Dimensions [/idgames]

[Killer5]

Hi. Here is my first release called 'Dimensions'. This wad contains 5 completely unrelated boom compatible maps designed to be played from a pistol start. Tested primarily in PrBoom+ cl9.

 

If you want to play in ZDoom I highly recommend turning infinite height off. Because these maps are primarily tested in PrBoom+ I don't have to deal with the insane flying monster physics in ZDoom based ports.

 

I have implemented all difficulties. Players, if they decide to give this wad a go, should follow this criteria when deciding which experience they would like:

HNTR: I dont play slaughter maps/I rarely play slaughter maps

HMP: I think slaughter maps are really fun but they aren't all I focus on

UV: I love going up against overwhelming odds, fighting tens (sometimes hundreds) of cybs/viles at a time, pain elemental swarms, Reality category of speedrunning.

 

idgames:

 

Old version (use for older crazydoomguy tas demos):

https://www.dropbox.com/s/drlvcrnfjm303gv/dimensions.zip?dl=0

 

Screens:

 

 

Edited September 8, 2017 by Killer5

[Nine Inch Heels]

Oh yeah... This is gonna keep me busy for a while. Lovely.

[Relinquished]

I'll definitely be giving this a go when I get some free time, probably over the weekend. I'll give some feedback after I've played through it. The screenshots look nice, I especially like the black and green room, very funky.

[Nate River]

Did a test run of all of the maps and while I'll need a bit more time to play it again and try all difficulties to judge the encounters, I found some minor technical stuff that I feel like is worth mentioning:

- First of all everything I saw was functional and I could finish all maps in GZDoom 3.1.0 without any performance issues

- Map31 and Map32 have the same name on the automap and on the intermission screen ("Bone-Nanza")

- While everything is functional, you are using a lot of lock-ins (which I like in general) and a good amount of them with a timer that sometimes seemed a bit lengthy. Though the actual problem for me was only really that I couldn't tell most of the time if the one I was in had a timer or if I needed to look for a small switch appearing somewhere to open the exit. These switches also often had a timer and so seemingly just appeared out of nowhere at a spot I already looked at before with nothing there. Comparing it to other WADs that also have a lot of (timed) lock-ins like Sunder the only thing I'm really missing here is something like a lowering pillar and ideally also the sound of it lowering so that it's obvious that if something moves / makes a sound, you just need to wait and otherwise look for a switch / exit to progress.

I guess this isn't much of a problem if you're going for 100% kills and stay in each area until everything dies and then go for the switches / exit or on repeated playthroughs when you already know how the maps work.

[Killer5]

@Nate River

Thanks for taking a peek. With regards to the map name issue I made a small typo in my mapinfo file.

 

I assume you are talking about map03 (map with most lock ins). Can you let me know what difficulty you played? If it is hntr/hmp I may change some of the timings because waiting for stuff to reveal its self/exit to appear is one of my pet peeves.

 

Thanks for playing. Hope you found something enjoyable here.

[GarrettChan]

Well, judging from the skill difference between you and me, I think this mapset is probably not for me, but I still decided to have a try because of the charming/attractive screenshots.

 

Yeah, Map01 down by scumbag saves. To be honest, I'm really proud of myself since this was considered unbeatable for me even with lots of saves.

Spoiler

 

One thing to say is that the Arch-viles can stuck together with other monsters. Because there is no Rocket Launcher in this map, Arch-viles on the floor are fine, but like this one on the top of a platform is really annoying due to tracers not being able to hit (hard). These 3 Arch-viles took me like 800 cells to kill. Probably a small block specifically for Arch-viles? I know you plan is for a group of Arch-viles creating a Necro-mato army, but it seems that doesn't always work well.

Spoiler

[Killer5]

@GarrettChan Nice completing it :D.

 

Actually the turret vile placement is me abusing the weaknesses of the bfg so the player hopefully cant just spam them down immediately. They are meant to be obnoxious.

 

Thanks for playing.

[Killer5]

@GarrettChan You don't HAVE to play UV either. I spent way more time testing hntr and hmp. UV is just something I made because my favorite thing is making absurd over the top stuff that is still beatable.

[Ribbiks]

9 minutes ago, Killer5 said:

@GarrettChan You don't HAVE to play UV either. I spent way more time testing hntr and hmp. UV is just something I made because my favorite thing is making absurd over the top stuff that is still beatable.

 

god speed, friend :D

[Nate River]

Yeah most of these situations were in Map03 but I also just tried Map02 again and on HNTR I can easily kill all enemies in the north-west fight before the platform with the Mancubi lowers and reveals the switches. On HMP it's close and on UV I was busy fighting the whole time so it worked just fine there.

But anyway I guess the main reason I noticed this whole thing was that I usually rather play for speed than for all kills so naturally I immediately start looking for ways to get me out of a lock-in as fast as possible and I like to leave monsters alive that don't seem like a real threat to me. So personally I always prefer switches that are just hard to get to rather than forced timers (even if it's impossible to kill everything before the exit opens).

 

Overall there are for sure good encounters and I found some enjoyable things in every map though I'm not a fan of platforming at all and those sections usually kill my motivation to try beating maps with them saveless.

So my favorite maps are for sure Map01 and Map31. When I play it again, I'll see if I can find a way to beat them faster which seemed problematic so far at least on UV but I guess that is intentional to promote max strategies over speed.

Anyway thanks for making these maps, maybe you can showcase them on your stream as well, I'd find that very interesting!

[Killer5]

Thanks for your comment @Nate River.

 

There are some things I'll definitely do differently next time. But I had gone into Map03 knowing I was going to be super controlling the entire time.

 

I'll definitely modify the timers. I was trying to 'predict' how long it would take players who don't normally play maps like these. I'll just go ahead and see how quickly I can beat the stuff on those difficulties and make it so that stuff appears immediately afterwards. Because yeah.. I really hate waiting for stuff and I don't want other people to have to deal with that stuff either.

 

Haha sorry you don't like the platforms. It was called the most obnoxious stuff ever by multiple people. But I'm weird :P.

 

Edit:

Also I played these maps so much that I really don't want to see them for a while :P. So streaming wont happen any time soon.

[GarrettChan]

@Killer5 Well, you can say playing on UV is my stubbornness and stupidity since Ribbiks said some similar things like "play on HMP" to Stardate series. I always hold the opinion of "only good players can make good crazy maps", so why not a try? Some rage is always fun XD

 

Map02 down, but those 4 Cyberdemons are out of question right now. Nice reference to Precarious, which I think is one of your favorite map (<-who would do a Reality run if you don't like it, right? ;P). I really like the atmosphere and the up-side-down design. To me, I would say if having something (e.g. a green torch replacing a red torch) to tell the player whether this part is done would be nicer. Also the up-side-down switch is kind of obscure to me, so I ended up walking that part twice.

 

Spoiler

Edited August 30, 2017 by GarrettChan

[Killer5]

@GarrettChan

That's cool man. My comment was primarily in response to you saying 'this wad is probably not for me'. My goal was to make it accessible to all sorts of people. Hntr should be fda friendly for everyone (for maps 01-03). If you are having fun on UV keep at it man.

[GarrettChan]

Just now, Killer5 said:

My comment was primarily in response to you saying 'this wad is probably not for me'.

Oh, that's my bad because I don't really know how to explain my mindset. Before even download the WAD, I know you would present something like Sunder, so the difficulty is totally within my expectations. However, I know my limit because I can't beat (or I haven't tried hard enough to now) most of the maps in Sunder (of course, one thing is that Sunder doesn't have difficulty settings), but I still wanted to improve my skills, or I don't believe I can't make any breakthrough, so this is it ;P

 

Definitely want to watch some stream from you about your own mapset in the future. I can wait.

[Nate River]

Fair enough then I'll wait for the stream.

Also yeah I don't see this working out for me to beat these maps fast unfortunately.

For Map01 after pressing the last switch it takes a whole ~160s until the way to the exit opens so I guess you really want the player to kill everything in the arena and not be able to rush from switch to switch, press the final one, grab the Invulnerability and blast through the enemies blocking the exit.

For Map31 it's relatively easy to rush to both keys and the key switches but then all the Revs come from both sides. I made it through them once and also survived the AV arena but when the gate to the main area opens again and almost everything there is still alive waiting in front of the gate and comes pouring in, I don't see myself surviving long enough until a gap to get out opens up.

Would be cool to see though if someone could do reasonably fast UV Speed runs for these maps.

 

Edit: To be fair, for something that was intentionally made to be "absurd over the top stuff that is still beatable" I can't really expect that strategies like these have to work out somehow so it's all fine. :D

Spoiler

Here's a lowly HNTR run with how I planned on playing Map01 after I first saw JohnSuitepee play it on stream and did my first test runs today. I really enjoy playing like that and maps that allow me to do it. On HMP I also consistently got to the last switch on the opposite side of the exit with this route but without the Invulnerability I didn't find a way how to get through all the monsters in front of the exit.

So I'll be happy with this and leave runs of the higher difficulties to actual speedrunners and people that like max runs more than I do. ;D

Map01 HNTR (1:50)

Edit: Same route, more risk, more speed, still good fun! :D Map01 HNTR (1:45)

 

Edited August 31, 2017 by Nate River : Additional info

[GarrettChan]

Spoiler

 

Map03 down. This is where the screenshot 3 is and I really like that design even though it's just for show. Interesting black and green overall theme design, with one red thing to be the secret switch (Thanks @Killer5for telling me).

 

The fights in non-mandatory areas are kind of ridiculous. The first one you have a really small arena with a bunch of monsters. Probably I should have finished the part with backpack first. I ended up with only 300 cells, but you definitely need more BFG shots than 7. The second secret fight is kind of a d!ck move, in my opinion, but hey, this is non-mandatory. You need eagle eyes to spot the rockets through the Cacodemon corpses... Actually I don't know why the exit doesn't lead to Map31, yet it doesn't really matter.

 

After the first 3 maps, I feel Dimensions are kind of like a mini-sequel to Sunder, and definitely there are similar feelings to Sunder maps. I guess you're the successor of Insane_Gazebo XD.

[Killer5]

Ah the secret final area. I had a lot of fun fighting the cybs there because really all I can make out most of the time were the frames of the cybs shooting (cacos block your view so much). So I had to have a mental picture of where all the rockets are in the arena. Basically I couldn't use my eyes. I havent really encountered something like that before (probably for obvious reasons :P).

 

It is good that you are thinking that you should have done the first secret fight last. That was kinda what I was going for there. But that fight is different slightly if you save it for later after the backpack. Alternatively I was able to leave there saving a shot of bfg for the rk fight. Which imo makes the bit with the revs/PEs much more doable.

 

Thanks for playing. And I'll change the secret exit to go to map31 in zdoom.

 

@Nate River

Glad you had a lot of fun with map01!

[Relinquished]

Well its the weekend, and I've given the first 3 maps some play. I really like the aesthetic choices across all 3 maps. The first map is a classic hell lava pit with tons of enemies coming in from all sides. I did this one on HMP and enjoyed it for the most part. Having to pick off some of the Arch-viles near the end of the map was a bit of a chore, but apart from this I enjoyed the map overall. I had one cool moment where I opened up the final exit area while the cyber's were pelting me with rockets, I dodged out of the way to watch the storm of rockets smack straight into the Arch-viles, so satisfying.

The second map is really cool, although I found it a little confusing to figure out where to go. The upside down scenery is a cool idea, though I got to a bit where I had to do tricky platforming while in this state. I would have persevered with it if it weren't for the lack of light on this section. I could barely see where I had to go, due to the position of the platforms and the fact its quite dark. I will give it another go when I have more time, as I like the music, the atmosphere of the level, and the first fight was fun.

Map 3 is definitely my favourite. I need to replay it to find all of the secret fights, but all the fights I did do were creative and got me thinking. The square sector fight with the Arch-Viles in the central pillbox was really interesting. I dropped down to HNTR for this one so I could get through it in a sensible time frame. I'll play it again on HMP and look for all the secrets. One small thing was the steep stairs to reach one of the areas could perhaps be highlighted a little more, as I initially didn't notice it. I've taken a screenshot of the stairs I mean.

I did Idclev to the secret maps just to take a look, but the difficulty levels go a little too high for me personally, and I prefer your first 3 maps that feel more crafted.

I don't have any criticisms that spring to mind to be honest. For your first release this is great stuff, and I'll be looking forward to future maps sets from you in the future. Your knowledge for how each of the monsters function shines through, and I'll be revisiting this when I get more time.         

[Killer5]

@Relinquished

Cool man thanks for the comments.

 

1. Those AVs are placed in order to be obnoxious to kill with bfg. There is still a quick-ish way to kill them. If you kill the northern most group first you can stand underneath the center group and hit them with bfg tracers. I really didn't want the player to be able to rush the viles straight away.

 

2. I wanted a lot of the challenge from this map to be the map its self. So the darkness is very deliberate. That platforming has been called the most obnoxious stuff ever since the beginning :P. So you are not alone.

 

3. I really don't like holding the player's hand too much if I can help it. I'm probably going to leave those stairs the way they are.

[CrazyDoomguy]

Need some TAS run? I can do it :)

[Killer5]

If you want to make demos that is fine because I feel weird making demos for my own stuff =x. Going through everything once more prior to idgames.

[CrazyDoomguy]

You can watch my demo here or at youtube. I did 1 and 2 map

 

 

[Killer5]

Cool demos. I am getting ready for idgames upload however =x. I'll leave the version currently in the op in case people want to watch your demos though.

 

Also.. those videos remind me that I need to recommend players use software.. these maps, ESPECIALLY map02, look bad imo in opengl.

[CrazyDoomguy]

On Map 3 There are 2 secrets. First Secret is for arriving on labyrinth-design room. Is this room just for looking room or had some sense for fight? Second secret room is probably for exit to the secret map. Need you fix this exit linedef tag from 54 to 124? Tag 54 is normal exit and tag 124 is exit on secret level.

[Killer5]

The first secret has a secret fight yeah.

 

In boom you cannot have a secret map exit on something other than map15 without more robust mapinfo implementation iirc (someone can correct me here if I am mistaken)?  Even if I could that second exit is just for fun. Not meant to go to map 31 or anything.

[Killer5]

Uploaded to idgames (link in op). Thanks to all who played and tested!

[CrazyDoomguy]

What different between old (Dropbox) and new WAD (idgames)? Something changes?

[Killer5]

@CrazyDoomguy

Sorry man been gone helping people in Port Aransas.

 

Your demos will desync if not made with the idgames version.

[bemused]

congrats on release :)

[Kaido]

Map 32  is too fucking hard to be attempted without TAS ,especially the yellow key area, I am in the brink of giving up .  

 

;(