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The_SloVinator

Here is my problem with making maps.

My struggle with mapping.  

29 members have voted

  1. 1. What should I do?

    • Continue mapping & never give up.
      27
    • Drop it altogether & find something else to do.
      2


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It seems that I came up to the point where I can't take it anymore. I need to get to the bottom of the issue I have.

I play a PWAD. I get ideas & inspirations for making maps. I put them in gzbuilder & then I run out of the ideas.

I keep digging through the new thoughts for the maps till I find something. I put that in my map & see it not fit. Delete it &

continue thinking about new areas & such.

 

What bothers me is, this is such a slow process. I make barely any progress with my wad. And it's a constant dilemma if I should make

classic Doom levels or more detailed & realistic looking. That's another problem.

 

This sounds ridiculous but I do get headache because of this. Sometimes I feel sick about my confidence of making something for the community.

 

Here are the questions. Is mapping just not my thing? If it wasn't, why is something dragging me back to it? Why do I get very confident & then

the next second, I lose that confidence completely & remove the stuff I made?

 

It's convoluted as shit, that's for sure. It's frustrating.

 

I made a poll for you guys to vote if I should continue or drop it for good. I always dreamt about showing off my talent to doom community but it seems I probably don't have it. I dunno.

 

I hope you guys are willing to help.

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Uhh...have you tried not deleting the parts of your maps? Instead, you should combine it and there you have a map. Or share your work to the community or something like that...

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Sometimes, i have the same problem.And i do think that's a part of making something. I got a bunch of friends that draw beautiful pictures, and they have the same problem.

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Try looking at the tools available to you, and think about situations where you can you them. Example, i built my entire confinement entry around scroll floor/move things action, and i did everything possible, like teleporting enemies, "scripts" with voodoo dolls, etc etc. Believe in yourself, and dont forget to take brakes, noone forces you to make a wad, or holding a gun to your head. 

Edited by Poohlyash : I just remembered that Yourselph is not a word

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It sounds like you're way too harsh on yourself and have mapper's block. I have this problem too, but I'm slowly working on my stuff one-two hours per day. To get myself motivated I put new track instead of D_RUNNIN and put some new textures in map or just draw maps on paper. I don't know if they help to improve your maps - try post map screenshots in picture threads, ask for help and maybe someone will willing you lend hand and check your maps. Maybe they're not so bad as you think. Just remember, patience is the key and everything comes with experience. 

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Try to draw your ideas on paper before opening Doom Builder. Then, when you some solid layout and ideas, start mapping out. It's hard (at least for me) to try to do everything without having any reference to begin, so take one step of each time. When I'm mapping, I usually some sort of proccess in my mind: Get Ideas -> Draw Sketches -> Build Main geometry (without textures, anything) -> Place main items (weapons and keys) -> Make the level finishable adding events (again, without textures and enemies) -> Do basic texturing -> Place things -> Decorate -> Test.

 

It doesn't need to be something weird like this, but just going to Doom Build without having any organized ideas at first is a lot more hard. Also, even if the result isn't the best, I'd recommend to finish the level (or at least the first ones), and then see what you can improve from it.

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Same problem here i make Maps that go with what i think suits better in my opinion, if you played my maps you will know that they are not like Doom classic, this is both a bad thing and a good thing, its bad because it will not have the same level as the old dooms where every room you went it united with each other, and the good thing its that is different and new instead of the same maps with limitations

 

I like high tall buildings, im inspired sometimes to make maps inside a building or either get to the building idk why but there's something that i like about it.

 

In conclusion i like mapping im not a professional one, but neither a terrible one im between Good and mediocre.

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1 hour ago, Soldier993 said:

I put them in gzbuilder & then I run out of the ideas.

I keep digging through the new thoughts for the maps till I find something. I put that in my map & see it not fit. Delete it &

continue thinking about new areas & such.

It sounds like you're giving up too quickly. I'm not sure what you mean by "not fit," because there are a million ways to make things fit together and most combinations of rooms will eventually work somehow if you keep editing them.

 

If you've attempted to put your ideas down and you ended up with just a bunch of bland, empty rectangles that you hate, then congratulations! You've completed step 1 of mapping. Next comes room shaping, cover, height variation, light detailing, monster/weapon placement, testing, lighting, item placement, final detailing, and more testing, in some order. Point is, if you take a look at what you've put down and then delete it, you're most likely doing the first one or two steps over and over again, and then quitting before you have something good every time, rather than learning how to take your basic shapes and concepts and make them into playable maps. It shouldn't even matter if the first few maps you finish are terrible; it's just part of the learning process, and eventually you will figure out what you're doing, especially if you put your maps up on the forums and get feedback from people who play them.

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Disappointment is possible only if you have expectations. When I was playing with legos as a kid, I don't remember ever being dissatisfied with whatever I created. That simply wasn't my concern. My goal was to have fun playing with the blocks, not to make something awesome or impress someone.

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1 more thing to toss out that i forgot.

 

2kliiksphilip has some videos that are related to Game development here they are

 

 

 

 

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Focus on quantity, just make a map, and fuck everything else. No matter how bad it will look to you. Just. Make. Map. Do it in one take without interruption. If you want to interrupt, never come back to that map and start next one.

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pls rember that wen u feel scare or frigten never forget ttimes wen u feeled happy

wen day is dark alway rember happy day

~.jpg

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This is a completely normal and common problem with any creative process. No artist is ever satisfied with their own work, there are always errors that they try to hide and then try to not make on their next work. The only way forward (unless you want to take 3 years per map) is to embrace your "warts" and just let them be a part of the process. Well, you could also do what most people do and just get so stoned you don't know what's real anymore.

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Echoing what others have said here already, don't be so hard on yourself. Much like anything else that is based on creativity, ideas come and go. It's probably best not to stare at the screen waiting for the big idea for hours on end, because most likely that doesn't work too well. Try mapping only when you're in the mood to do so, because everything else is probably just self-flaggelation.

 

Also, smaller maps early on might be a good idea. You get feedback faster, and that will help you improve faster.

 

As for deleting sections, it really depends... At times it's best to try and keep them, to make them work, at times you may have had an idea that just doesn't work so well in general. Being able to identify what's what comes with experience. But if you ever find yourself working on the same area over and over again without getting a result that you like, it's probably best to lift the area from the map, so you have a fresh sheet of paper, ready for new ideas.

 

Of course neither my advice, nor the advice of anybody else here is something that is always true for everybody, we're all different after all. You do what you think makes the most sense, and if you end up having fun, then that's what's truly important.

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Something that I have to remind myself sometimes is that a map is usually not just a super cool room that's inspired by the best parts of a map I played, or a sweet screenshot I saw.

 

Although the process works for some people, a map is rarely just a string or web of connected rooms. A map is separate parts. Theres a beginning, middle, and end. And there's a degree of concentrated attention that should be applied to each of these parts. Within those parts comes with particular player goals and objectives (like get yellow key, or get nice weapon, or survive nasty trap) and focusing on these small events as individual parts of a complete map should keep the map building process pretty focused.

 

I also highly advise drawing and planning maps on paper, as its a great visual aid to reference how close your map is to complete. In general I make my drawings very sloppy (detailing and shaping rooms to look good in game comes naturally to me in the editor) The rooms look more like deflated balloons attached by doorways but I write fun obstacle ideas like platforming segments, or double cyberdemon battle or something so I know what I'm doing in the editor.

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So, what I have gathered from you guys:

 

- Patience

- Planning

- Not forcing yourself

- Low expectations

- Most importantly: Have fun & take breaks.

 

Alright. I'll take these into consideration. Thank you very much & thank you for the links.

And everyone voted for me to not give up. Gotcha!

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There are many varying philosophies, but I don't personally believe in the "don't force yourself" and "only do it if it's fun" ones. I usually set aside 1-2 hours in a day to just map, with the mindset of "let's get this thing done" and not wait around for that blue moon inspiration.

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Yeah, mapping is certainly work for me too. Its the rewards that make the pursuit so exciting.

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If you do mapping because you enjoy the creative process, don't force yourself. If you do mapping because you want to achieve results with it, force yourself as much as how good you want the results to be, how soon you want them to be done, or how strongly you want them to be done at all. If you do mapping due to a combination of the abovementioned motivations, try following a combination of the abovementioned advices. :)

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23 hours ago, Soldier993 said:

What bothers me is, this is such a slow process. I make barely any progress with my wad. And it's a constant dilemma if I should make

classic Doom levels or more detailed & realistic looking. That's another problem.

 

Make maps you like aesthetically, and you enjoy to play

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The only part you need is the inspiration and ideas. About aesthetics, make it as you like, generally when you have an idea aesthetics come with it so you don't have to adapt the map for new aesthetics.

 

"This sounds ridiculous but I do get headache because of this. Sometimes I feel sick about my confidence of making something for the community."

That is because you feel that your work could cause dome impact or you fear being judged, you have expectations or feel responsible for something.

The only thing that works is making the things you want, even if you map for a minority because the only one who has to be proud of your maps is you.

 

"Here are the questions. Is mapping just not my thing? If it wasn't, why is something dragging me back to it? Why do I get very confident & then

the next second, I lose that confidence completely & remove the stuff I made?"

Mapping is not a job, you map if you want, if you enjoy it. Confidence issues can be very destructive for your inspiration and execution, just listen to the advises in the forum, you'll have to negotiate between your ideas and their suggestions, you'll fail many times but you could be better over the time. Don't delete your maps, just stay away from them for a while, then comeback and see it with different eyes and see what can be improved.

Start with a small map, post it and receive suggestions, you could end up with a nice one.

 

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Take a break. Play some other user maps and see if you can get some ideas. Write them down (via Notepad/on paper) on interesting ideas you come across.

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On 7/21/2017 at 3:47 PM, Soldier993 said:

I get ideas & inspirations for making maps. I put them in gzbuilder & then I run out of the ideas.

Ideas... inspirations... ideas...

 

I think this is the problem. You start working on ideas. And this is good, a good map is made of interesting ideas. But you probably are missing is an overall theme to the level. Something that binds all the ideas into a single vision. Like: a flooded base infested with vines. Space demon temple.

 

If you have an overall theme you can keep mapping following the theme even when you're running out of ideas. And having a theme is a good way to create new ideas.

 

 

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