"UMAPINFO" discussion (prev: Why is it MAPINFO is avoided by most 'vanilla true' ports?)

2 hours ago, esselfortium said:
  • Is there any plan for allowing sourceport-specific keys in this, so that users are less likely to feel the need to create 18 different mapinfos?

It doesn't seem like there was an authoritative decision on this, but enough people (inc. Quas & Graf) were in favor of the prefix approach (e.g. "zdoom.fancyproperty"; no parser changes required) that it's really worth declaring official at this point, if said key people would be so kind.

 

 

Related word of warning to @printz and @Altazimuth: The linked doc doesn't appear to be up to date; it doesn't reflect the curly brace syntax change.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post

This is really exciting,  I've wanted this feature for so long and we're finally on the brink of it becoming a reality! @bradharding @DaniJAny plans for your source ports to add this? 

Edited by Death Egg
Had to get @s working

Posted (edited)

Share this post


Link to post

Note that the syntax has changed to use curly braces. This was mainly done to use a real tokenizer. The orignal parser wasn't really that great.

The actual keywords haven't changed at all.

 

2 hours ago, esselfortium said:

Is there any plan for allowing sourceport-specific keys in this, so that users are less likely to feel the need to create 18 different mapinfos?

 

The format was designed to be able to skip over unknown keys, so yes, that should be doable.

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post

I'd like a text file more than code, especially if it uses curly braces, which are supported as "EDF"/libConfuse in Eternity.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
18 hours ago, Quasar said:

I had believed @printz and @Altazimuth were going to handle this stuff. I'm really busy given that I'm now a full-time dev for Nightdive so I've been avoiding these threads until they shifted from debate to a functional implementation.

I think a lot of devs are doing precisely the same thing, which makes sense. Best of luck at Nightdive!

14 hours ago, printz said:

Mostly not wanting to spend time on idle chatter about this until something concrete is done.

Yep, makes sense.

8 hours ago, esselfortium said:

Looks nice, it will be great to see this in some ports!

 

I have a couple questions:

  • Which font is meant by the "HUD font"?
  • Is there any plan for allowing sourceport-specific keys in this, so that users are less likely to feel the need to create 18 different mapinfos?

Give it time to materialize before it matures...you know, the 'walk before you run' thing.

Share this post


Link to post
18 hours ago, Ribbiks said:

Out of curiosity: I probably don't really know what I am talking about, but is stuff like "allow_jumping" or "force_pistolstart" is out of scope for this? Does UDMF cover this?

It seems like set of simple features that all semi-advanced or advanced ports should be able to support, but it might be not standardized for some historical reason.

Share this post


Link to post
16 hours ago, Xaser said:

Is there any plan for allowing sourceport-specific keys in this, so that users are less likely to feel the need to create 18 different mapinfos?

The feature set of the base spec is what a basic Doom port supports, not enhanced things only implemented by feature-centric ports. This stuff is for later.

 

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
8 hours ago, Bluefox_1 said:

Out of curiosity: I probably don't really know what I am talking about, but is stuff like "allow_jumping" or "force_pistolstart" is out of scope for this? Does UDMF cover this?

It seems like set of simple features that all semi-advanced or advanced ports should be able to support, but it might be not standardized for some historical reason.

Well not all ports feature jumping, so it wouldn't be a feature of UMAPINFO.  For now this just covers things present in the original Doom.

 

Force Pistol start might be useful, although there'd need to be some discussion about the best way to implement it (either one method for all ports, or perhaps ports could implement their own method if the end result is the same).  Again, probably not for version 1.  

 

Edited by Bauul

Posted (edited)

Share this post


Link to post

@Graf Zahl Both printz and I are waiting for specs on the new lump. An updated version of what was already there would be much appreciated.

Personally, I'm busy between weapons-branch work and looking for a new dog; regardless, I don't feel like I'm in any position to attempt to construct an example lump based on reading the parser's code.

Share this post


Link to post

I'll try to get one done on Monday or Tuesday.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post

I feel ultimately that the reason people avoid MAPINFO when they want a more vanilla experience is because using it instantly makes Boom ports unusable. MAPINFO is a zdoom/gzdoom feature only, so if you use it to change the levels you go to or anything like that, it simply wont work.

Share this post


Link to post

Is the use of timeline.jpg still banned nowadays?

Share this post


Link to post
On 7/8/2017 at 4:17 AM, Altazimuth said:

looking for a new dog

I knew there was something I liked about you ;)

Share this post


Link to post

@Phade102The original question wasn't why mappers avoid it, but why other source ports like PRBoom+ avoid it. 

 

Although with a bit of luck, hopefully they won't for much longer. 

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, Bauul said:

@Phade102The original question wasn't why mappers avoid it, but why other source ports like PRBoom+ avoid it. 

 

Although with a bit of luck, hopefully they won't for much longer. 

I agree. it it became something that  PRBoom+ could use, it would completely remove any sort of issues with it.

Share this post


Link to post
On 7/8/2017 at 3:40 PM, Phade102 said:

I feel ultimately that the reason people avoid MAPINFO when they want a more vanilla experience is because using it instantly makes Boom ports unusable. MAPINFO is a zdoom/gzdoom feature only, so if you use it to change the levels you go to or anything like that, it simply wont work.

Right: The reason MAPINFO was not used was simply because ports never implemented it in a standard way, or at all. That will soon be a thing of the past!

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post

Trying to look into this today; hopefully XL parser will be able to handle this if slightly extended. EDF cannot due to the ; for comments (# would work though). If I can't get this done today then I just won't be able to do it myself, as we found a dog to adopt and she will be arriving home tomorrow.

Share this post


Link to post

You also could just use the parser that is included... ;)

 

Share this post


Link to post

@Graf Zahl: does UMAPINFO allow single-line text? Like this:

 

map jackson{levelname="michael jackson"endgame=false partime=30}

 

Share this post


Link to post

"Enterpic" from UMAPINFO doesn't look like anything familiar to Doom. Only exitpic (intermission pic) is expected. Enter pic looks like something that would need adding bigger features for.

Share this post


Link to post

Have a look at the code in my Github repo and check out the changes. It's far less work than you may think. Most in there should be directly usable in Eternity as well, considering that wi_stuff hasn't changed that much.

 

The main motivation here was to allow clean transitions between Doom 1 levels from different episodes and show the proper map for each screen. Expanding that to a user-definable feature was very little work after that.

 

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now