo types
  • Bug fixes for particle splash damage (non-explosive) setting off event link triggers
  • All generators that should spawn random ammo now work
  • Minor collision fixes in first Death Marsh level
  • Fixed situation where player could become trapped in the spider-health trap chamber in River of Souls
  • Fixed a crash when switching levels while enemies are being triggered by an event
  • Charge dart now consumes 2 to 3 ammo based on charge level
  • Wasp enemies are now more aggressive and will become responsive after being spawned
  • Added fog effects to graveyard levels
  • Tweaked razor wind to be more effective against enemies with metallic parts
  • Trap doors in the crystal rooms in Lair of the Bline Ones now closes instantly, preventing sequence breaks
  • Turrets will now cease firing if the target is obstructed


Renderer / Graphics

 

  • Major performance gain in the main world deferred shader
  • Addressed the 'checkerboard pattern' rendering glitch by avoiding depth buffer blitting,
  • Non-deferred blood decals now adopt the proper red or green coloration depending on their source,

Local and Network Multiplayer

 

  • Improved situations where protocol commands would become over-throttled when sending to latent nodes.
  • Multithreaded packet transmission (which is on by default)
  • New multiplayer chat message system
  • Fixed issue with connecting to lobbies from startup
  • Rebalanced damage curve of charge-dart against players
  • Added mod and version filters to the multiplayer server lists
  • Added support for changing the network transmission speed of the client/server (lower speeds reduces bandwidth requirements)
  • Added support for custom map rotations
  • Fixed an issue where team-games wouldn't clear their scores properly on map change
  • Improved the reliability of sending information such as the scoreboard when a player connects to a game
  • Numerous weapon balance and tweaks
  • Three N64 multiplayer maps added (Bullseye, Crazy Eight, Experimentata)
  •  
Audio

 

  • Voice volume setting is now independent of sound effect volume
  • Support added for German localized voices

 

User Interface

 

  • Ability to delete save games

 

Misc

 

  • Fixed collision detection issue when shooting at an object that is up against a wall
  • Better detection for avoiding pickups behind walls and other obstructions

 

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