Doom logic

[GarrettChan]

8 minutes ago, Da Werecat said:

It's the same in Quake with vores.

Oh yeah, I remember this being true though. The thing is just that most other monsters can't even hit themselves, so it's rather paid attention to I guess.

[Nine Inch Heels]

The thing in doom wrt rev rockets is that either there's other stuff around where you can rub the rocket off of you, or you have so many rockets at times that it's difficult to even keep track of what rocket came from where. I didn't believe that at first, either. I've been told about this a few months ago and I still didn't think it possible, but after looking for that specifically I was pretty stunned.

You can try that with all sorts of things in doom, when you have teleporters around, for example. Or when you run through your own rocket during a fence run or wall run. It's basically same "logic" behind these instances.

[Pegleg]

7 hours ago, Raido said:

1. the shotgun is a sniper rifle without a scope

2. Who knew bodies were made from metal?

3.Who in the hell exposed the icon of sins brain?

4. i know, i know... you could not aim up and down cuz of id tech 1 i know... but this is still a logic!

5. ID software, we already have all of the weapons you can just leave ammunition here instead of the guns...

 

1. Yay hitscanners! You can things at a ridiculous distance with absolutely no decrease in damage, as far as I can tell. Which would obviously not be the case with a real shotgun.

2. Quake 2 hadn't come around yet. Only then could you turn a dead body to meat and attract flies.

3. Wasn't there something about the Icon of Sin's job was to generate demons, which it did by projecting them from its brain? Therefore, it had an opening in its skull to allow the spawned demons to exit.

[Pegleg]

7 hours ago, Memfis said:

The third one is interesting. Why is Icon of Sin so vulnerable? And why is there a tall pillar conveniently placed right in front of it? I've never thought about this. Maybe it wants you to stop it?

Wow. This is perhaps some of the deepest thinking about the motivations of any monster in Doom. Now we just need to have the Icon of Sin lay down on a giant couch--which would, of course, be much easier with the Real Icon of Sin from Brutal Doom.

[leodoom85]

Doom logic.......hmmmmmmm

blood hurts by just touching it

[GarrettChan]

39 minutes ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

The thing in doom wrt rev rockets is that either there's other stuff around where you can rub the rocket off of you, or you have so many rockets at times that it's difficult to even keep track of what rocket came from where. I didn't believe that at first, either. I've been told about this a few months ago and I still didn't think it possible, but after looking for that specifically I was pretty stunned.

It would be very hilarious that one Revenant acts as a filter that it only lets one missile in one stack of missiles get through him... Or you think you correctly use a Revenant to block a stack of missiles but are killed by the one that gets through the "filter"...\

 

↑↑↑@leodoom85Nah, I guess there are differences between "green water" and "poison", "red water" and "blood", "yellow striped red water" and "lava", "brown water" and "muddy water (wait, why this hurts?)", "blue circle" and "blue circle that flashes", etc. ;P

[leodoom85]

Just now, GarrettChan said:

It would be very hilarious that one Revenant acts as a filter that it only lets one missile in one stack of missiles get through him... Or you think you correctly use a Revenant to block a stack of missiles but are killed by the one that gets through the "filter"...

Indeed. Sadly, those projectiles can't kill the revenant because of immunity to those rockets and the ability to pass through them -_-

[Da Werecat]

5 minutes ago, Pegleg said:

Now we just need to have the Icon of Sin lay down on a giant couch--which would, of course, be much easier with the Real Icon of Sin from Brutal Doom.

If you can't see the couch, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

I'm sure it was just cut-off due to the engine limitations.

[Pegleg]

7 hours ago, GhoulDesecrator said:

"Nobody understood him, so when in the bottom of the pits of despair, he ploted a plan to end his own life. There was only one being in existence capable of doing it, so he unleashed Hell on Earth and killed a certain rabbit..."

I was sitting here and I got to thinking about the Icon of Sin (original Doom 2 version). It's much more pronounced if you look at the sculpture made of it http://www.hitestudios.com/blog/icons-of-doom, but if you look at Icon of Sin, it almost looks tortured. As though there were some giant demon that was imprisoned behind this tech wall, with all sorts of cables and tubes and things providing sustenance and keeping it alive, and having had its skull torn open to expose its demon-generating brain. And so, it had little choice in the matter. Of course, this would imply that there is a more powerful denizen of Hell than the Icon of Sin.

 

Or maybe it was just old and tired and is being kept alive to do this one thing that it's good at--spawn demons from the darkest recesses of its own twisted mind.

[leodoom85]

10 minutes ago, Pegleg said:

Wow. This is perhaps some of the deepest thinking about the motivations of any monster in Doom. Now we just need to have the Icon of Sin lay down on a giant couch--which would, of course, be much easier with the Real Icon of Sin from Brutal Doom.

At least that thing is vulnerable for you to take out the IoS with a pistol...

XD

[Cruduxy Pegg]

Icon of sin can just spam cubes over the platform and doomguy can't do shit to it. But it doesn't because it isn't a jerk.

[Graf Zahl]

26 minutes ago, Pegleg said:

1. Yay hitscanners! You can things at a ridiculous distance with absolutely no decrease in damage, as far as I can tell. Which would obviously not be the case with a real shotgun.

 

The actual issue in the real world would be that projectiles are subject to gravity. So while each single shotgun pellet may just be as harmful if you discount the loss of velocity due to air friction, it'd never arrive at its destination but quite a bit closer to the ground.

[Nine Inch Heels]

6 minutes ago, GarrettChan said:

It would be very hilarious that one Revenant acts as a filter that it only lets one missile in one stack of missiles get through him... Or you think you correctly use a Revenant to block a stack of missiles but are killed by the one that gets through the "filter"...\

I died once because of this, which basically was the reason I stumbled upon this "logic". I was gonna let a final rev "tank" a stack of rockets for me before moving on. A couple rockets made it through, and I was like "WTF?!"

[leodoom85]

Just now, Nine Inch Heels said:

I died once because of this, which basically was the reason I stumbled upon this "logic". I was gonna let a final rev "tank" a stack of rockets for me before moving on. A couple rockets made it through, and I was like "WTF?!"

It also happened to me once but with only a couple of homing rockets...still the damage is massive

[reflex17]

A single guy can hold a super-weapon that clears rooms with one shot, but wearing armor with exposed arms and he's just fine, everything else exploded. Maybe the UAC was developing weapons that only worked on hellspawn, because they made the part of the portal, so that's why BFG only kills demons. It kills other players in deathmatch though hahaha. Gameplay balance is most important in Doom, just like Street Fighter or any other game. Imagining the backstory is part of good storytelling, like the crumbs in Hansel and Gretel. Or Hans and Greta Grosse if you prefer.

 

I always thought that the Icon of sin looked like something trapped, and Doom series has parallels with the Dvine Comedy intentionally, like the level in Doom 1 called Dis. The serious reason of who put it there is Adrian Carmack and the rest of the team lol. The whole game has steampunk elements with piping and wires and machines all over the place, here they imprison or keep the Icon alive. Maybe both. Looking back it seems like an attempt at a different type of end boss fight, compared to the ones you see in Wolf3d and the rest of Doom+Doom2, for example. 

 

Game logic is hilarious, hey look some meat on the ground, I'll just eat it and be completely healed!

 

[GarrettChan]

Talking about Revenants, I guess one of the reasons that people hate Revenants is the damage. I remembered there was a thread talking about how to balance Doom, and if you ask me, the only thing I would do is make Revenant missiles 8D8 instead of 10D8. However, that's a personal preference, not actually good. Another thing is that I always think Revenant is the reversed Hell Knight due to the damage.

[Ichor]

29 minutes ago, leodoom85 said:

Doom logic.......hmmmmmmm

blood hurts by just touching it

I like to think of that as boiling blood.

[leodoom85]

More of the damage dealt by them, it's the usage of the revs that people hate it...I guess

[reflex17]

Doomguy can fall from any height and yet when he lands in water or other liquid, barely any sound somehow, like a master ninja. 

[GarrettChan]

Just now, leodoom85 said:

More of the damage dealt by them, it's the usage of the revs that people hate it...I guess

Well, this is more like a subjective thing than objective thing in my opinion. (If I used those two words correctly.) Another example would be Chaingunners. For example, if you don't like Revenants/Chaingunners in a sniper position, it doesn't mean you hate these two, I guess.

[leodoom85]

Just now, GarrettChan said:

Well, this is more like a subjective thing than objective thing in my opinion. (If I used those two words correctly.) Another example would be Chaingunners. For example, if you don't like Revenants/Chaingunners in a sniper position, it doesn't mean you hate these two, I guess.

Yeah, that's true in a sense that mappers can't abuse it though. 

[EmotionalFelineinaMadstate]

Invisibility doesn't make you invisible, it just makes enemies more clumsy.

[leodoom85]

18 minutes ago, EmotionalFelineinaMadstate said:

Invisibility doesn't make you invisible, it just makes enemies more clumsy.

Except the revenants and archviles.....that couple will get you no matter what...

[GarrettChan]

15 minutes ago, leodoom85 said:

Except the revenants and archviles.....that couple will get you no matter what...

Normal Revenant missiles are still fired towards random direction, but if a Revenant fires a homing missile, it will actually 100% turn towards you and fire. It's a very interesting "design". On the other hand, Arch-viles usually dance around, but no matter which way they face, they can burn you anyway.

[Nine Inch Heels]

41 minutes ago, EmotionalFelineinaMadstate said:

Invisibility doesn't make you invisible, it just makes enemies more clumsy.

In many cases it makes monsters more dangerous, because instead of simply dodging everything "proactively", you have to look at trajectories before making a call as to where it's best to dodge.

[Lila Feuer]

Works best against hitscanners, otherwise projectile monsters force you to hold your ground, only moving when it is heading towards you.

[reflex17]

Interesting thing, given the original intended power, which is to obviously to make the player more difficult to target. As you get more precise with movements/strafing and anticipating the projectiles, when you have the partial it almost seems like the enemy is leading their shots to better hit you sometimes lol. Standing still almost becomes then the best tactic given a single enemy, which is counterintuitive. Yeah exactly, long runs across the open vs. lots of hitscans partial is really good so it can come down to the context placement of the powerup in the map. 

 

[Deleted_Account]

Who the heck puts body armor on top of a pillar that can only be lowered by pressing a switch on the other end of the facility? Same goes for keycards. If you really wanted you could just grab a ladder.

[Death Destroyer - 4.7m4d]

Reloading a supershotgun with 0 ammo 

makes sense....

[leodoom85]

1 hour ago, Piper Maru said:

you could just grab a ladder

Doomguy sucks at climbing, we all know that