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Cipher

What to play after Plutonia?

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Finally finishing a blind UV run of Plutonia (currently on level 25; should be able to finish it sometime within the next week, depending on how many tries the final levels take), and wondering what to play next among pwad releases.

 

A little background: Plutonia is definitely my favorite of the four iwads, and I particularly like that, while it's difficult, its maps are all short and memorable enough to not feel like slogs. I like that they simply require you to figure them out and "solve" them, in terms of how to approach each encounter and what order to visit areas in. I also like that most of its encounters are fair--there are "gotcha" moments, but most are escapable and there's very little randomness. So I'm looking for something to be the next step up in difficulty while, preferably, retaining the short, arcadey levels. Fewer enemies with more challenging placement, etc.

 

Other background:

-I love all of maps 1-11 in Plutonia, and have been enjoying episode 3 so far as well.

-I think the only level I've really disliked in it was Map19, "NME," where the fact that most encounters are incredibly tedious (lots of rocket sniping while you wait for enemies to teleport in), combined with the unusually high number of unforeseeable death traps makes playing through blind a slog, unusual for the campaign

-I really don't want super-long levels, and from my experience that's something a lot of megawads tend to run into

 

What's next? Definitely thinking about Scythe, which seems to have the kind of gameplay I want, but maybe my impressions are off. There are also the several fan-made Plutonia sequels, but I've heard some of them are aesthetics-only matches that don't really capture the short, arcadey levels. Maybe there are other things I should be looking at. I'd also like to not bite off a ton more than I can chew, in terms of difficulty. So ideally something that's achievable on UV continuous without saves, without being a speedrunner or twenty-year veteran. (Or maybe something that is crazy-hard on UV, but has a lower difficulty that's around Plutonia+1?)

 

I should probably finish TNT sometime too ...

 

Anyway, thanks for the suggestions!

Edited by Cipher

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Like you said, definitely Scythe, almost all maps are short, but also expect high numbers of monsters and maybe hours of playing in the last maps. Also, Plutinya (or Plutynia?) Experiment is like 3-6 minutes each map, according to some videos. If not, there are some classics like Requiem or Memento Mori, those are not Plutonia-like as a whole but you will find a couple random maps made by the Casali brothers (the ones who made Plutonia). Alien Vendetta follows Plutonia's range of difficulty, although many maps tend to be incredibly long and that's not what you're looking for...  

 

That's all I can recommend for now, my trajectory is still short.

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45 minutes ago, galileo31dos01 said:

Like you said, definitely Scythe, almost all maps are short, but also expect high numbers of monsters and maybe hours of playing in the last maps. Also, Plutinya (or Plutynia?) Experiment is like 3-6 minutes each map, according to some videos.

Oh! That's appealing. Will have to look that one up.

 

Also, good to get another recommendation on Scythe. I know its final level is slaughtery, but earlier on it looks pretty Plutonia-esque, if a bit harder.

 

Hours to get past maps is also fine; I've definitely spent that long on some of Plutonia's, averaging around three or four deaths per level (I've only managed to get through a few on first attempt). I just like that they're compact in design; makes replaying them after dying more fun.

Edited by Cipher

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Scythe definitely, but if you want short, fast-paced classic levels, I'd do something like Perdition's Gate. It was almost in Final Doom, but the authors missed a deadline or something I dunno. But it's pretty good, not too difficult, but still pretty fun. You can also play Hell to Pay, its sister wad, but Hell to Pay is more of a partial conversion and features lots of custom sprites and sounds (which i frickin loved, but not everybody agrees ;~;).

 

So if you're looking for a slightly easier game with "short, arcadey levels", I'd shoot for Perdition's Gate and then Scythe. You could honestly beat Perdition's Gate on UV in one session if you really wanted to. If not, you'll almost definitely beat it in two, three, possibly four sessions if you're a slowpoke.

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29 minutes ago, Myst.Haruko said:

I guess, Urania and unofficial Plutonia sequels?

I guess that's part of what I was looking for more input on. I've read mixed reviews on those, and was under the impression that the Plutonia fan sequels weren't all necessarily the best continuation of its gameplay.

 

10 minutes ago, bonnie said:

So if you're looking for a slightly easier game with "short, arcadey levels", I'd shoot for Perdition's Gate and then Scythe. You could honestly beat Perdition's Gate on UV in one session if you really wanted to. If not, you'll almost definitely beat it in two, three, possibly four sessions if you're a slowpoke.

The two Wraith Corp. wads were definitely on my radar to play through at some point! Wouldn't have considered Perdition's Gate as a Plutonia follow-up, but if it can be beaten that quickly, maybe it'd be a fun break.

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7 minutes ago, Cipher said:

I guess that's part of what I was looking for more input on. I've read mixed reviews on those, and was under the impression that the Plutonia fan sequels weren't all necessarily the best continuation of its gameplay.

Well, you will never know if you never try them. Fan sequels will never be the same as classic iwads, but it's worth to give them  a fair chance before forming your opinion based on random reviews.

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Urania plays nothing like Plutonia. Scythe is punchy although the difficulty ramp kinda goes from one extreme to the other and the last two maps are pretty massive.

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32 minutes ago, Pegg said:

Pistol start TNT. 

Too real.

 

I should try to pistol-start all of Plutonia's maps at some point though. There's a string in the middle that don't feel like they were really balanced for continuous.

 

 

1 hour ago, Myst.Haruko said:

Well, you will never know if you never try them. Fan sequels will never be the same as classic iwads, but it's worth to give them  a fair chance before forming your opinion based on random reviews.

Oh, totally! I didn't mean to seem like I was coming down on those wads or their author's. Was just looking for a little input from more veteran players before diving into another 32-level wad.

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1 hour ago, Cipher said:

I should try to pistol-start all of Plutonia's maps at some point though.

 

It's all fun and games until MAP12 - Speed. Which is where I'm at, same task. Bizarrely enough, your pet caveat N.M.E is (as I found, when skipping ahead a bit) one of the easier ones.

 

Incidentally, anybody suggesting Perdition's Gate has got a great idea there. It's not comparable to Plutonia in challenge or atmosphere, but the map sizes are about right and, some presentation aside, feels like a better Final Doom 'partner' to Plutonia than TNT Evilution does IMO.

 

And the fan-sequels? Although many maps are non-Plutonic epic sprawling adventures, I'd recommend them for atmosphere alone; one area they occasionally outdo the original Plutonia with real flair. I love 'em both, as well as the original Plutonia.

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Chillax ,it's a really easy wad . I am sure you will have amazing fun playing it.

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I really liked plutonia for the exact same reasons as you and let me tell you that Plutonia 2 is definitively not what you're looking for. I don't know about the rest of recommendations in this threads so they could be useful to me too.

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I'll toss out Speed of Doom and Unholy Realms. Most of the maps are short-medium length and feature a lot of the Plutonia-inspired trap-based gameplay. But nothing beats the original Scythe for fast and fun IMO. The later maps should also be fine playing continuous, aside from 30 which is a hard one either way.

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Just now, Spectre01 said:

Unholy Realms.

 

Yes. After the early maps being kinda weak (sorry, but "box-shaped courtyard with surrounding elevated walkway" gets a bit old quick) it actually turns out to get amazing. A slow-burn recommend right there. <3

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Actually, I don't know what's interesting with Scythe 1...maybe because I haven't played that one completely...

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Anything that alters gameplay. So stuff like High Noon Drifter, Russian Overkill, maybe Brutal DOOM/Project Brutality if you feel like it.

 

I've played more gameplay mods than WADs, and had more fun. Maybe use ZDL so you can use mods and wads at the same time. That's what I can say.

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Thanks for the suggestions, everyone! I'll probably hop over to Scythe for my next Doom playthrough, maybe stopping at Perdition's Gate beforehand since it's short, then I'll dive into one of the Plutonia sequels after checking them out.

 

Noted on the Slayer recommendations, too.

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The CHORD series, at least from what I've played of them, seems to offer a tight, knockabout styled gameplay reminiscent of Plutonia. Small, though precarious encounters where each monster is significantly relevant as to their placement and levels that don't drag on for long. It's a step up in difficulty from Plutonia, though it's a cakewalk compared to something like Sunlust. 

 

 

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I'll definitely also recommend Speed of Doom. I myself really enjoy Plutonia, and I think Speed of Doom shares many qualities with Plutonia, eventhough it is very different as well.

 

All maps are short-to-medium length and can be maxed in under 10 minutes.

 

The aesthetic style is (at least in the first episode) very unique, with heavy use of the color green.

 

The mapset was created by two people (Joshy and Darkwave0000), with each their own style. They alternate slots, and the different styles gameplay each mapper provides ensure that you don't get tired quickly.

 

Some of the later maps are very hard, but it rarely feels unfair.

 

And like others have said, definitely check out Scythe, Perdition's Gate, and the fan-made sequels to Plutonia.

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On 2017/8/27 at 1:18 AM, Myst.Haruko said:

I guess, Urania

Urania is not "Plutonia + 1" difficulty to me though. Most of the maps are long and exhausting...

 

In my mind is Ancient Aliens. If you prefer a cleaner design, Scythe could be a very good choice. However, there are some "super long" maps in these mapsets.

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15 minutes ago, GarrettChan said:

Urania is not "Plutonia + 1" difficulty to me though. Most of the maps are long and exhausting...

 

In my mind is Ancient Aliens. If you prefer a cleaner design, Scythe could be a very good choice. However, there are some "super long" maps in these mapsets.

Well, it was just a suggestion. Valiant also fits here. 

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